How to find the commons.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by jayshum

When you offered to trade him a lower grade card for his higher grade card, was it straight up or did you also offer cash along with the lower grade card?

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

It never got that far becausehe stopped responding, but yes I would have included cash. His end was all about keeping the set, not about the grade or at least that wasn't the impression I got from him.

So you did NOT actually offer cash alongside the card, because he stopped responding after you offered a lower grade copy.

Now it makes sense why this relevant fact wasn't part of the original telling

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by G1911

A highly pertinent fact mysteriously and strangely kept out until right now! It is my acumen at math, of course, that should allow me to divine information you didn't disclose, say, or hint at it while repeatedly talking about trading a lower grade card for a higher one! I cannot imagine why you are having problems making deals with people.

It wasn't left out or asked before you're personal attack towards me. The person could very well be a poster here and I'm not going to give the email out word for word. It ended without a response from the other party, and that's where it stayed.

My first response was will you sell, his was I don't want to break the set, my next was how about a lower grade card to keep your set complete and nothing after. Both cash and card from my end for his card.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by G1911

So you did NOT actually offer cash alongside the card, because he stopped responding after you offered a lower grade copy.

Now it makes sense why this relevant fact wasn't part of the original telling

Yes cash and card were offered. You're relevant fact conspiracy gotcha is just that. I offered cash then a card to help what he wanted. A complete set.

[jayshum]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

It never got that far becausehe stopped responding, but yes I would have included cash. His end was all about keeping the set, not about the grade or at least that wasn't the impression I got from him.

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

It wasn't left out or asked before you're personal attack towards me. The person could very well be a poster here and I'm not going to give the email out word for word. It ended without a response from the other party, and that's where it stayed.

My first response was will you sell, his was I don't want to break the set, my next was how about a lower grade card to keep your set complete and nothing after. Both cash and card from my end for his card.

It sounds like you never made it clear to him that you were offering cash and the lower grade card. Even though he stopped responding, maybe send him another email making that clear and saying how much cash you're willing to include and see if that gets a response.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

It wasn't left out or asked before you're personal attack towards me. The person could very well be a poster here and I'm not going to give the email out word for word. It ended without a response from the other party, and that's where it stayed.

My first response was will you sell, his was I don't want to break the set, my next was how about a lower grade card to keep your set complete and nothing after. Both cash and card from my end for his card.

If you want to bitch at personal attacks, go read your posts about me lol. Looks like I was indeed correct, you're telling different versions to different comments. This isn't the bullshit of "card and cash" that I was supposed to magically divine (which somehow equals math) just a few posts ago. In this version of cash OR card you offered cash, he rejected, you then offered instead a lower grade copy of the same card and he ignored you, probably for the obvious reason that that is a rip off.

Whatever the actual truth is or which of your disparate stories is true, you are not going to close many deals this way. Collectors or types of them are not "bad for the hobby" because they do not serve your personal interests. Your personal interests are special to you and only you, not to anyone else. They have absolutely nothing to do with "the hobby".

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by G1911

If you want to bitch at personal attacks, go read your posts about me lol. Looks like I was indeed correct, you're telling different versions to different comments. This isn't the bullshit of "card and cash" that I was supposed to magically divine (which somehow equals math) just a few posts ago. In this version of cash OR card you offered cash, he rejected, you then offered instead a lower grade copy of the same card and he ignored you, probably for the obvious reason that that is a rip off.

Whatever the actual truth is or which of your disparate stories is true, you are not going to close many deals this way. Collectors or types of them are not "bad for the hobby" because they do not serve your personal interests. Your personal interests are special to you and only you, not to anyone else. They have absolutely nothing to do with "the hobby".

Are you spending 50% of your time crying? I'll clue you in on the first response talking about a transaction. Notice a funny thing about won't sell and then offered a lower grade card. When you sell or buy something doesthat typically include currency?

For me I just inquired about a card that a set collector has. No dice won't sell. Took a decade to get the complete set. Doesn't really care about the players in the set, just that it's complete. I even offered to trade him a lower grade for what he had, and no more response. Still a complete set for him. I'm a single player collector, and I just want to get the best I can since there's very few cards for me to collect. It has personal value to me for multiple reasons.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

Are you spending 50% of your time crying? I'll clue you in on the first response talking about a transaction. Notice a funny thing about won't sell and then offered a lower grade card. When you sell or buy something doesthat typically include currency?

For me I just inquired about a card that a set collector has. No dice won't sell[/B]. Took a decade to get the complete set. Doesn't really care about the players in the set, just that it's complete. I even offered to trade him a lower grade for what he had, and no more response. Still a complete set for him. I'm a single player collector, and I just want to get the best I can since there's very few cards for me to collect. It has personal value to me for multiple reasons.

Cash AND card is very different from Cash OR card. A few posts ago it was AND. Last post it was OR. Maybe you should examine your own abilities here. One post you are emphatically not a collector, the next you are back to bemoaning there are not many cards for you to collect. Cards have value to a lot of us for many reasons. You are not special, regardless of how much you think you are. Other people, especially those you don't know, don't put your 'special' interests over their own. The hobby and your personal interests are completely different things. If you don't like that fact, tough shit lol. You are only the main character of your narrative, just like the rest of us.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by G1911

Cash AND card is very different from Cash OR card. A few posts ago it was AND. Last post it was OR. Maybe you should examine your own abilities here. One post you are emphatically not a collector, the next you are back to bemoaning there are not many cards for you to collect. Cards have value to a lot of us for many reasons. You are not special, regardless of how much you think you are. Other people, especially those you don't know, don't put your 'special' interests over their own. The hobby and your personal interests are completely different things. If you don't like that fact, tough shit lol. You are only the main character of your narrative, just like the rest of us.

