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#51
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Are they in TPG holders? But besides that I don't associate with people who I think are doing bad things in the hobby. So, I guess that answer would be no. But even with a No answer, how hard is it for scammer to give the graded cards to another person to consign for them?
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Leon Luckey Last edited by Leon; 05-08-2019 at 08:20 AM. |
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The same number of times I’ve spoken to Bill Mastro.
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/calvindog/sets |
#53
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And please don't play the hiding behind the TPG card, given your knowledge of how many altered cards are in TPG holders.
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My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 05-08-2019 at 08:22 AM. |
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I agree that you are ignorant.
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Leon Luckey |
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As for this alteration vs conservation discussion I don't think the distinction is necessary from a seller or auction house. I'd be more interested to hear what PSA or SGC think.
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Successful transactions with peter spaeth, don's cards, vwtdi, wolf441, 111gecko, Clydewally, Jim, SPMIDD, MattyC, jmb, botn, E107collector, begsu1013, and a few others. |
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Your thoughts on a defense attorney defending a client they know are guilty? Good thing or bad thing?
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#58
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Leon Luckey |
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https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1290614
https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1292005
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/calvindog/sets |
#60
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Just his opinion, and he has his full name in the post! When new $ enters a hobby, and they get fleeced, usually they never come back. Kind of silly when a simple search, on Pwccs on site, shows multiples of the same card relisted doctored or not.
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"Trolling Ebay right now" © Always looking for signed 1952 topps as well as variations and errors |
#61
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2. Our society made a judgment centuries ago that all criminal defendants no matter how evil have the right to the effective assistance of counsel before they can be convicted. So I would say that ensuring that a defendant is afforded his or her constitutional rights is a good thing.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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#63
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__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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Leon Luckey |
#65
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Michael -- can you elaborate on whether you think this has happened as clearly no response is going to be forthcoming?
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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Then allow me to explain. A defense attorney's job is to represent their client no matter if they know their client is guilty or not. That's their job! Brent's job is to act as a broker to sell cards on consignment on behalf of others. So why do people rake Brent over the coals for doing his job?
You might argue that Brent should disclose any known work done on a card (and I would certainly agree). But if a defense attorney knows his client is guilty, does he disclose that in court? I think it was a very relevant question. Or should we all do as I say, not do as I do? |
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__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
#68
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Perhaps Brent will redefine the constitution.
__________________
FRANK:BUR:KETT - RAUCOUS SPORTS CARD FORUM MEMBER AND MONSTER NUMBER FATHER. GOOD FOR THE HOBBY AND THE FORUM WITH A VAULT IN AN UNDISCLOSED LOCATION FILLED WITH NON-FUNGIBLES 274/1000 Monster Number Nearly*1000* successful B/S/T transactions completed from 2012 to 2024. Over 680 sales with satisfied Board members served. If you want fries with your order, just speak up. Thank you all. Now nearly PQ. |
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Assuming all of this about Brent is true, isn’t he knowingly conspiring with the card doctors/submitters of altered cards whereas a criminal defense attorney is in no way involved with the crime? Isn’t there a clear distinction here?
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#70
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Which leads me back to my original question. Why is it ok for a defense attorney to represent someone they know is guilty because that's "their job," but it's not ok for Brent to do his job? And don't give me an answer from some legal point of view. What is morally right, Peter? Isn't the truth that in either case, it's really just about the money? Last edited by vintagetoppsguy; 05-08-2019 at 09:40 AM. |
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Actually yeah, criminal cases assigned by judges to defense counsel can't be turned down or else you could lose your license. You may want to brush up on the Sixth Amendment. And I'm not sure there is a defense attorney in the history of this country who ignores their oath and only represents people he or she believes is innocent. Perhaps on Mars it's different, David?
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/calvindog/sets |
#72
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__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 05-08-2019 at 09:45 AM. |
#73
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So if a client came to you to represent them and wanted to pay your fees out of their own pocket and you knew they were guilty, would you take the case? |
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/calvindog/sets |
#75
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In either case (lawyer or Brent), that's their job. They're getting paid to perform a service that they have offered. I don't like getting a speeding ticket, but that's the cops job. I don't like getting my car towed when it's illegally parked, but that's the tow truck driver's job. I could go on, but people either get it or they don't. |
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Unless he was physically there how could he 100% know? Because the media or prosecutor says the client is guilty? On the other hand a mere look at the cards in question show something nefarious going on and what is Brent doing to stop it?
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#77
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#78
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Maybe I should have clarified. My example assumed an admission of guilt by the defendant to the attorney - attorney/client confidentiality.
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#79
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__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 05-08-2019 at 10:09 AM. |
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All of my comments are based on the assumption that Brent is in no way involved in any doctoring. If he is, then shame on him and my opinion quickly changes.
