Best lefty off all time? My vote is Koufax!

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by cammb

Excuse me, did you happen to notice the last two years of Koufax??? To say that no one could match what Martinez did n 99-00 is absurd. Koufax crushes him in every category.

No, he doesn't. Or even close. Koufax had an almost identical ERA in his final two years. Pedro's WHIP was better in '99-'00. Pitching in Fenway at the height of the steroid years.

[cammb]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

No, he doesn't. Or even close. Koufax had an almost identical ERA in his final two years. Pedro's WHIP was better in '99-'00. Pitching in Fenway at the height of the steroid years.

"No he doesn't or even close". OK lets see if his even close: Koufax had more wins, better era, games started, complete games, shutouts, innings pitched, strikeouts . You are right, Pedroo had a better whip.


Y

[CMIZ5290]

There has been a lot of great replies and thoughts to other pitchers, and it's been a fun thread. A lot of my opinion came from key, first ballot HOFers that said Koufax was nearly impossible to hit against in his final 5-6 years of his career, and not just his well known and obvious stats that he had. There are not any other HOFers out there that got into the Hall at age 35 except Koufax. My final thought again is this, in peak and optimum situations, where everything is equal, I'll take him against a strong left handed hitting club, and I would take Bob Gibson against a strong right handed hitting club.... There you have it

[cammb]

I think his induction into the Hall of Fame (the youngest player ever to be inducted) says it all. The writers evidently ignored his first six years and judged him on his last five years. That was a tribute to his dominance

[Shoeless Moe]

No mention of Koufax being a pussy and hanging it up early?


And if you are picking Koufax for your one game, better make sure it doesn't fall on Yom Kippur.....or you better get the bullpen up.


The Big Unit all the way!

[Koufax32fan]

Originally Posted by Shoeless Moe

No mention of Koufax being a pussy and hanging it up early?


And if you are picking Koufax for your one game, better make sure it doesn't fall on Yom Kippur.....or you better get the bullpen up.


The Big Unit all the way!

I really hope this was all typed in jest. Please say it is so.

You should read a good biography of Koufax. Jane Leavy's is a good start. Koufax was in so much pain - and his teammates could see it - that they were amazed he was able to keep pitching at all. This was before Tommy John surgery. He used so much capiscum that smelled so bad that other players wouldn't want to be around him when he applied it. (Capsicum is what gives peppers their heat.) His left arm was getting malformed from the arthritis. If Sandy was willing, I would wager anything that you would be the "pussy" if he pitched to you, today - and, he is 85 years old.

As for Yom Kippur, suffice it to say that Drysdale asked Alston if he didn't wish that he was Jewish too after his outing. Baseball is important, but not that important. Let's give Koufax credit for being true to himself.

[brian1961]

jgannon --- Great anecdote. Loved it!

Koufax32fan --- Thanks for reminding the uninformed about why Sandy Koufax retired following the '66 season. The increasing pain and what it took to get himself on the mound was frightening. He believed if he continued to pitch, his arm would become deformed or would not function at all. The Dodger's owner and management did not believe him, and treated him shamefully for years afterwards. --- Brian Powell

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by Koufax32fan

I really hope this was all typed in jest. Please say it is so.

You should read a good biography of Koufax. Jane Leavy's is a good start. Koufax was in so much pain - and his teammates could see it - that they were amazed he was able to keep pitching at all. This was before Tommy John surgery. He used so much capiscum that smelled so bad that other players wouldn't want to be around him when he applied it. (Capsicum is what gives peppers their heat.) His left arm was getting malformed from the arthritis. If Sandy was willing, I would wager anything that you would be the "pussy" if he pitched to you, today - and, he is 85 years old.

As for Yom Kippur, suffice it to say that Drysdale asked Alston if he didn't wish that he was Jewish too after his outing. Baseball is important, but not that important. Let's give Koufax credit for being true to himself.

The fastest Koufax threw was clocked at 93.2, I'd hardly fear that. The 60's had about 5-6 really good hitters in the WHOLE N.L. 60's was just the weakest baseball, other then the 40's, for pitchers and hitters.

And if your saying he could throw when he is 85 then he should have rested, rehabbed whatever and pitched when he was 32. Terrible mechanics.....could have adjusted, taken stress off the arm and continued on.......nope he quit......reminds me of Barry Sanders. Quitters club.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by Shoeless Moe

No mention of Koufax being a pussy and hanging it up early?


And if you are picking Koufax for your one game, better make sure it doesn't fall on Yom Kippur.....or you better get the bullpen up.


The Big Unit all the way!

delete, just not worth it.....

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

delete, just not worth it.....

I played semi-professional hacky sack for 10 years.