Again, it was sell and sweetened with card after he said he didn't want to break the set. It didn't go from cash to lower grade card. I've never claimed my interest or the so called being special (your summarization of me) trumps others that's your unicorn, nor do I try to play that with anyone. If they ask why my interest or want my back story then I'll include that. I already stated that as well. If you think my interest isn't more then yours for the three I listed I don't really care about you're opinion. I'm sure if you had players in your bloodline you may see my view differently.

Here's the truth. Most people don't care about the players they collect. They care about completing a set. It doesn't matter who's in it. I don't care about set's I care about 3 people that have meaning beyond a collection. It's not a collection to me. It's extremely challenging to find items this rare. Another poster summed it up very well. The HOFers are easy compared to finding the common players. Every auction has HOFer cards as long as you have the cash. When you're looking for obscure players with very low registry and pop numbers that's my world. I've exhausted about every known card that I can contact the owner. I've been trying to find items since I joined and I haven't gotten any cards from here yet, but I'll keep trying.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

Again, it was sell and sweetened with card after he said he didn't want to break the set. It didn't go from cash to lower grade card. I've never claimed my interest or the so called being special (your summarization of me) trumps others that's your unicorn, nor do I try to play that with anyone. If they ask why my interest or want my back story then I'll include that. I already stated that as well. If you think my interest isn't more then yours for the three I listed I don't really care about you're opinion. I'm sure if you had players in your bloodline you may see my view differently.

Here's the truth. Most people don't care about the players they collect. They care about completing a set. It doesn't matter who's in it. I don't care about set's I care about 3 people that have meaning beyond a collection. It's not a collection to me. It's extremely challenging to find items this rare. Another poster summed it up very well. The HOFers are easy compared to finding the common players. Every auction has HOFer cards as long as you have the cash. When you're looking for obscure players with very low registry and pop numbers that's my world. I've exhausted about every known card that I can contact the owner. I've been trying to find items since I joined and I haven't gotten any cards from here yet, but I'll keep trying.

It's really difficult to figure out what's true and not because the story keeps changing. In your last version here, it was CASH, then it was CARD. Not both. Your original version only discussed card.

You are somehow not collecting or building a collection, but you are a collector looking to collect. You insist you aren't collecting, then you are. It's really hard to keep up with your bullshit because you keep contradicting yourself on even the most basic things.

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

It's not a collection.

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

It's not collecting.

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

I'm a single player collector, and I just want to get the best I can since there's very few cards for me to collect.

You have, several times, insisted on the superiority of your collecting or whatever-you-want-call-it-this-post. Hell, we can just look at the top. You made a thread asking what the worst type of collectors are because a set collector didn't give you a card you feel entitled to and you want to whine about collectors, which you both are and are not yourself depending on which post it is. Your answer was collectors that don't sell (meaning, of course, this guy to you). Because somehow, your collecting is more important than the set collectors who is apparently not looking to downgrade.

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

What about ones that don't care, and won't sell? This kind of reminds me of another hobby I had. Vintage cars. People would let em rot in the ground, and wouldn't sell. I just don't get that line of thinking.

You made a whole thread because you are salty a collector didn't accept your offer, which may be cash, card, or both depending on which post is actually true, if any of them.

I can't imagine why you aren't getting cards from here, but good luck in your collecting or not-collecting or whatever. I'm sure making threads bitching people didn't swap a nicer card for a lesser one will help your quest.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

It never got that far because he stopped responding, but yes I would have included cash. His end was all about keeping the set, not about the grade or at least that wasn't the impression I got from him. I'll clarify by saying I did offer cash, but it never got to an amount because he stopped the conversation.

In the USA, people are allowed to own private property. He can refuse any offer for any reason without explaining anything.

You seem to think you have a better understanding of his collection, and what matters to him (just having the set complete with some cards in lower grade) than he himself does. You don't - he gets to collect as he chooses.

He said no thanks. That's his right, and he's not being unreasonable. If you want to obtain cards, it's a better plan to find people who want to sell, rather than complain because you can't pry a card out of someone's collection who doesn't want to trade/sell.

[OhioLawyerF5]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

Yes cash and card were offered. You're relevant fact conspiracy gotcha is just that. I offered cash then a card to help what he wanted. A complete set.

The offer is irrelevant. You could have offered a million dollars, and there is nothing wrong with the collector declining and keeping his card. You have no right to it in the slightest, and it doesn't hurt the hobby that he doesn't want to sell. Call people stupid all you want. It's clear here who that applies to.

[tiger8mush]

If you share with us the card(s) you are looking for, perhaps a fellow board member has one available in the grade you are looking for?

[carlsonjok]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

Everything I find will be donated to the town in which the player(s) came from. I have 2 players to find items for Jerry Mehlisch, Verne Clemons and non player owner Jim Dunn. They all came from the small town of Clemons Iowa. Same town I'm from. I can guarantee my desire far outweighs any guy just trying to get a complete set. All 3 are distant relatives as well.

It is unusual to find such unanimity on this board. That folks are universally telling you that you are in the wrong ought to give you pause, but you plow ahead nonetheless. I agree with them and won't belabor that point.

But, I am going to point something out. While you state you are a single player collector, you also state that the items will be donated to the town of Clemons, a booming metropolis of 140 people. Presumably this will happen upon your death? Or not? If so, exactly how old are you? A 25 year old promising to donate material is far different than an 85 year old. Either way, you might want to consider that donating materials to a town of 140 may actually be a pretty poor means of historical preservation.

