Who is the greatest player of all time by position?

[isiahfan]

LHP - Randy Johnson
RHP - Roger Clemens
RP - Mariano Rivera
C - Ivan Rodriguez
1B - Lou Gehrig
2B - Rogers Hornsby
SS - Alex Rodriguez
3B - Mike Schmidt
LF - Ty Cobb
CF - Hank Aaron
RF - Babe Ruth

Notes:

No love for ARod??? You can plug him into either SS or 3B but I think the case at SS is a no-brainer

C - Gibson didn't play in MLB so hard to compare...Bench had more pop and good D, but IRod had 2800 hits, ~.300 avergae...300+ HR...a great Defensive C and also had wheels...similar WAR but Bench played on some ridiculous teams

Love Alomar at 2B...great defensive player and had speed...also good on offese but Hornsby's numbers are heard to ignore

OF - Hard to determine...do you want all sluggers on your team?....Avg?...DEF? a true leadoff hitter (Rickey anyone?)...I went with guys that were best against competition of their eras....Rith gets the eay nod...nobody did anything close to what he did in his era Mantle/Aaron/Mays/Williams....all guys that have an edge over the other ....but all played in the same era for the most part...did any of them really rise above?...Does longevity get taken into account (please see IRod over Bench above...I believe so)?

LHP - Went with Randy...I like Kershaw...felt Carlton was great...as was Spahn....Koufax to me had a great small (See Pedro) box of years (outside of those 4-5 was really quite average)....But seeing Randy pitch...was scary.

RHP - Tough call....Didn't see Johnson...stats deflated due to competion I feel...maybe? Clemens longevity and consistency in a live-ball era wins out IMO

[rats60]

RHP Walter Johnson
LHP Sandy Koufax
C Johnny Bench
1B Lou Gehrig
2B Rogers Hornsby
3B Mike Schmidt
SS Honus Wagner
LF Babe Ruth
CF Willie Mays
RF Roberto Clemente

[Rad_Hazard]

Ok, it looks like we are all adding a RHP/LHP split so I'll change mine to reflect that as well as adding a catcher with MLB experience:

RHP - Cy Young - GOAT, his records will never be touched. Dominated two different eras.
LHP - Randy Johnson - I think this one is clear cut.
RP - Mariano Rivera - Not. Even. Close.
C - Mike Piazza - I like him more than Pudge or Bench, he's the greatest hitting catcher of all time.
1B - Lou Gehrig - This one is clear cut.
2B - Rogers Hornsby - This one is clear cut.
SS - Honus Wagner - This one is clear cut.
3B - Mike Schmidt - I would love to say Brett, but it's Schmidt all the way.
LF - Ted Williams - I can see swapping here, but only for Bonds. Cobb can't go here since he was a CF almost exclusively and Mays is better there.
CF - Willie Mays - This one is clear cut.
RF - Babe Ruth - This one is clear cut.

[sthoemke]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

Ok, it looks like we are all adding a RHP/LHP split so I'll change mine to reflect that as well as adding a catcher with MLB experience:

RHP - Cy Young - GOAT, his records will never be touched. Dominated two different eras.
LHP - Randy Johnson - I think this one is clear cut.
RP - Mariano Rivera - Not. Even. Close.
C - Mike Piazza - I like him more than Pudge or Bench, he's the greatest hitting catcher of all time.
1B - Lou Gehrig - This one is clear cut.
2B - Rogers Hornsby - This one is clear cut.
SS - Honus Wagner - This one is clear cut.
3B - Mike Schmidt - I would love to say Brett, but it's Schmidt all the way.
LF - Ted Williams - I can see swapping here, but only for Bonds. Cobb can't go here since he was a CF almost exclusively and Mays is better there.
CF - Willie Mays - This one is clear cut.
RF - Babe Ruth - This one is clear cut.

How about adding a "bat-right/throws-left" split, and Rickey Henderson can take that spot in left field.

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by sthoemke

How about adding a "bat-right/throws-left" split, and Rickey Henderson can take that spot in left field.

Haha! I love it! Rickey was so amazing to watch.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

Ok, it looks like we are all adding a RHP/LHP split so I'll change mine to reflect that as well as adding a catcher with MLB experience:

RHP - Cy Young - GOAT, his records will never be touched. Dominated two different eras.
LHP - Randy Johnson - I think this one is clear cut.
RP - Mariano Rivera - Not. Even. Close.
C - Mike Piazza - I like him more than Pudge or Bench, he's the greatest hitting catcher of all time.
1B - Lou Gehrig - This one is clear cut.
2B - Rogers Hornsby - This one is clear cut.
SS - Honus Wagner - This one is clear cut.
3B - Mike Schmidt - I would love to say Brett, but it's Schmidt all the way.
LF - Ted Williams - I can see swapping here, but only for Bonds. Cobb can't go here since he was a CF almost exclusively and Mays is better there.
CF - Willie Mays - This one is clear cut.
RF - Babe Ruth - This one is clear cut.

I like this list, but W Johnson or Clemens over Young, and Bench over Piazza.

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I like this list, but W Johnson or Clemens over Young, and Bench over Piazza.

I see the arguments for bench and piazza and as a Mets fan I want piazza (if not carter). That said, I give it to yogi all day. His war is oddly low though - doesn’t make sense to me.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Carter08

I see the arguments for bench and piazza and as a Mets fan I want piazza (if not carter). That said, I give it to yogi all day. His war is oddly low though - doesn’t make sense to me.

Carter does great by WAR if I recall, it seemed to overrate him and underrate Yogi a bit. I would rank Bench and Yogi 1-2.

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I like this list, but W Johnson or Clemens over Young, and Bench over Piazza.

Thanks! I just can’t get over Cy’s records which is why I think he is my RHP. Also I’m a big Mets fan so that does come in to play with Piazza, but his offense just dwarfs other catchers so that’s how I rationalize the pick.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

Thanks! I just can’t get over Cy’s records which is why I think he is my RHP. Also I’m a big Mets fan so that does come in to play with Piazza, but his offense just dwarfs other catchers so that’s how I rationalize the pick.

Walter Johnson's metrics dwarf Cys.

Bench, Piazza and Fisk are virtually tied in oWAR, Piazza's offense does not dwarf Bench's.

[isiahfan]

Not having ARod on your lists....I will happily take him over just about any infielder let alone SS or 3B

tsk tsk

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Walter Johnson's metrics dwarf Cys.

Bench, Piazza and Fisk are virtually tied in oWAR, Piazza's offense does not dwarf Bench's.

You are absolutely right about the Big Train, I formally change Cy to Walter.

As for catchers though, I stand by my Piazza choice, his offensive stats don't exactly dwarf Bench's, but they are quite a bit better. Piazza's slash line destroys that of Bench. Piazza was easily the greatest hitting catcher of all time, so it comes down to the glove.

Here are the offensive and defensive stats and Bench shines in throwing runners out and Total Fielding Runs Above Average (Piazza's is terrible), but Piazza beats them all in range (he was underrated on defense, although not exactly great). Very interesting stuff. I would definitely put Piazza as the GOAT at the catching position, especially after seeing these comparisons.

[Casey2296]

Originally Posted by rats60

RHP Walter Johnson
LHP Sandy Koufax
C Johnny Bench
1B Lou Gehrig
2B Rogers Hornsby
3B Mike Schmidt
SS Honus Wagner
LF Babe Ruth
CF Willie Mays
RF Roberto Clemente

Great list