Ron and Khyber Oser leave Legendary for Huggins

[jefferyepayne]

Originally Posted by Runscott

The Legendary employees who were convicted are going to prison. The ones who weren't are trying to get an auction house back on its feet. I don't see how punishing the remaining employees serves any purpose.

Ummm. Who owns Legendary?

jeff

[turtleguy64]

who owns Legendary ? doesn't matter.look for a dissolving of the company shortly.don't see them posting a schedule of events after this Nov. 23rd in Chicago.the name is besmirched like the Mastro name.you don't come back from that .

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by jefferyepayne

Ummm. Who owns Legendary?

jeff

Jeff - boycott whoever you please. No one's going to think any less, or more of you.

[1952boyntoncollector]

is there any reason to not feel safe sending a check to the Legendary Auction and not receiving an item won ?


they dont accept credit card or paypal

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

is there any reason to not feel safe sending a check to the Legendary Auction and not receiving an item won ?


they dont accept credit card or paypal

You'll be fine. If not you can always write a letter to the judge.

[jefferyepayne]

Originally Posted by Runscott

Jeff - boycott whoever you please. No one's going to think any less, or more of you.

My only point is that whomever owns Legendary benefits from its continuation. I don't think looking at the employees and helping them keep things going is the right focus as the profits go to the shareholders. My understand is Doug Allen and other former Mastro employees started the company and likely still own the majority. Helping Legendary continue on simply helps these people, who are now indicted, continue to profit from this mess.

I'm not looking for people to think more or less of anyone on this board, just to act. I get tired of all of the people on boards who are appalled at shill bidding, crooked auction houses, shady dealers, etc. but who when it comes right down to it won't put their money where their mouth is. To each their own but don't expect things to ever get better if you're not willing to be part of the solution.

jeff

[Peter_Spaeth]

Jeff, unlikely to happen. As has been said many times, stuff trumps all.

[HRBAKER]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Jeff, unlikely to happen. As has been said many times, stuff trumps all.

Peter, you're right.

but

If you keep getting in line to get peed on, don't be surprised when you get wet.

[1952boyntoncollector]

people keep needing their card to get shilled until finally somebody doesnt do it and gets crushed..but again if its an auction house thats prone to shilling people should just bid less

there are people that get better buys in non shill auctions..and people that get ripped off..and its the same in shill auctions....when i really like a card and know i am willing to pay almost anything..i cant complain if its way above what i can get for it......if im trying to buy a card to resell for example id be more cautious on what i buy...

[1952boyntoncollector]

The issue is..if the shillers truly lose 20% if they 'win' their item and dont get a courtesy waiver..i really dont see how someone would want to risk 'winning' a 2000 dollar card and having to pay 400 for their own card...

[Leon]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

people keep needing their card to get shilled until finally somebody doesnt do it and gets crushed..but again if its an auction house thats prone to shilling people should just bid less

there are people that get better buys in non shill auctions..and people that get ripped off..and its the same in shill auctions....when i really like a card and know i am willing to pay almost anything..i cant complain if its way above what i can get for it......if im trying to buy a card to resell for example id be more cautious on what i buy...

It seems as all of the shilled cards have ended up in my and Jeff L's collections. I know when I go to sell at auction I tend to lose part of my big arse....

[jefferyepayne]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Jeff, unlikely to happen. As has been said many times, stuff trumps all.

I'm not saying this is you, Peter, because I don't know you at all. But usually the people who say this are the ones trying to rationalize their behavior to themselves because they know its wrong.

Time to man up and do what right and fix the hobby. Are you part of the solution or the problem?

jeff

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by jefferyepayne

I'm not saying this is you, Peter, because I don't know you at all. But usually the people who say this are the ones trying to rationalize their behavior to themselves because they know its wrong.

Time to man up and do what right and fix the hobby. Are you part of the solution or the problem?

jeff

It was an observation, not a rationalization.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by jefferyepayne

My only point is that whomever owns Legendary benefits from its continuation. I don't think looking at the employees and helping them keep things going is the right focus as the profits go to the shareholders. My understand is Doug Allen and other former Mastro employees started the company and likely still own the majority. Helping Legendary continue on simply helps these people, who are now indicted, continue to profit from this mess.

I'm not looking for people to think more or less of anyone on this board, just to act. I get tired of all of the people on boards who are appalled at shill bidding, crooked auction houses, shady dealers, etc. but who when it comes right down to it won't put their money where their mouth is. To each their own but don't expect things to ever get better if you're not willing to be part of the solution.

jeff

Edited heavily - my apologies for initial reaction.

Point taken about the owners of Legendary. Maybe there is someone here who can shed more light on that issue.

I doubt there is anyone here, including yourself, who deals only with squeaky-clean dealers, auction houses and collectors. But I also think that these discussions are leading to solutions. When we discussed the crooked ebay dealers, I like to think that many forum members quit participating in those auctions. Now we are discussing consignors shilling - hopefully that leads to some forum members thinking twice about shilling or having others shill for them (peer pressure if nothing else). I have mixed feelings about the major auction houses - we've seen evidence that almost every single one of them is dishonest in some way. So do we boycott all of them? Or do we discuss it here and let them know how we feel about their behavior? We've seen changes as a result of these discussions;e.g-H&S removing the photos with 'wishful thinking' identifications - small thing, but it started with discussions here.

At worst, the discussions don't hurt anything and certainly no action is going to be taken if we keep quiet.

[1952boyntoncollector]

anyone who says a card sold at rock bottom price and could easily of gotten more for the card cause its not the 'true' market...why not have a friend or themselve just buy the card and sell it....if the buyers premium makes it unlikely to do that then it was close enough to market price to not complain

basicaly if its selling at a price where you are 100% sure you can resell it for a profit thats worth..go and buy it...dont complain it sold for way under market and market period doesnt mean just a week period.....if so sure it sold cheaply buy it back and move on..otherwise it was sure as heck close enough to market price if you worried about buyers premium...close enough to market price to not be 'rock bottom price'....

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

anyone who says a card sold at rock bottom price and could easily of gotten more for the card cause its not the 'true' market...why not have a friend or themselve just buy the card and sell it....if the buyers premium makes it unlikely to do that then it was close enough to market price to not complain

basicaly if its selling at a price where you are 100% sure you can resell it for a profit thats worth..go and buy it...dont complain it sold for way under market and market period doesnt mean just a week period.....if so sure it sold cheaply buy it back and move on..otherwise it was sure as heck close enough to market price if you worried about buyers premium...close enough to market price to not be 'rock bottom price'....

okay

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by Runscott

okay

It's hard to argue with the ellipses.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

It's hard to argue with the ellipses.

ok...

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

It's hard to argue with the ellipses.

I appreciate his enthusiasm, but I have to admit I didn't understand much of the post. It's possible I agreed with all of it.