Best lefty off all time? My vote is Koufax!

[G1911]

Originally Posted by packs

Vance was a guy who was still pitching. He was no longer Dazzy Vance. Grove is clearly the pitcher of the 30s, because that is the decade dominated. No one refers to Grove as the pitcher of the 20s. You COULD make an argument that Vance was one of the best pitchers of the 20s. There is no argument for Vance in the 30s. Therefore, prime years are obviously different.

Except Vance's prime directly overlaps, except for 1 single year. Vance has a short career, and thus Grove's prime extends longer. This does not mean Vance was not Grove's contemporary.

1924: Vance's prime begins, Baltimore won't sell Grove

1925: Grove's career begins, he wins the K crown but it's not actually a great year, Vance leads in Wins, K's, and FIP.

1926: Grove's prime begins in 1926 when he wins the ERA crown. Vance leads the NL in FIP

1927: Grove posts a 132 ERA+ and leads the league in K's. Vance leads the NL in FIP again, and K's as well

1928: Grove leads in FIP, K's and Wins. Vance wins the ERA title and K crown

1929: Grove wins ERA, K's, FIP. Vance has an off year, though well above league average.

1930: Grove wins K crown, ERA title, and Wins with 28. Vance leads the league in ERA and is the best pitcher in the NL again.

1931: Grove has his greatest year, winning 31 games and an ERA over twice as good as the league average, leading in almost everything. Vance has his last prime year, leading in FIP.

1932: Grove dominates the AL again, ERA crown. Vance has his last qualifying year, an average season.

Vance pitches 1933-1935 as partial seasons and hangs up his cleats. Grove continues to dominate as he has one of the longest peak year stretches in baseball history.


This is like saying Bob Gibson and Juan Marichal are not contemporaries of Koufax, because their primes lasted longer than Sandy's who burned out early. Are we going to make this argument too, or is Sandy again treated differently?

The dates are clear, and easily verifiable.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/p...rovele01.shtml
https://www.baseball-reference.com/p...anceda01.shtml