Don't believe me? Take 90 minutes and drive down to Van Meter ( pop. 1484) and visit the Bob Feller Museum. Wait. You can't. It closed and the building is now the Van Meter townhall with only some of the material preserved and on display. If a town 10 times the size of Clemons can't support a museum for an all time great, how does that bode for your Clemons collection?

[Vintagedeputy]

Reading this thread is 10 minutes of my life that I'll never get back again.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by Vintagedeputy

Reading this thread is 10 minutes of my life that I'll never get back again.

Lucky for you, we only got about halfway down page #2 before we gave up.

[Vintagedeputy]

Originally Posted by raulus

Lucky for you, we only got about halfway down page #2 before we gave up.

I read quickly.....unfortunately in this case.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by tiger8mush

If you share with us the card(s) you are looking for, perhaps a fellow board member has one available in the grade you are looking for?

Anything Verne or Vern Clemons. I have 2 - 1923 Willard Chocolates V100 PSA 5.5 and a 5. I also have a raw 1922 W573 strip card. The colgan's and Curtis Ireland will probably never be had. I need a E120 V61 type 1 and 2. I think that's all he had. I buy anything related.

For Jerry Mehlisch he has 1 card, and it was made in 1953 for the Fargo Moorhead Twins. Jerry had the card and he was kind enough to give me a photo of it so. I could try to locate one. I buy anything related. I also buy anything Clemons Iowa related. I'll share a few photos of items I have found.

[Vintage Vern]

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[Vintage Vern]

Screenshot_20220420-190717_eBay.jpg

[Vintage Vern]

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[Vintage Vern]

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[Vintage Vern]

IMG_7152.jpg

[Vintage Vern]

That's some of the baseball items I've found and purchased.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by G1911

It's really difficult to figure out what's true and not because the story keeps changing. In your last version here, it was CASH, then it was CARD. Not both. Your original version only discussed card.

You are somehow not collecting or building a collection, but you are a collector looking to collect. You insist you aren't collecting, then you are. It's really hard to keep up with your bullshit because you keep contradicting yourself on even the most basic things.








You have, several times, insisted on the superiority of your collecting or whatever-you-want-call-it-this-post. Hell, we can just look at the top. You made a thread asking what the worst type of collectors are because a set collector didn't give you a card you feel entitled to and you want to whine about collectors, which you both are and are not yourself depending on which post it is. Your answer was collectors that don't sell (meaning, of course, this guy to you). Because somehow, your collecting is more important than the set collectors who is apparently not looking to downgrade.

You made a whole thread because you are salty a collector didn't accept your offer, which may be cash, card, or both depending on which post is actually true, if any of them.

I can't imagine why you aren't getting cards from here, but good luck in your collecting or not-collecting or whatever. I'm sure making threads bitching people didn't swap a nicer card for a lesser one will help your quest.

I was going to let this go, and let it die, but I need to help your difficulties of understanding something very simple. My stance has never changed which you keep claiming as fact.

Again I'll try to slow things down so you can comprehend.

The deal started as do you want to sell the card.

Definition of sell
give or hand over (something) in exchange for money.

His response back was no thanks I don't want to break a set.

My 2nd and last response was I'll include a lower grade card so you will still have s full set in which he didn't respond, at which point I didn't bother him any further. Pretty damn simple. Your mountain, meet molehill.

It was a transaction attempt I'd imagine many people here have done. That was if you care to read my initial post. You just chose to read it incorrectly or couldn't grasp what was said. Since it's still ongoing I'd say both are true

I'm collecting in the sense to give, not a collection for myself. Lables are used, so I attached that label to identify myself as a single player collector for my second question of my original post.

I don't think I was being salty, I was simply discussing an attempt to get a card.

The second question was honestly just a question asked, because I'm not a card collector. I just thought it was a harmless question that must have struck a nerve of some folks.

I just wanted to understand the hobby more. Its actually amazing to me some of the stupid response I got. Like I don't understand it's not my card or that I can't make a person sell it or that my priority trumps someone else's.

The card holder shouldn't have just said, I don't want to break the set, sid not for sale. That would have been the end. I would have said, well if you ever want to sell let me know. I wasn't being a jerk many have painted me out to be.

If you want to label me a collector it's of anything relevant to Clemons. I'd label myself as a preservationist. The bullshit is on your end, and I'm sorry you can't grasp this.

This illusion of yours, and others thinking "my superiority of collecting " is pure idiocy. I take it your a set collector, and got all steamed, and couldn't see straight past that initial take. Again, it wasn't to point a finger at any type of collector. I simply stated what happened in a transaction, and then I thought to add the second question, and it had no relevance to my first question. Maybe I should have just made two separate posts.

People are acting like I'm trying to strong arm people to sell me something. Ask anyone I have delt with, and they can tell you I'm nothing like that.

I'm not getting cards, because they're very few to get. That's why I tried to ask a person if they would sell. I don't have many options. Its not a money thing like trying to buy a HOFer it's a population thing. I'm dealing in less the 10 known cards or less recognized. Most are under 5. The E120 has the most. I haven't checked between all the registries. I've been here for multiple years trying to find things. The reality is the items I'm searching for aren't a common want.

Actually, I made a thread you ignored the main ask. Just so you understand the set collector was just part of a discussion not to point blame. If that's the case I also blamed myself. The irony!

[ronniehatesjazz]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

I was going to let this go, and let it die, but I need to help your difficulties of understanding something very simple. My stance has never changed which you keep claiming as fact.

Haha! Were you stewing about this all weekend and just couldn't let it go? Dude you are such a Karen.

[Vintage Vern]

Since this is a sports card sight and I have respect for Leon, I will just post a few pictures of items I have hmmm "collected".