I still have yet to see anybody address PSA's involvement in the card doctoring. |
#81
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Are you really trying to equate Brent/ PWCC selling a known doctored card to unknowing collectors to an attorney representing someone he thinks is guilty of a crime. I'm pretty sure in this example, PWCC could be prosecuted for Fraud. The difference here is one is criminal behavior and the other is to protect citizens from a tyrant. I can't believe i'm even responding to this post, but it was to off the wall not to. You sound like PWCC's publicist. In America, you are innocent until proven guilty...and it is embedded into our constitution. A Guide to the Sixth Amendment The Sixth Amendment, or Amendment VI of the United States Constitution is the section of the Bill of Rights that guarantees a citizen a speedy trial, a fair jury, an attorney if the accused person wants one, and the chance to confront the witnesses who is accusing the defendant of a crime, meaning he or she can see who is making accusations. The Sixth Amendment was introduced as a part of the Bill of Rights into the United States Constitution on September 5, 1789 and was voted for by 9 out of 12 states on December 15, 1791.
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-Dar.ius Hou.seal |
#82
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#83
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The burden of proving guilt beyond a reasonable doubt is on the government in a criminal proceeding, even if the source of that rule is not constitutional. I think Darius' overall point stands.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 05-08-2019 at 10:30 AM. |
#84
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So what is it exactly that you're claiming Brent is guilty of? I don't see it unless I really overlooked it. Help me see it through your lenses.
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#85
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For purposes of this thread, hubris in attempting to change well-accepted hobby definitions of altered cards.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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I didn't find that in the United States Code, Peter.
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/calvindog/sets |
#87
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The Book of Proverbs. Pride goeth before a fall.
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My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 05-08-2019 at 10:52 AM. |
#88
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Yes but if Samson cut his hair only halfway would he still have had the strength to kill 1000 Philistines with the jawbone of an ass?
Edited to add the emoji
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/calvindog/sets Last edited by calvindog; 05-08-2019 at 10:55 AM. |
#89
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Depends on the jawbone.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
#90
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What if it's the jawbone's job to smite the Philistines? Does that make Brent guilty?
I'll wait.
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/calvindog/sets |
#91
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As far as your response, so what? If he's selling the cards and you know his definitions/standards what's the problem? If he wants to say, "this is a Near Mint card with rounded corners and heavy creases that appears to be trimmed," what does it matter as long as you know what you're buying? And this really isn't about well-accepted hobby definitions. That's total crap and you know it! Just look at the very first reply in this thread. It had nothing to do with well-accepted hobby definitions, but instead asked about "advertising record breaking sales." It's a witch hunt period! |
#92
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__________________
Check out https://www.thecollectorconnection.com Always looking for consignments 717.327.8915 We sell your less expensive pre-war cards individually instead of in bulk lots to make YOU the most money possible! and Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thecollectorconnectionauctions |
#93
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David have you read the various threads on Blowout?
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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Peter, I am extremely proud to say that I have never visited that site.
But answer my question please. What are you accusing him of? |
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It's a very contentious site David, you might fit in well.
But for context as to why these issues are coming into focus now, you should read it.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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That's not really anything to be proud of...take 30 minutes and read the threads that jeff linked...then come back here.
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#97
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David, Let's put it this way.
I am an auctioneer. I will never accept a consignment from any source that has a reputation for altering cards. I will never sell an altered card without noting the alteration (sometimes a card still has value even in it's altered state) I have even noted soaking, which many people have no issue with. I will never do anything to artificially inflate the value of any of my own cards that I may happen to be auctioning (ask my Parsippany auction-goers how many bargains they got out of my personal inventory while I tried to get that sale off the ground) I will never alter a card myself or have someone alter a card on my behalf. The constitution does not guarantee the card doctor a right to sell his cards. I am not violating anyone's rights by having these tenets. I am also not accusing anyone else of violating them, but if I have suspicions it would certainly give me pause before transacting business with that party. If it doesn't give you pause that's fine, but to equate your RIGHT to an attorney with a card doctor somehow having a RIGHT to sell his wares is misguided at best.
__________________
Check out https://www.thecollectorconnection.com Always looking for consignments 717.327.8915 We sell your less expensive pre-war cards individually instead of in bulk lots to make YOU the most money possible! and Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thecollectorconnectionauctions |
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At the end of the day, we all have different moral compasses....some are just more wonky than others. Glad to know that some people think that just because something is my "job" means I can justify it, no matter how unethical it is. Jeez.
Here's a card for those tired of looking at words.
__________________
Items for sale or trade here UPDATED 3-16-18 |
#99
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Well, Brent presumably has a jawbone, so there you go.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
#100
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Yes but I am proudly bolding this part of my response. Therefore the jawbone has a job it must do.
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/calvindog/sets Last edited by calvindog; 05-08-2019 at 11:50 AM. |
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