1955 Topps Cello Ripped Open

[vthobby]

This is the exact same photo he posted as the back of the card that he got from that pack!!! That is funny!

It is pretty funny watching the "believers" hail the Holy Grail. Even funnier seeing the initials clearly written on the back to the right of "Throws Right"!


Peace, Mike

2k25n4.jpg

[MULLINS5]

Originally Posted by vtgmsc

This is the exact same photo he posted as the back of the card that he got from that pack!!! That is funny!

It is pretty funny watching the "believers" hail the Holy Grail. Even funnier seeing the initials clearly written on the back to the right of "Throws Right"!


Peace, Mike

Attachment 213722

Yet here is an eBay auction with the SAME "writing"

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1955-TOPPS-B...p2047675.l2557

[donniebaseball]

This was also from the CU thread. The card is currently being offered on eBay and has the same exact marking or "initials" on the reverse of another '55 Clemente. That mark is from Topps, not from a collector.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1955-TOPPS-B...p2047675.l2557

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by MULLINS5

Yet here is an eBay auction with the SAME "writing"

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1955-TOPPS-B...p2047675.l2557

I looked at a few and all the ones with the print defect on the front have that "writing" on the back.

[glchen]

I stand corrected. It's not writing. Apologies to the ripper.

[vthobby]

not convinced. The Clemente being centered while every other card is way off, Clemente was the second to last card pulled for what I admit was quite the dramatic effect if staged. I'm a non believer. Prove me wrong. Let me see the video!

Peace, Mike

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by MULLINS5

In this case the Clemente is a notoriously OC card and, I'd assume, that in order to find one centered the cards cut around it would have to be butchered.

If the Clemente came from a single strip, I could possibly buy that theory. But, since it was from a sheet, I don't.

If that were true, that would mean other cards, either in the same row or column depending on the miscut, would be just as centered as the Clemente.

[slidekellyslide]

I'm not a member of CU so I can't ask myself, but why doesn't someone ask the "Ripper" if he recorded the opening, and if he did not record, why didn't he?

[jbhofmann]

We got Clemente Truthers now....lol

[rjackson44]

this is funny

[ALR-bishop]

With all the stuff happening in the hobby these days I guess it is natural there would be both a tendency to be happy for such a collector (and maybe a little envious), and also skeptical. We can be a cynical group at times. Sign of the times maybe

[jbhofmann]

I guess I fall into the camp of--

"What does he have to gain by fabricating this?"

The conspiracy is way too involved to gain absolutely nothing.

[egbeachley]

Originally Posted by jbhofmann

I guess I fall into the camp of--

"What does he have to gain by fabricating this?"

The conspiracy is way too involved to gain absolutely nothing.

+1

2 things to consider.

1) He would have had to find a previously unknown and centered Clemente with sharp corners in order to pull this off.

2) If he did already have a previously unknown and centered Clemente with sharp corners, are we saying that he decided that he must overpay for an unopened cello pack so that he could slide it in for a rip? Why?

[slidekellyslide]

All I want to know is why he didn't record himself opening the pack. Seems the logical thing to do in the era of naysayers. Did he record the Gretzky pack rip?

[Orioles1954]

People have too much time on their hands.

[basesareempty]

Originally Posted by orioles1954

people have too much time on their hands.

+1000

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by jbhofmann

I guess I fall into the camp of--

"What does he have to gain by fabricating this?"

The conspiracy is way too involved to gain absolutely nothing.

Read the whole thread before commenting - especially post #28.

[jbhofmann]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Read the whole thread before commenting - especially post #28.

I've read.

Can you answer my question?

[D. Bergin]

Forgive me for not knowing modern pack ripping etiquette, but I wouldn't even think to videotape me ripping a pack of any type. I would have probably thought it an even bigger hassle to do what this guy did and scan and post as I was ripping it.

The only exception would be if it was a group buy and you needed proof of what was coming out of the pack.

From what I understand, there's only 50 cards in this series. Doesn't seem that unusual there would be a double sequence of cards in a large cello pack, with perhaps a stray centered card from a different sheet pushed in there.

Perhaps not relevant, but way back when, I busted open boxes worth of 1977-78 OPC WHA Hockey. This was a smaller 66 card set. There was only 12 cards per pack and I remember being annoyed getting double sequences of the same cards within the same pack all the time. Also had plenty of off-centered cards mixed in with the occasional centered card within a pack.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by jbhofmann

I guess I fall into the camp of--

"What does he have to gain by fabricating this?"

The conspiracy is way too involved to gain absolutely nothing.

Might well ask what does anyone have to gain from having the top set on the PSA registry. Notoriety, celebrity within our little pathetic circle, lighting up the chat boards, any number of ego boosts.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by jbhofmann

I've read.