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[Vintage Vern]

Screenshot_20230320_081131_eBay.jpg

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

I was going to let this go, and let it die, but I need to help your difficulties of understanding something very simple. My stance has never changed which you keep claiming as fact.

Again I'll try to slow things down so you can comprehend.

The deal started as do you want to sell the card.

Definition of sell
give or hand over (something) in exchange for money.

His response back was no thanks I don't want to break a set.

My 2nd and last response was I'll include a lower grade card so you will still have s full set in which he didn't respond, at which point I didn't bother him any further. Pretty damn simple. Your mountain, meet molehill.

It was a transaction attempt I'd imagine many people here have done. That was if you care to read my initial post. You just chose to read it incorrectly or couldn't grasp what was said. Since it's still ongoing I'd say both are true

I'm collecting in the sense to give, not a collection for myself. Lables are used, so I attached that label to identify myself as a single player collector for my second question of my original post.

I don't think I was being salty, I was simply discussing an attempt to get a card.

The second question was honestly just a question asked, because I'm not a card collector. I just thought it was a harmless question that must have struck a nerve of some folks.

I just wanted to understand the hobby more. Its actually amazing to me some of the stupid response I got. Like I don't understand it's not my card or that I can't make a person sell it or that my priority trumps someone else's.

The card holder shouldn't have just said, I don't want to break the set, sid not for sale. That would have been the end. I would have said, well if you ever want to sell let me know. I wasn't being a jerk many have painted me out to be.

If you want to label me a collector it's of anything relevant to Clemons. I'd label myself as a preservationist. The bullshit is on your end, and I'm sorry you can't grasp this.

This illusion of yours, and others thinking "my superiority of collecting " is pure idiocy. I take it your a set collector, and got all steamed, and couldn't see straight past that initial take. Again, it wasn't to point a finger at any type of collector. I simply stated what happened in a transaction, and then I thought to add the second question, and it had no relevance to my first question. Maybe I should have just made two separate posts.

People are acting like I'm trying to strong arm people to sell me something. Ask anyone I have delt with, and they can tell you I'm nothing like that.

I'm not getting cards, because they're very few to get. That's why I tried to ask a person if they would sell. I don't have many options. Its not a money thing like trying to buy a HOFer it's a population thing. I'm dealing in less the 10 known cards or less recognized. Most are under 5. The E120 has the most. I haven't checked between all the registries. I've been here for multiple years trying to find things. The reality is the items I'm searching for aren't a common want.

Actually, I made a thread you ignored the main ask. Just so you understand the set collector was just part of a discussion not to point blame. If that's the case I also blamed myself. The irony!

This is to prove you aren't salty and that I'm an idiot because you insist on not being a collector and also being a collector and that actually makes perfect sense. All your direct contradictions actually aren't. Mhm. Go touch grass.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by G1911

This is to prove you aren't salty and that I'm an idiot because you insist on not being a collector and also being a collector and that actually makes perfect sense. All your direct contradictions actually aren't. Mhm. Go touch grass.

Why do you use words that you don't have understanding of to label people?

preservationist vs a collector. Maybe if you understand the difference it will set you free, but I'm not counting on it. I'm not looking for monetary gain or something having intrinsic value. There's several of us trying to keep the historic value of our town alive. There's no financial aspect or gain for those doing so. Keep grasping for that last blade of grass!

[Vintage Vern]

Every thread needs a card!

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[G1911]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

Why do you use words that you don't have understanding of to label people?

preservationist vs a collector. Maybe if you understand the difference it will set you free, but I'm not counting on it. I'm not looking for monetary gain or something having intrinsic value. There's several of us trying to keep the historic value of our town alive. There's no financial aspect or gain for those doing so. Keep grasping for that last blade of grass!

You used collecting/collection/collector to describe yourself and your activities, while also insisting it’s wrong. I didn’t label you, you did. Read the transcript, , I even quoted you doing it several times. Or better yet, go touch grass. This is the most bitching anyone has ever done over their shitty offer getting rejected. This is pathetic lol.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by ronniehatesjazz

Haha! Were you stewing about this all weekend and just couldn't let it go? Dude you are such a Karen.

Nah, I had more important things going on. I know I'm a Karen and a snowflake and a great son who was taking care of his mother that fell and broke her jaw.

I actually shouldn't post a picture, but I guess maybe it will make you feel good about yourself? Hope you feel like an asshole, but I doubt you will. Have a great weekend!
Screenshot_20240725_140527_Snapchat.jpg

[ronniehatesjazz]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

Nah, I had more important things going on. I know I'm a Karen and a snowflake and a great son who was taking care of his mother that fell and broke her jaw.

I actually shouldn't post a picture, but I guess maybe it will make you feel good about yourself? Hope you feel like an asshole, but I doubt you will. Have a great weekend!
Attachment 649779

I'm glad your mother is okay and you're taking care of her, but what in the world does that have to do with baseball cards and your behavior towards the hobby lol? You're an oddball man.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by G1911

You used collecting/collection/collector to describe yourself and your activities, while also insisting it’s wrong. I didn’t label you, you did. Read the transcript, , I even quoted you doing it several times. Or better yet, go touch grass. This is the most bitching anyone has ever done over their shitty offer getting rejected. This is pathetic lol.

And I already explained as much more than once. You have an issue with trying to paint your own picture instead of listening to what someone stated. How many posts have you made, and yet you still haven't even touched the question posed.

Nah its your bitching about something you misrepresented, and can't let go lof it.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by ronniehatesjazz

I'm glad your mother is okay and you're taking care of her, but what in the world does that have to do with baseball cards and your behavior towards the hobby lol? You're an oddball man.

It had to do with some asshat being an ass to another person for no reason, and having to explain himself with no out for the other person who is still trying to find a way out. What is my behavior towards the hobby? Good luck explaining it.

