Vintage GU Bats - Undervalued?

[bigfanNY]

I have a few 500 HR club bats of Modern players. And even with grading and player letters I too learned some hard lessons along the way. But I learned from my mistakes. Mlb authentication and photo matching are always mean more to me than letters and grades. I have a mlb and photo matched Trout bat that got a grade of 9.5? The half point dose not bother me too much..lol.
I was tempted on a few 1930's bats a number of years ago passed then read about a guy in a barn with a lathe turning vintage Bats including at least one Ruth that got a letter and a grade. Maybe one day I will pull the trigger on a Paul Waner or A Duckey Medwick but Game used has always felt to me like a real battle between collectors and Fraudsters. With the latter winning to often.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by bigfanNY

Maybe one day I will pull the trigger on a Paul Waner or A Duckey Medwick but Game used has always felt to me like a real battle between collectors and Fraudsters. With the latter winning to often.

It is much easier to forge a card than a vintage bat, and almost infinitely easier to forge an autograph.

Coins, stamps, antiques of all kinds, artwork - pretty much every collectible - can be, and sometimes is, forged. It's all relative, but vintage GU seems a lot safer than some other things.

[bigfanNY]

Originally Posted by Mark17

It is much easier to forge a card than a vintage bat, and almost infinitely easier to forge an autograph.

Coins, stamps, antiques of all kinds, artwork - pretty much every collectible - can be, and sometimes is, forged. It's all relative, but vintage GU seems a lot safer than some other things.

Mark I agree that many other collectibles such as Autographs are easier to stright up forge. Game used items from Star players and Hall of Famers tend to have higher price tags than most memorabilia. And subtle differences can mean significant price swings.
I will give the example of the third Bat got for my collection. A Johnny Bench bat purchased from a man who had a table full of items from Steve Carlton Pete Rose etc. He had a relationship with these players and marketed their game used and personal items.
First I bought a Few Pete Rose Ties that my Dad just got a big kick out of. He wore them often to social events. So a few shows later he sees this same man and buys a Pete Rose warm up suit that he had worn for a Mizuno ad. Then later a Johnny Bench bat. At a show the next month he has Bench sign the Bat. When Bench signs it he asks my Dad how he got it. He tells story and says Johnny says yep thats one of mine. This is about 1979-1981 my Dad gives it to me the next Christmas because he knows I am a big fan love you Dad (he passed in 2017)
Forward to 2013 I have purchased an Arod bat signed as Game used but I find out he only uses this model for batting practice. So I ask knowledgeable bat guy about Bench bat I show him pictures. He looks it up and says it is a bat Bench ordered not for game use but to give away to friends or at his car dealership etc. So 2 of the first 5 bats I bought tought me lessons. Neither that expensive but the second stung. Never told Dad about the Bench.
So I keep learning and become even more cautious. Because I know small differences mean alot and sources you want to trust you can't. Photo Matching, MLB certs, PSA 9's, heavy game use especially if it reinforces player characteristics these things I trust. And I know that certainty has a price but it is worh it to me.

[Mark]

Thanks, Jonathan. You have lots experience acquiring very sought after bats, and your warnings are well-taken. In my opinion, it makes great sense for there to be a significant premium for bats that can be proved to be game used by the player in question. Otherwise, I think, we should understand ourselves to be acquiring pro model bats. And when it comes to players from 100+ years ago, I think it's next to impossible to show that a given bat is gamed used by the player---other than to point to side writing and draw the obvious inference. I'm pleased just to get a block letter bat of a player from long ago because I can usually surmise that if he ordered the bat, then he probably at least hit some BP with it.

[SyrNy1960]

Here is great example of how careful you need to be, even when it comes to modern day game used memorabilia. Not everything is what you think it is. As you all know, when people can make money off of cards and memorabilia, they will lie and fake things in order to make the big $$$.

These two bats are actually Alex Rodriguez BP used bats (you can see the tape lines on the bats). He did not use these bats in official games. These bats were signed (with no inscription) and sold by Arod Authenticated (his own authentication service back then) as 1997 Game Used Bats. The bats were later sent to MVP (who also sold Arod memorabilia), and the inscriptions were added. However, as you can see, now the bats are inscribed as 1998 Game Used. Ouch!

