2024 Baseball Hall of Fame Tracker

bigfanNY · #1 01-23-2024, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G1911

Mauer has greater name recognition, as a recent star, then at least 50% of the HOF inductees. This is not logical.

I Did not compare Mauer to any other HoF inductees. I compared him To Barry Bonds Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez. None of whom are currently in the Hall of Fame. All of the 3 are by any measurement among the best to ever play the game. That is not Logical.

G1911 · #2 01-23-2024, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfanNY

I Did not compare Mauer to any other HoF inductees. I compared him To Barry Bonds Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez. None of whom are currently in the Hall of Fame. All of the 3 are by any measurement among the best to ever play the game. That is not Logical.

You chose to make the argument in #100 that his name recognition is 1/18 in your survey and thus he is not famous and thus should not be in the Hall of Fame, while the roster of steroid users should be. Mauer, obviously, is more recognizable a name to people today than most of the names in the Hall. This is not a good argument, or logical. I did not choose that argument, you made it. You then argued in favor of Pettite, who is not exactly a top tier HOF quality player like the 3 druggies you also mentioned, but a borderline candidate if you ignore the drugs.

I am quite confident you are able to understand why steroid players are not in, and that they are not excluded on grounds of name recognition or performance.

bigfanNY · #3 01-24-2024, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G1911

You chose to make the argument in #100 that his name recognition is 1/18 in your survey and thus he is not famous and thus should not be in the Hall of Fame, while the roster of steroid users should be. Mauer, obviously, is more recognizable a name to people today than most of the names in the Hall. This is not a good argument, or logical. I did not choose that argument, you made it. You then argued in favor of Pettite, who is not exactly a top tier HOF quality player like the 3 druggies you also mentioned, but a borderline candidate if you ignore the drugs.

I am quite confident you are able to understand why steroid players are not in, and that they are not excluded on grounds of name recognition or performance.

Nowhere in my original post fo I ever say that Joe Mauer doesn't belong in the Hall of Fame. I say he has less name recognition than Bonds Clemens and Rodriguez because all 3 of them were significantly better Baseball players. All 3 of them are eligible according to the rules to be elected to the Baseball Hall of Fame. And they are all 3 among best to ever play the game of Baseball. Because of that all 3 deserve to be in the Hall of Fame. That is the argument I make. If I wanted to argue that Joe Mauer doesn't belong in the HOF I could. But here today in this Thread I did not. We know that because no where in my post do I say Joe Mauer Doesn't belong in the Hall of fame.
Is Joe Mauer a more recognizable name than " Most of the Names in the Hall of Fame" I dont know difficult to prove either way it is a very broad statement. What demographic, so many variables. And because it is difficult to prove either way it is a weak argument. Supported by little logic. But you make that argument. We know that because you say that in your post. See how that works your words in your post equals Your Argument....not mine. And you make it in 2 seperate posts.
You conclude that you are confident that I should be able to understand why they " The Druggies" as you call them are not in the Hall of Fame. Again I wrote very clearly that I do not understand why despite the name recognition gained during three spectacular baseball careers they are not in the Baseball hall of Fame. So I dont share your confidence or find even a thread of logic in your conclusion.
The reason for that is because athletes are by nature competitive. They look for ways to improve all the time. All the Time. I dont know where the line is where competitive turns to cheating by unfair advantage. Baseball has rules and a commissioner and a union to balance and they did not preclude or bar in any way the path for these baseball greats to enter the Hall of Fame. So I believe their careers on the field of play should speak for them. Especially after Bud Selig and David Ortiz have already been enshrined. Just my Humble opinion.