[OhioLawyerF5]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

I was going to let this go, and let it die, but I need to help your difficulties of understanding something very simple. My stance has never changed which you keep claiming as fact.

Again I'll try to slow things down so you can comprehend.

The deal started as do you want to sell the card.

Definition of sell
give or hand over (something) in exchange for money.

His response back was no thanks I don't want to break a set.

My 2nd and last response was I'll include a lower grade card so you will still have s full set in which he didn't respond, at which point I didn't bother him any further. Pretty damn simple. Your mountain, meet molehill.

It was a transaction attempt I'd imagine many people here have done. That was if you care to read my initial post. You just chose to read it incorrectly or couldn't grasp what was said. Since it's still ongoing I'd say both are true

I'm collecting in the sense to give, not a collection for myself. Lables are used, so I attached that label to identify myself as a single player collector for my second question of my original post.

I don't think I was being salty, I was simply discussing an attempt to get a card.

The second question was honestly just a question asked, because I'm not a card collector. I just thought it was a harmless question that must have struck a nerve of some folks.

I just wanted to understand the hobby more. Its actually amazing to me some of the stupid response I got. Like I don't understand it's not my card or that I can't make a person sell it or that my priority trumps someone else's.

The card holder shouldn't have just said, I don't want to break the set, sid not for sale. That would have been the end. I would have said, well if you ever want to sell let me know. I wasn't being a jerk many have painted me out to be.

If you want to label me a collector it's of anything relevant to Clemons. I'd label myself as a preservationist. The bullshit is on your end, and I'm sorry you can't grasp this.

This illusion of yours, and others thinking "my superiority of collecting " is pure idiocy. I take it your a set collector, and got all steamed, and couldn't see straight past that initial take. Again, it wasn't to point a finger at any type of collector. I simply stated what happened in a transaction, and then I thought to add the second question, and it had no relevance to my first question. Maybe I should have just made two separate posts.

People are acting like I'm trying to strong arm people to sell me something. Ask anyone I have delt with, and they can tell you I'm nothing like that.

I'm not getting cards, because they're very few to get. That's why I tried to ask a person if they would sell. I don't have many options. Its not a money thing like trying to buy a HOFer it's a population thing. I'm dealing in less the 10 known cards or less recognized. Most are under 5. The E120 has the most. I haven't checked between all the registries. I've been here for multiple years trying to find things. The reality is the items I'm searching for aren't a common want.

Actually, I made a thread you ignored the main ask. Just so you understand the set collector was just part of a discussion not to point blame. If that's the case I also blamed myself. The irony!

You clearly need to reread what you've posted in this thread. And don't stop at the first post. You have absolutely acted like your right to a card is better than someone else's.

[BioCRN]

I spent about 2 weeks in Clemons, Iowa years ago doing corn things...as one does in Iowa.

You don't see towns like this on the East Coast where even small towns are a bit more populated and very close to other smaller towns. It's weird to me to see a small town pop up out of the middle of nowhere...even weirder when the small town doesn't have a lot of anything in it (gas/grocery place, restaurant(s), etc).

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by carlsonjok

It is unusual to find such unanimity on this board. That folks are universally telling you that you are in the wrong ought to give you pause, but you plow ahead nonetheless. I agree with them and won't belabor that point.

But, I am going to point something out. While you state you are a single player collector, you also state that the items will be donated to the town of Clemons, a booming metropolis of 140 people. Presumably this will happen upon your death? Or not? If so, exactly how old are you? A 25 year old promising to donate material is far different than an 85 year old. Either way, you might want to consider that donating materials to a town of 140 may actually be a pretty poor means of historical preservation.

Don't believe me? Take 90 minutes and drive down to Van Meter ( pop. 1484) and visit the Bob Feller Museum. Wait. You can't. It closed and the building is now the Van Meter townhall with only some of the material preserved and on display. If a town 10 times the size of Clemons can't support a museum for an all time great, how does that bode for your Clemons collection?

Again, I'm not a single player collector that'sthe label I used to describe myself for others to recognize or connect with . I named the 3 individuals that I look for, Only 1 has cards from the pro level in Verne Clemons. The other Jerry Mehlisch has 1 card released in 1953 when he played for the Fargo Moorhead Twins. Dunn was the owner of the Cleveland Indians. There's many more individuals that I try to find items for, but they're not for here to discuss.

Bob Feller is a totally different situation. That was a money grab that disappeared once he died. This isn't for money making, it's for preserving our small towns history.

I'm trying to keep all my items in our small town, but not sure we can build and house all that is needed. I come from a small town that is part of a larger county, and I do have another option with a historical society in a larger city. I just want to give our small town the first shot. Some items have already left for the larger viewing. I just don't think it has the same meaning. Adrian "Cap" Anson is the king there. Many of the items I was given from Jerry before he passed were discussed and he was OK with both options. I'm also going to try to get an article in the local paper digging back into the 40s and 50s for the Clemons 9 baseball team and in the pre 1920s and early 1920s for Verne. I want to get in touch with as many families as I can before I start with that project. Both to get permission and storied facts and see if they have anything to offer of their family member they'd like to group together for people to view. The paper had an archive we can pull from as well. None of what I'm doing is for personal or monetary gain. It's not just me, but a group effort. We just lost one of the last town elders, and she had vast knowledge from the 30s forward. We have one last older gent that is also donating lots of historical items. There's great pride in these small dying towns. Have you ever eaten at a DQ aka Dairy Queen? The co-founder was from here originally. Dick "Sherb" Noble. This town has had a lot of people that did great things for its size.