Can you answer my question?

Sure. Your original question was, ""What does he have to gain by fabricating this?"

Answer: attention - just as in the thread I linked. Unfortunately, in that thread, it wasn't the kind of attention he was looking for.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Sure. Your original question was, ""What does he have to gain by fabricating this?"

Answer: attention - just as in the thread I linked. Unfortunately, in that thread, it wasn't the kind of attention he was looking for.

The only thing I got from that other thread, was that I should have bought as many boxes of 1988-89 Fleer basketball as I could find in 2009, at the prices I saw them trading at.

As for the correlation, unless the guy who opened the 1955 Topps pack is the same guy, or he was trying to stimulate the market before dumping a bunch of his own 1955 Topps Cellos on to the market..........I don't see a correlation.

[MULLINS5]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

All I want to know is why he didn't record himself opening the pack. Seems the logical thing to do in the era of naysayers. Did he record the Gretzky pack rip?

I can't speak for the ripper, but I assume he could care less about the naysayers.

On the CU forum 9.9/10 pack rips are scanned instead of videotaped.

The Gretzky was pulled from a pack but was not a shared rip. He simply posted the card asking for opinions on grades and said it was pulled from a pack.

[MULLINS5]

Originally Posted by MULLINS5

I can't speak for the ripper, but I assume he could care less about the naysayers.

On the CU forum 9.9/10 pack rips are scanned instead of videotaped.

The Gretzky was pulled from a pack but was not a shared rip. He simply posted the card asking for opinions on grades and said it was pulled from a pack.

also, the skeptics would just say he inserted the Clemente and sealed the pack before videotaping it.

[jbhofmann]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Sure. Your original question was, ""What does he have to gain by fabricating this?"

Answer: attention - just as in the thread I linked. Unfortunately, in that thread, it wasn't the kind of attention he was looking for.

Yeah his unusually high 254 posts screams that he is looking for attention.

Why haven't any of the "Clemente Truthers" pointed to the fact that his post history shows a pattern of buying/selling/ripping upopened vintage packs?

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

I don't see a correlation.

The guy that ripped the Fleer Basketball Pack inserted a Jordan and tried to play it off as if it were in the pack. Unfortunately for him, someone knew the sequence and he was busted.

I believe the guy that opened the '55 cello pack inserted the Clemente. I don't believe that Clemente came in the pack for many reasons.

You don't see the correlation? They both tried to fake pack rips. At least that's my contention.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by jbhofmann

Why haven't any of the "Clemente Truthers" pointed to the fact that his post history shows a pattern of buying/selling/ripping upopened vintage packs?

They also show a history of some "amazing" pulls.

Believe what you want to believe. When a pack contains 19 horribly off-center cards and one dead centered Clemente, that doesn't raise a red flag for you?

[MULLINS5]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

They also show a history of some "amazing" pulls.

Believe what you want to believe. When a pack contains 19 horribly off-center cards and one dead centered Clemente, that doesn't raise a red flag for you?

Actually, considering the Clemente is notoriously OC, it makes perfect sense to me.

[jbhofmann]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

The guy that ripped the Fleer Basketball Pack inserted a Jordan and tried to play it off as if it were in the pack. Unfortunately for him, someone knew the sequence and he was busted.

I believe the guy that opened the '55 cello pack inserted the Clemente. I don't believe that Clemente came in the pack for many reasons.

You don't see the correlation? They both tried to fake pack rips. At least that's my contention.

What you think...



In reality...

[jbhofmann]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

They also show a history of some "amazing" pulls.

Believe what you want to believe. When a pack contains 19 horribly off-center cards and one dead centered Clemente, that doesn't raise a red flag for you?

A dead nuts centered Clemente that he just happens to have?

You're trying to compare a poor '88 Jordan to a pretty nice '55 Clemente.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by MULLINS5

Actually, considering the Clemente is notoriously OC, it makes perfect sense to me.

Please explain how this theory works in relation to the position of the card on the sheet and the cutting process. This should be interesting.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by jbhofmann

You're trying to compare a poor '88 Jordan to a pretty nice '55 Clemente.

Ummm, no. I'm not comparing the cards. I'm comparing the circumstances in which the cards were "pulled".

[jbhofmann]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Ummm, no. I'm not comparing the cards. I'm comparing the circumstances in which the cards were "pulled".

Do tell....please share how these two events are so closely related.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by jbhofmann

Do tell....please share how these two events are so closely related.

Once again, you're not reading all the posts. I already shared how how they're related in post #76. But, to save you time, let me say it again in this post. Both events involve the opening of a pack, and a card that wasn't original to the pack being inserted into the results so that it looks like it came from the pack. Both are an attempt to deceive in order to bring attention to one's self.

