Most undervalued HOFers

[packs]

Originally Posted by G1911

Think about it. In your example you chose to use to support this, Ryan gives up 65 MORE runs in 36 more innings. The primary job of a pitcher is to save runs, and Perry and Ryan were very similarly good at it. But in your own example chosen for your argument, Perry is slightly better lol

Why would anyone choose Perry over Ryan if you assume a similar outcome? Ryan might strikeout 20 guys or throw a no hitter at any time whereas Perry might junk enough to keep people guessing.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by packs

You hang your hat on your mastery of stats but 65 more runs over 5,300 innings means there’s about a one percent chance you find yourself in one of those innings. Why would anyone choose Perry over Ryan if you assume a similar outcome? Ryan might strikeout 20 guys or throw a no hitter at any time whereas Perry might junk enough to keep people guessing.

My argument is that they are pretty similar in career value. It is not that Perry is much better. I don't know why you chose to argue that Ryan giving up slightly more runs than Perry makes Ryan significantly better, to a degree where it's like comparing Ichiro to Ruth's value. Recognizing that is completely senseless does not make me a master of stats in my eyes, but that's an opinion.

[packs]

I brought up his runs because if you assume everything is equal between them why would you still pick Perry? That’s not something I think anyone would do even if you said they were equally good. The reason is because of Ryan’s arm and the potential to see something incredible. That’s also the reason why his cards sell for more money. This is a thread about value in relation to cards.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by packs

I brought up his runs because if you assume everything is equal between them why would you still pick Perry? That’s not something I think anyone would do even if you said they were equally good. The reason is because of Ryan’s arm and the potential to see something incredible. That’s also the reason why his cards sell for more money. This is a thread about value in relation to cards.

I never said equal. I said they are pretty similar. Like 100 times now, because you all want something easier to argue against than the plainly true statement that they produced pretty similar value over their careers while being 2 different types of pitchers. I said Ryan's cards sell for more and will do so because his type is more popular.

[Peter_Spaeth]

IIRC Bill James in his 2003 update ranked Perry 16th (or so) and Ryan 24th. You had the feeling he would have ranked Ryan even lower but probably didn't want to deal with the backlash.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Possible analogy to Ryan in terms of the hobby: Joe Namath.