You're a collector of baseball, I'm a so called "collector" of this towns history which happens to include some baseball talents. I'm preserving not collecting.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by OhioLawyerF5

You clearly need to reread what you've posted in this thread. And don't stop at the first post. You have absolutely acted like your right to a card is better than someone else's.

That's your interpretation. Don't even try to tell me what I am or what I'm not doing. You haven't a clue, and it’s on full display!

What I said was a person that is just collecting to get a set doesn't care what or who is in that set, just to get it completed. That’s just a fact.

You would still collect a set if Verne wasn't part of it, correct? The only reason you'd even care to have his card was if he were in the set. Don't lie to me or yourself. That's the only reason for most set collectors. That's not a bad thing, just reality

The other type collector would be a team collector. Some may have more interest in common players most are probably like set collectors, and just want them for that reason.

The only reason I want them is because it has personal value outside of collecting for baseball. 1st he has family DNA and also where I live his family started the town of Clemons Grove. His grandfather William Clemons was the founder. That's my want for them.

So yes if you want to know if I feel I have more interest in them then many I'd say yes, absolutely. That's where it would end. I don't think I'm entitled to anything nor have I applied that. That's you not me that thinks that.

This is what you're interpretation is if you want me to spitball for your thoughts. You've put words in my mouth so I'll do so for you.

You feel I think I'm more entitled to it because hear me out. I tried to offer him money then offer a card on top of that, because he implied he didn't want to break up a set. My sole intention was to keep him having a full set, and me getting a card I wanted. That’s it! Period. Anything else was idiocy thrown my way. I tried to make a deal that would work for both parties. This entire thing blew up because of some thin skinned set collectors that ignored the true question asked of how to find the Verne Clemons of the world. You like many others blew right past the main question and got butt hurt.

[OhioLawyerF5]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

Again, I'm not a single player collector that'sthe label I used to describe myself for others to recognize or connect with . I named the 3 individuals that I look for, Only 1 has cards from the pro level in Verne Clemons. The other Jerry Mehlisch has 1 card released in 1953 when he played for the Fargo Moorhead Twins. Dunn was the owner of the Cleveland Indians. There's many more individuals that I try to find items for, but they're not for here to discuss.



Bob Feller is a totally different situation. That was a money grab that disappeared once he died. This isn't for money making, it's for preserving our small towns history.



I'm trying to keep all my items in our small town, but not sure we can build and house all that is needed. I come from a small town that is part of a larger county, and I do have another option with a historical society in a larger city. I just want to give our small town the first shot. Some items have already left for the larger viewing. I just don't think it has the same meaning. Adrian "Cap" Anson is the king there. Many of the items I was given from Jerry before he passed were discussed and he was OK with both options. I'm also going to try to get an article in the local paper digging back into the 40s and 50s for the Clemons 9 baseball team and in the pre 1920s and early 1920s for Verne. I want to get in touch with as many families as I can before I start with that project. Both to get permission and storied facts and see if they have anything to offer of their family member they'd like to group together for people to view. The paper had an archive we can pull from as well. None of what I'm doing is for personal or monetary gain. It's not just me, but a group effort. We just lost one of the last town elders, and she had vast knowledge from the 30s forward. We have one last older gent that is also donating lots of historical items. There's great pride in these small dying towns. Have you ever eaten at a DQ aka Dairy Queen? The co-founder was from here originally. Dick "Sherb" Noble. This town has had a lot of people that did great things for its size.



You're a collector of baseball, I'm a so called "collector" of this towns history which happens to include some baseball talents. I'm preserving not collecting.

Collectors like us are also curating history and preserving it.

[OhioLawyerF5]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

That's your interpretation. Don't even try to tell me what I am or what I'm not doing. You haven't a clue, and it’s on full display!

What I said was a person that is just collecting to get a set doesn't care what or who is in that set, just to get it completed. That’s just a fact.

You would still collect a set if Verne wasn't part of it, correct? The only reason you'd even care to have his card was if he were in the set. Don't lie to me or yourself. That's the only reason for most set collectors. That's not a bad thing, just reality

The other type collector would be a team collector. Some may have more interest in common players most are probably like set collectors, and just want them for that reason.

The only reason I want them is because it has personal value outside of collecting for baseball. 1st he has family DNA and also where I live his family started the town of Clemons Grove. His grandfather William Clemons was the founder. That's my want for them.

So yes if you want to know if I feel I have more interest in them then many I'd say yes, absolutely. That's where it would end. I don't think I'm entitled to anything nor have I applied that. That's you not me that thinks that.

This is what you're interpretation is if you want me to spitball for your thoughts. You've put words in my mouth so I'll do so for you.

You feel I think I'm more entitled to it because hear me out. I tried to offer him money then offer a card on top of that, because he implied he didn't want to break up a set. My sole intention was to keep him having a full set, and me getting a card I wanted. That’s it! Period. Anything else was idiocy thrown my way. I tried to make a deal that would work for both parties. This entire thing blew up because of some thin skinned set collectors that ignored the true question asked of how to find the Verne Clemons of the world. You like many others blew right past the main question and got butt hurt.

So you aren't going to reread what you wrote, I see. Just continue to spout off walls of text that do nothing but show you are only capable of posting on emotion. Ironically, you call us thin skinned and butthurt. LOL

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

And I already explained as much more than once. You have an issue with trying to paint your own picture instead of listening to what someone stated. How many posts have you made, and yet you still haven't even touched the question posed.

Nah its your bitching about something you misrepresented, and can't let go lof it.

The transcript shows I was one of the first posts answering questions from the OP.

I did listen to what you said. That’s how I was able to quote and observe your direct contradictions. You collect and have a collection in your own direct words, then bitch and moan if someone calls you a collector.

