Hall of Fame Early Baseball Committee

[Ricky]

No black ink on Max Bishop... great OBP, but no power and even though the best thing he did was walk a lot, only led the league in walks once.

[paul]

I'd vote for Bob Caruthers (possibly the highest winning percentage of any pitcher ever, depending on what source you believe), and George Van Haltren.

[OldOriole]

I agree with Bill Dahlen. Even more so I would also say Jim McCormick. No player from his era has a higher WAR and is on the outside of the Hall looking in. Plenty of black inK too....

[Steve D]

On Caruthers, is he even eligible for the Hall of Fame?

The rules stipulate you had to be in the big leagues for 10 years. He only had nine years as a pitcher (1884-1892), but he played a 10th season in 1893, hitting .275 as an outfielder.

He would be inducted as a pitcher (he's the only pitcher who has more than 100 wins more than losses (218-99) who's not in the HOF (except Andy Pettitte).

Steve

[darwinbulldog]

Originally Posted by Steve D

On Caruthers, is he even eligible for the Hall of Fame?

The rules stipulate you had to be in the big leagues for 10 years. He only had nine years as a pitcher (1884-1892), but he played a 10th season in 1893, hitting .275 as an outfielder.

He would be inducted as a pitcher (he's the only pitcher who has more than 100 wins more than losses (218-99) who's not in the HOF (except Andy Pettitte).

Steve

Yes.

[Kenny Cole]

Among the Negro Leaguers, who also fall within the Early Baseball Committee's purview, I think that I would support, in no particular order, Grant Johnson, Dick Lundy, John Beckwith, John Donaldson and Oliver Marcelle. No problem with Dahlen, McCormick, Caruthers or Stovey. I would probably add Tony Mullane and Bobby Matthews to my list of people to be looked at.

[CardCollector]

Great discussion folks! One point about Caruthers is that he crammed in many extra years of pitching in terms of innings pitched because of the way Comiskey used/abused him. Even if he probably deserves to be in based on pitching alone, his batting was legitimate: he finished second in average and first in on-base percentage in one of the years he played.

I think the only somewhat serious argument against Caruthers--and it also applies to Stovey--is that the American Association was too weak. But there are pretty good arguments against that belief, and in any event even if it were sometimes true for some years, you'd have to discount the league an extraordinary amount to knock out Caruthers.

[bobcatfunds]

Originally Posted by Kenny Cole

Among the Negro Leaguers, who also fall within the Early Baseball Committee's purview, I think that I would support, in no particular order, Grant Johnson, Dick Lundy, John Beckwith, John Donaldson and Oliver Marcelle. No problem with Dahlen, McCormick, Caruthers or Stovey. I would probably add Tony Mullane and Bobby Matthews to my list of people to be looked at.

Agree 100%