[Buythatcard]

Is it odd to open a pack that has 19 cards that are off centered? I would think that atleast some of the cards would not be off centered. Is it possible that he bought this unopened pack that was once opened?

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Once again, you're not reading all the posts. I already shared how how they're related in post #76. But, to save you time, let me say it again in this post. Both events involve the opening of a pack, and a card that wasn't original to the pack being inserted into the results so that it looks like it came from the pack. Both are an attempt to deceive in order to bring attention to one's self.

Both events involve opening a pack............the rest seems like speculation to me.

We've all opened packs that have had both centered and off-centered cards in them.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Both events involve opening a pack............the rest seems like speculation to me.

We've all opened packs that have had both centered and off-centered cards in them.

Since neither of us were there, aren't we both speculating?

Again, believe what you want to. I really don't care.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Since neither of us were there, aren't we both speculating?

Again, believe what you want to. I really don't care.

OK

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by MULLINS5

I can't speak for the ripper, but I assume he could care less about the naysayers.

On the CU forum 9.9/10 pack rips are scanned instead of videotaped.

The Gretzky was pulled from a pack but was not a shared rip. He simply posted the card asking for opinions on grades and said it was pulled from a pack.

I don't have a dog in this fight and I hope he really did pull that Clemente from the pack. I don't spend any time at all on CU or any board where people rip open packs of 86 Fleer, 79 OPC, or even older cards like 55 Topps cellos, but I do see that people make a big deal of ripping open this kind of product on Youtube so I was curious as to why someone would not document the opening of a $2,000 pack of cards.

Either way it's an incredible card, and it's been a fun story to follow along with.

[ALR-bishop]

Dan---if you give me a shipping address I would send you an 86 Fleer pack so you can get a CU feel. It's just another sports cards board. No better No worse.

I am not sending you my 55 Topps wax pack. Nor am I opening it. Whatever is in it will not be nearly as good as what I think could be in it. But if I do ever open it, I will be sure to record it .

[packs]

I had an unopened 1959 Topps 1 cent pack for a while. I always wanted to rip it and see what was inside. I did figure out though that if you held it to a bright enough light you could see the card inside. Let's just say I was glad I didn't open it.

[vintagetoppsguy]

For what it's worth, the same guy who claims to have pulled the Clemente also claims to have opened a 1981 Donruss wax box (36 packs) and pulled 27, yes I said 27 Tim Raines RCs. 3 out of every 4 packs contained a Raines RC. Amazing! People can draw their own conclusions about the guy and believe what they want to.

Anybody know him on a personal level? I'd like to send him an '88 Topps wax pack and see if he can pull a '52 Mantle for me

[rats60]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

For what it's worth, the same guy who claims to have pulled the Clemente also claims to have opened a 1981 Donruss wax box (36 packs) and pulled 27, yes I said 27 Tim Raines RCs. 3 out of every 4 packs contained a Raines RC. Amazing! People can draw their own conclusions about the guy and believe what they want to.

Anybody know him on a personal level? I'd like to send him an '88 Topps wax pack and see if he can pull a '52 Mantle for me

91 Topps was the one that had the buy backs.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by rats60

91 Topps was the one that had the buy backs.

Yeah, I know, but with this guy's luck I think he could do it with '88

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

For what it's worth, the same guy who claims to have pulled the Clemente also claims to have opened a 1981 Donruss wax box (36 packs) and pulled 27, yes I said 27 Tim Raines RCs. 3 out of every 4 packs contained a Raines RC. Amazing! People can draw their own conclusions about the guy and believe what they want to.

Anybody know him on a personal level? I'd like to send him an '88 Topps wax pack and see if he can pull a '52 Mantle for me

Not saying whether or not I think this story is true, but 81 Donruss had some abominably horrific collation issues if I remember correctly.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Not saying whether or not I think this story is true, but 81 Donruss had some abominably horrific collation issues if I remember correctly.

I never opened any, but I'm sure they did and will take your word for it. But 27 of the same card? 3 out of every 4 packs containing the card?

[bbcard1]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

19 horribly off centered cards and 1 dead centered Clemente. It's a Christmas miracle.

print mark is pretty bad IMO. Don't know how the grading companies would see it, but it ain't all that.

[bobbyw8469]

Like someone else said, probably a PSA 7 (PD).....still a nice card that will command alot of attention if/when he wants to sell it.
The Clemente has heated up substantially in a short period of time.

[batsballsbases]

ttt..

[jfkheat]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Since neither of us were there, aren't we both speculating?

Again, believe what you want to. I really don't care.

For someone that doesn't care, you sure are making a big deal out of it. JMO
James