You stewed over it all weekend and came back because you literally couldn’t drop it. “Can’t let go of it” lol.

It’s nobodies fault but your own that you have contradicted yourself repeatedly. Throwing a bitch fit over a crappy offer being rejected is not going to bring support. You aren’t entitled to anything. Everyone except you gets it. Put your adult pants on, and grow up.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by G1911

The transcript shows I was one of the first posts answering questions from the OP.

I did listen to what you said. That’s how I was able to quote and observe your direct contradictions. You collect and have a collection in your own direct words, then bitch and moan if someone calls you a collector.

You stewed over it all weekend and came back because you literally couldn’t drop it. “Can’t let go of it” lol.

It’s nobodies fault but your own that you have contradicted yourself repeatedly. Throwing a bitch fit over a crappy offer being rejected is not going to bring support. You aren’t entitled to anything. Everyone except you gets it. Put your adult pants on, and grow up.

“The hobby” and “your personal interests” are two different things. How is it hurting the hobby for other collectors to not put your collecting over their own? People are not obligated to sell/trade you a card because you want it. There’s a few items I’d like that people won’t sell, but they aren’t hurting the hobby by keeping them and declining my overpay offer. None of us are entitled to an item. Especially if you’re trying to trade them an objectively worse item for an objectively better item. Why would somebody trade you a higher grade copy for a lower grade one? That’s a very bad deal for them.

[jayshum]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

That's your interpretation. Don't even try to tell me what I am or what I'm not doing. You haven't a clue, and it’s on full display!

What I said was a person that is just collecting to get a set doesn't care what or who is in that set, just to get it completed. That’s just a fact.

You would still collect a set if Verne wasn't part of it, correct? The only reason you'd even care to have his card was if he were in the set. Don't lie to me or yourself. That's the only reason for most set collectors. That's not a bad thing, just reality

The other type collector would be a team collector. Some may have more interest in common players most are probably like set collectors, and just want them for that reason.

The only reason I want them is because it has personal value outside of collecting for baseball. 1st he has family DNA and also where I live his family started the town of Clemons Grove. His grandfather William Clemons was the founder. That's my want for them.

So yes if you want to know if I feel I have more interest in them then many I'd say yes, absolutely. That's where it would end. I don't think I'm entitled to anything nor have I applied that. That's you not me that thinks that.

This is what you're interpretation is if you want me to spitball for your thoughts. You've put words in my mouth so I'll do so for you.

You feel I think I'm more entitled to it because hear me out. I tried to offer him money then offer a card on top of that, because he implied he didn't want to break up a set. My sole intention was to keep him having a full set, and me getting a card I wanted. That’s it! Period. Anything else was idiocy thrown my way. I tried to make a deal that would work for both parties. This entire thing blew up because of some thin skinned set collectors that ignored the true question asked of how to find the Verne Clemons of the world. You like many others blew right past the main question and got butt hurt.

As a long time set collector, I agree that it's true that the reason I want a card is to complete my set regardless of who the player is. However, that doesn't mean I'll buy any card just to fill the spot in the set. Maybe some people will, but I usually have a set of criteria for the cards I want in a set I'm working on. Regardless of the fact that you said his set was a range from A to 7, maybe there was something about the card that you offered him (apparently with cash) that didn't meet his criteria for his set so he turned you down.

As for how to find the commons like Verne Clemons, it takes time and effort looking through a lot of online auctions and listings and a lot of boxes and books of cards at shows sometimes to find some cards. For a lot of people, that's what they like about the hobby - the hunt for that elusive card they've been trying to find for years.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

“The hobby” and “your personal interests” are two different things. How is it hurting the hobby for other collectors to not put your collecting over their own? People are not obligated to sell/trade you a card because you want it. There’s a few items I’d like that people won’t sell, but they aren’t hurting the hobby by keeping them and declining my overpay offer. None of us are entitled to an item. Especially if you’re trying to trade them an objectively worse item for an objectively better item. Why would somebody trade you a higher grade copy for a lower grade one? That’s a very bad deal for them.

I guess you’re probably trying to counter my first point? See post 6 of the thread, you skipped it to copy this in from later. You can do it.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by jayshum

As a long time set collector, I agree that it's true that the reason I want a card is to complete my set regardless of who the player is. However, that doesn't mean I'll buy any card just to fill the spot in the set. Maybe some people will, but I usually have a set of criteria for the cards I want in a set I'm working on. Regardless of the fact that you said his set was a range from A to 7, maybe there was something about the card that you offered him (apparently with cash) that didn't meet his criteria for his set so he turned you down.

As for how to find the commons like Verne Clemons, it takes time and effort looking through a lot of online auctions and listings and a lot of boxes and books of cards at shows sometimes to find some cards. For a lot of people, that's what they like about the hobby - the hunt for that elusive card they've been trying to find for years.

Thanks for this post. It never got to that point, and I just left it at that. I didn't try to push passed that point. I didn't get a response back so nothing was offered in detail.

The only reason I even gave a second response was because he didn't shut the door, just said that he wanted a complete set and not to break it. No issue on my end at all. I just noticed he had many cards from 1 to 4 so thought I would offer a lower grade card and cash. No response back so I left it there.

When I first started looking I had probably 3 or 4 cards on ebay and they just sat there with no buyers. This was before I truly committed to dive in head first. I thought no big deal they pop up all the time. Boy was I was wrong, they all sold and here I am today. I can remeber at least 2 E120s 5 being the highest and 4 the lowest. I also remebr a type 1 and 2 V61 can't remebr the grade and 1 was raw actually a few raw, but some had major issues. Well not getting too deep I know of some cards, but the seller knows what I want and jacked up his prices. His cards his business. I just can't buy them at 2 times the going rate at best.