G1911 · #4 01-24-2024, 02:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfanNY

Nowhere in my original post fo I ever say that Joe Mauer doesn't belong in the Hall of Fame. I say he has less name recognition than Bonds Clemens and Rodriguez because all 3 of them were significantly better Baseball players. All 3 of them are eligible according to the rules to be elected to the Baseball Hall of Fame. And they are all 3 among best to ever play the game of Baseball. Because of that all 3 deserve to be in the Hall of Fame. That is the argument I make. If I wanted to argue that Joe Mauer doesn't belong in the HOF I could. But here today in this Thread I did not. We know that because no where in my post do I say Joe Mauer Doesn't belong in the Hall of fame.
Is Joe Mauer a more recognizable name than " Most of the Names in the Hall of Fame" I dont know difficult to prove either way it is a very broad statement. What demographic, so many variables. And because it is difficult to prove either way it is a weak argument. Supported by little logic. But you make that argument. We know that because you say that in your post. See how that works your words in your post equals Your Argument....not mine. And you make it in 2 seperate posts.
You conclude that you are confident that I should be able to understand why they " The Druggies" as you call them are not in the Hall of Fame. Again I wrote very clearly that I do not understand why despite the name recognition gained during three spectacular baseball careers they are not in the Baseball hall of Fame. So I dont share your confidence or find even a thread of logic in your conclusion.
The reason for that is because athletes are by nature competitive. They look for ways to improve all the time. All the Time. I dont know where the line is where competitive turns to cheating by unfair advantage. Baseball has rules and a commissioner and a union to balance and they did not preclude or bar in any way the path for these baseball greats to enter the Hall of Fame. So I believe their careers on the field of play should speak for them. Especially after Bud Selig and David Ortiz have already been enshrined. Just my Humble opinion.

Here's what you said:

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfanNY

The Hall of What ??? I wear my yankee hat out and about and anytime in the past 2 weeks anybody mentioned Baseball I asked them if they knew who Joe Mauer was. I was 1 for 18 with 17 responding ...who? So they have gone from the Hall of Fame to the Hall of Who?....How did he get in? ...
Shoeless Joe and Pete Rose are banned and cannot be voted in. Everyone understands that. I understand that. I will never understand How Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens and Arod are not in a place called the Baseball Hall of Fame. And By the way all 18 knew who Barry Bonds , Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez are.
And Andy Pettite won 256 games 60% winning percentage won over 100 more games than lost. Was 19 and 11 in postseason pithing 276 innings. Andy has Five world Series Rings All 3 of 2024's Hall of Fame class have zero...rings combined. And Only 13.5% of Baseball writers voting listed Andy....Chase Utley got 28% of voters voting for him... lol I no longer vist the Hall of fame. I do not support the Hall of Fame in any way. Simply because the sign on the front door is a lie. It is not the Baseball hall of Fame.

How is this not objecting to Mauer? Your entire thesis is that the Hall of Fame is not a Hall of Fame because it is not electing the cheaters but is electing guys like Mauer, whose candidacy you cared about so very much that you ran a totally real street survey in advance for 2 entire weeks!

If you are NOT objecting to Mauer, then your entire closing argument and first paragraph are senseless babble, and don't connect at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfanNY

You conclude that you are confident that I should be able to understand why they " The Druggies" as you call them are not in the Hall of Fame. Again I wrote very clearly that I do not understand why despite the name recognition gained during three spectacular baseball careers they are not in the Baseball hall of Fame. So I dont share your confidence or find even a thread of logic in your conclusion.

You really want to argue that you cannot understand why they are not included because they used banned drugs? Really? You can't figure out? You don't know why they aren't in? You don't have to agree with it, I don't really agree with it, but it is astoundingly obvious and nobody here who follows baseball even a little bit can plausibly claim to be too stupid to know.

bigfanNY · #5 01-24-2024, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G1911

Here's what you said:

How is this not objecting to Mauer? Your entire thesis is that the Hall of Fame is not a Hall of Fame because it is not electing the cheaters but is electing guys like Mauer, whose candidacy you cared about so very much that you ran a totally real street survey in advance for 2 entire weeks!

If you are NOT objecting to Mauer, then your entire closing argument and first paragraph are senseless babble, and don't connect at all.

You really want to argue that you cannot understand why they are not included because they used banned drugs? Really? You can't figure out? You don't know why they aren't in? You don't have to agree with it, I don't really agree with it, but it is astoundingly obvious and nobody here who follows baseball even a little bit can plausibly
claim to be too stupid to know.