Being that I am a one-player game used collector, I have had many years to research, watch and learn a lot about him and his game used memorabilia. I consider myself very knowledgeable when it comes to Arod Game Used memorabilia.

My best advice is when it comes to game used memorabilia, do your research and proceed with caution.

[SyrNy1960]

In my earlier post, I mentioned that I got burned on a game used bat, which came with an LOA from the experts and the player. Well, that was actually an Alex Rodriguez Game Used Bat. The bat was signed and inscribed by Arod "Alex Rodriguez HR #15 1996." I was able to get video of that game, and saw that he actually used a Louisville Slugger in that game, not a Rawlings bat. I was pissed. I was able to get in contact with his Public Relations people, who then got in contact with Arod, who wanted to correct this. They had me send the bat to them, had Arod change the inscription to "Gamed Used 1996" and then sent the bat back to me. Great ending to the story, right?

Well, I opened the box and there was also another bat from Arod. It was a bat from his 2009 World Series Championship season, which was pounded with use. Included was a personalized picture from Arod to me, where he is holding the bat, “Tony, I hope you enjoy this 2009 bat. All the best, Alex Rodriguez.” As you can imagine, I went nuts!! I was later able to photo match the bat to 15 games, 44 at bats, which includes HR's #575 and 576. PSA authenticated the bat PSA 10.

[Jim65]

Originally Posted by 3arod13

In my earlier post, I mentioned that I got burned on a game used bat, which came with an LOA from the experts and the player. Well, that was actually an Alex Rodriguez Game Used Bat. The bat was signed and inscribed by Arod "Alex Rodriguez HR #15 1996." I was able to get video of that game, and saw that he actually used a Louisville Slugger in that game, not a Rawlings bat. I was pissed. I was able to get in contact with his Public Relations people, who then got in contact with Arod, who wanted to correct this. They had me send the bat to them, had Arod change the inscription to "Gamed Used 1996" and then sent the bat back to me. Great ending to the story, right?

Well, I opened the box and there was also another bat from Arod. It was a bat from his 2009 World Series Championship season, which was pounded with use. Included was a personalized picture from Arod to me, where he is holding the bat, “Tony, I hope you enjoy this 2009 bat. All the best, Alex Rodriguez.” As you can imagine, I went nuts!! I was later able to photo match the bat to 15 games, 44 at bats, which includes HR's #575 and 576. PSA authenticated the bat PSA 10.

Awesome story. Classy move by ARod.

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by 3arod13

In my earlier post, I mentioned that I got burned on a game used bat, which came with an LOA from the experts and the player. Well, that was actually an Alex Rodriguez Game Used Bat. The bat was signed and inscribed by Arod "Alex Rodriguez HR #15 1996." I was able to get video of that game, and saw that he actually used a Louisville Slugger in that game, not a Rawlings bat. I was pissed. I was able to get in contact with his Public Relations people, who then got in contact with Arod, who wanted to correct this. They had me send the bat to them, had Arod change the inscription to "Gamed Used 1996" and then sent the bat back to me. Great ending to the story, right?

Well, I opened the box and there was also another bat from Arod. It was a bat from his 2009 World Series Championship season, which was pounded with use. Included was a personalized picture from Arod to me, where he is holding the bat, “Tony, I hope you enjoy this 2009 bat. All the best, Alex Rodriguez.” As you can imagine, I went nuts!! I was later able to photo match the bat to 15 games, 44 at bats, which includes HR's #575 and 576. PSA authenticated the bat PSA 10.

Unreal story. Awesome!!

[tacprc]

Fyi I am pretty sure that the dealer was Whitie Willenborg. His business was called Cincinnati Memorabilia Co.

[bigfanNY]

For context you are referring to dealer who sold memorabilia primarily from Pete Rose and Steve Carlton and other Reds and Phillies players. Yes Whitey was his name. This is one of the Pete Rose Ties and the Bench Bat that was purchased from him.
Also as a follow up I purchased a Bill White bat that I am very happy with. It has helped me ease my way back with G/U bats and I have been an active bidder in some bats from the 20's and 30's. When I finally win one I will post.