Most of those cards I mentioned are in set collectors hands at least it appears so from registry look ups. At that time, in early days of looking I didn't know how to follow the cards cert numbers. I'm just guessing some are in collections not for sale and maybe a few mid grades hidden away. Raw I wouldn't be real good at grading, but just haven't seen many offered either.

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by G1911

I guess you’re probably trying to counter my first point? See post 6 of the thread, you skipped it to copy this in from later. You can do it.

I did actually miss that one. Problem is, it doesn't help your case much.

The ones who cut up and destroy unique material before even documenting it, hurting research and knowledge. And the fraudsters.

I don't see how collecting in different ways would hurt "the hobby". To each, their own.

That was the secondary question and still doesn't help your stance at this point.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

I did actually miss that one. Problem is, it doesn't help your case much.

The ones who cut up and destroy unique material before even documenting it, hurting research and knowledge. And the fraudsters.

I don't see how collecting in different ways would hurt "the hobby". To each, their own.

That was the secondary question and still doesn't help your stance at this point.

It’s the answer to the OP question, since you claimed I didn’t give one, yet another false claim. Are you ready to grow up and get over your tantrum and stop making shit up or contradicting yourself?

[Vintage Vern]

Originally Posted by G1911

It’s the answer to the OP question, since you claimed I didn’t give one, yet another false claim. Are you ready to grow up and get over your tantrum and stop making shit up or contradicting yourself?

You do understand I wrote the initial questions? I guess you missed that important fact? In other words I know what was asked, and you only answered the part you wanted, and didn't answer the main question then went on some wild ass tangent and stayed there. I guess if you keep repeating the same lies to yourself, you start to beleive them. You're still trying to hang onto that contradicting stance! Atta boy! At least you put down the shovel for a backhoe!

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by Vintage Vern

I'm trying to keep all my items in our small town, but not sure we can build and house all that is needed. I come from a small town that is part of a larger county, and I do have another option with a historical society in a larger city. I just want to give our small town the first shot. Some items have already left for the larger viewing. I just don't think it has the same meaning. Adrian "Cap" Anson is the king there. Many of the items I was given from Jerry before he passed were discussed and he was OK with both options. I'm also going to try to get an article in the local paper digging back into the 40s and 50s for the Clemons 9 baseball team and in the pre 1920s and early 1920s for Verne. I want to get in touch with as many families as I can before I start with that project. Both to get permission and storied facts and see if they have anything to offer of their family member they'd like to group together for people to view. The paper had an archive we can pull from as well. None of what I'm doing is for personal or monetary gain. It's not just me, but a group effort. We just lost one of the last town elders, and she had vast knowledge from the 30s forward. We have one last older gent that is also donating lots of historical items. There's great pride in these small dying towns. Have you ever eaten at a DQ aka Dairy Queen? The co-founder was from here originally. Dick "Sherb" Noble. This town has had a lot of people that did great things for its size.

You're a collector of baseball, I'm a so called "collector" of this towns history which happens to include some baseball talents. I'm preserving not collecting.

Since preserving history is your higher stated goal, why not focus on writing a book about the town? You're already doing a ton of research, talking to elderly people who have priceless historical insight to the town. There are many, many more facets to Clemons than just the 3 baseball personalities you mention. There's their history, yes, but that could be expanded greatly in your book. Pictures of the houses where these men grew up, biographies of them, and other members of the town's baseball team (including rosters of the team through the years, maybe some accounts of games, and so on.)

What would preserve history better - giving that community a well-researched, multi-faceted history gleaned from the recollections of elderly residents, photos of the town, its building and residents through the decades, or a few baseball cards, which, to the average person, are simply small pictures?

You mention an article you're looking for. When you find stuff like that, include it in your book for long-term preservation, for all to see and read. You could also search articles in other newspapers that have accounts of games played when the Clemons team visited their town.

Before I retired, I was a business analyst, and the first and most important thing was to examine and clarify requirements before thinking about implementation solutions. It seems to me your requirement - your passion - is to preserve the history of Clemons. You clearly understand that time is of the essence, because people with invaluable recollections and insights are steadily disappearing. However, you have, in my opinion, made the common mistake of leaping to an implementation solution (collecting a small handful of obscure baseball cards.) If you go back to the core requirement, you may find that general research might be far more valuable than, for example, replacing a card that has a crease and missing paper on the back, with a nicer copy.

If you're familiar with Larry Ritter's book, The Glory of Their Times, you know about his method, which was to interview elderly players while recording the conversations (with their permissions of course.) You could do that, with veteran farmers, policemen, firemen, grocery store owners, mayors, etc.

I've collected cards for basically my entire life and I can tell you honestly, if someone had a T206 Wagner on display 30 minutes from me, I wouldn't bother to see it. Why? For me, seeing a picture of it would suffice. Put photos of the cards you seek in your book and that will satisfy the great majority of people interested in the subject of the town of Clemons.

You could have a ton of fun with such a project instead of being frustrated with your elusive pursuit of scarce pieces of cardboard. You could accomplish far, far more in terms of historical preservation across all areas of life, with a nice focus on the town baseball team, if that's your main passion. Instead of searching in vain for someone who will sell you that 1953 minor league card, seek out an advanced collector who might provide you with a high resolution scan of it.

Your book, self-published probably, would be available to all, and forever into the future. Unlike a handful of cards, which will end up somewhere, at best in some obscure display with little context.

You obviously are a very skilled writer. You have a deep passion. Preserving history really matters to you. My humble suggestion is, re-examine your core requirement, re-define you implementation strategy, and proceed to document the full history of the town of Clemons.