Sorry but no matter how many times you say it I never said Joe Mauer doesn't belong in the Hall of fame. You claim that You infer this. But it is just your inferance. I directly compare Mauer's name recognition to Barry Bonds Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez to make the point that all three are in fact Famous. They became Famous playing Baseball. I saw all 3 play both live and on TV. It was clear that they were Great. I close my first post saying that I do not support the Baseball Hall of Fame because they have denied admission to 3 of the Greatest to have ever played the game. Makes sense to me.

You use words like Druggies and cheaters to describe Barry Bonds Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez. I describe them as Great and among the Best to have ever played the game. When Bud Selig and David Ortiz were elected into the Hall of Fame any claim that these three do not belong in the Hall of Fame because of steroids lost any and all credibility. So again I state for the record I do not understand why these three remain outside the hall of Fame.
You seem stuck on the word understand and my use of it in this context. Here it does not mean I cannot comprehend or understand the arguments against them. Here it means I cannot agree with a group of folks like you who describe 3 of baseballs greatest as cheaters and Druggies undeserving of the Hall of Fame after voting in David Ortiz who tested positive for steroids during his playing career. And Bud Selig who oversaw baseball during the Steroid era.

perezfan · #6 01-24-2024, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfanNY

Sorry but no matter how many times you say it I never said Joe Mauer doesn't belong in the Hall of fame. You claim that You infer this. But it is just your inferance. I directly compare Mauer's name recognition to Barry Bonds Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez to make the point that all three are in fact Famous. They became Famous playing Baseball. I saw all 3 play both live and on TV. It was clear that they were Great. I close my first post saying that I do not support the Baseball Hall of Fame because they have denied admission to 3 of the Greatest to have ever played the game. Makes sense to me.

You use words like Druggies and cheaters to describe Barry Bonds Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez. I describe them as Great and among the Best to have ever played the game. When Bud Selig and David Ortiz were elected into the Hall of Fame any claim that these three do not belong in the Hall of Fame because of steroids lost any and all credibility. So again I state for the record I do not understand why these three remain outside the hall of Fame.
You seem stuck on the word understand and my use of it in this context. Here it does not mean I cannot comprehend or understand the arguments against them. Here it means I cannot agree with a group of folks like you who describe 3 of baseballs greatest as cheaters and Druggies undeserving of the Hall of Fame after voting in David Ortiz who tested positive for steroids during his playing career. And Bud Selig who oversaw baseball during the Steroid era.

Don't forget HOF Manager Tony LaRussa, who managed the two most steroid-abusing teams in MLB history, and knew EXACTLTY what was going on the entire time.

G1911 · #7 01-24-2024, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfanNY

Sorry but no matter how many times you say it I never said Joe Mauer doesn't belong in the Hall of fame. You claim that You infer this. But it is just your inferance. I directly compare Mauer's name recognition to Barry Bonds Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez to make the point that all three are in fact Famous. They became Famous playing Baseball. I saw all 3 play both live and on TV. It was clear that they were Great. I close my first post saying that I do not support the Baseball Hall of Fame because they have denied admission to 3 of the Greatest to have ever played the game. Makes sense to me.

You use words like Druggies and cheaters to describe Barry Bonds Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez. I describe them as Great and among the Best to have ever played the game. When Bud Selig and David Ortiz were elected into the Hall of Fame any claim that these three do not belong in the Hall of Fame because of steroids lost any and all credibility. So again I state for the record I do not understand why these three remain outside the hall of Fame.
You seem stuck on the word understand and my use of it in this context. Here it does not mean I cannot comprehend or understand the arguments against them. Here it means I cannot agree with a group of folks like you who describe 3 of baseballs greatest as cheaters and Druggies undeserving of the Hall of Fame after voting in David Ortiz who tested positive for steroids during his playing career. And Bud Selig who oversaw baseball during the Steroid era.

Agree with and understand are two completely different things. We all understand why they are not in and it is disingenuous to pretend that is not so, just as the previous claim. What this has to do with Mauer is a complete and total mystery, if you are not arguing against him and brought these things up for no reason at all after criticizing his candidacy with your completely real multi-week street survey.

G1911 · #8 01-23-2024, 11:20 PM

First dupe post, do I get a sticker?

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