Poll: response to recent PWCC revelations

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Kenny Cole

As an aside, the OJ thing really hurt me. I grew up in SoCal and was a huge OJ fan when he was at USC. My folks took me to the 1969 Rose Bowl where OJ was great and no one else at USC was. I was 8. When we played backyard football, whoever was the RB was OJ; the defender was either Deacon Jones or Butkus, depending on where you played. The QB was generally Roman Gabriel, maybe Unitas. Watching that white Bronco chase was pretty bad. Did you know that Willie Mays mentored him? I didn't until not too long ago, but that is what I've read. Evidently it didn't take all that well.

In any event, much as I would like to deny it, the evidence was pretty damning. He had really good lawyers and, as Peter said, the prosecution screwed a fair amount of stuff up. Judge Ito was also not up to the task. I watched a lot of that trial as a young lawyer. Doesn't matter, he was found not guilty of murder, which IMO is exactly why he was later hammered in Nevada. What goes around comes around I guess. Karma or something.

I watched a lot of the trial as well and I was astonished at the glove episode which gave Johnny Cochran his famous line in closing. What a colossal mistake that the veteran prosecutor Marcia Clark never in a million years should have allowed to happen. And the decision not to put in evidence of the attempted flight was also, to me, inexplicable.

[Kenny Cole]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I watched a lot of the trial as well and I was astonished at the glove episode which gave Johnny Cochran his famous line in closing. What a colossal mistake that the veteran prosecutor Marcia Clark never in a million years should have allowed to happen. And the decision not to put in evidence of the attempted flight was also, to me, inexplicable.

Yeah. You don't do stuff in trial unless you know its going to work. I saw that firsthand when I second chaired (or maybe third -- there were two of us who were young lawyers from the same class) a trial that involved a kid who got blown up and sustained 3rd degree burns over 78% of his body and lived. It was amazing. Walton v. Black & Decker. Greg Walton is now a plastic surgeon, which is also amazing. In any event, the defense in that case had basically three defenses and did an in-court demonstration to prove how what we said couldn't possibly have happened. Instead, it destroyed them and proved our case. Ed Abel, my senior partner at the time, was the most brutal cross-examiner I still have ever seen. He just killed the defense expert to the point that the jury was laughing at him whenever he answered a question. It was ugly.

Ten million dollar verdict in 1989, all of which was collected. Wish I'd had a bigger part of that case. But I didn't. Life goes on.

[Bram99]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I watched a lot of the trial as well and I was astonished at the glove episode which gave Johnny Cochran his famous line in closing. What a colossal mistake that the veteran prosecutor Marcia Clark never in a million years should have allowed to happen. And the decision not to put in evidence of the attempted flight was also, to me, inexplicable.

OK well all of that said, couldn’t PWCC and PSA/CLCT have good lawyers, and whoever is going after them could swing and miss, and the whole thing could blow over like past scandals?

Somehow in the face of the scandal the stock is up.

Also the survey shows we at Net54 are not representative of the common collector because PWCC continues to have successful auctions (surely there’s no shilling in their auctions.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I watched a lot of the trial as well and I was astonished at the glove episode which gave Johnny Cochran his famous line in closing. What a colossal mistake that the veteran prosecutor Marcia Clark never in a million years should have allowed to happen. And the decision not to put in evidence of the attempted flight was also, to me, inexplicable.

A glove that has been wet and dried out and an uncooperative witness? What could possibly go wrong? I always wondered why they didn't buy the identical glove and have someone with demonstrably larger hands (or maybe even a cast of OJ's hands, but that could be tricky too as you really need to move your hand to put on a glove) put it on. I mean OJ "struggling" to put on that glove was such bad theater.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

A glove that has been wet and dried out and an uncooperative witness? What could possibly go wrong? I always wondered why they didn't buy the identical glove and have someone with demonstrably larger hands (or maybe even a cast of OJ's hands, but that could be tricky too as you really need to move your hand to put on a glove) put it on. I mean OJ "struggling" to put on that glove was such bad theater.

The funny thing is, to me watching that fiasco..... Those gloves were MONSTROUS and they fit him like a glove. Take off those stupid latex gloves underneath. The ugly ass shoes fit perfect too.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I watched a lot of the trial as well and I was astonished at the glove episode which gave Johnny Cochran his famous line in closing. What a colossal mistake that the veteran prosecutor Marcia Clark never in a million years should have allowed to happen. And the decision not to put in evidence of the attempted flight was also, to me, inexplicable.

FYI, Marcia Clark did not want him to try on the gloves. She wanted to have him try them on in chambers without the latex gloves underneath or not at all. It was Chris Darden who made the surprise move after F U Bailey got into his head and said to him "If you don't ask for him to try on the gloves, we will. The scenario has been played out in the ESPN's made in America.

Jesse could have been on the OJ Jury because he could not see the MOUNTAIN of evidence.

[Peter_Spaeth]

I wonder if the great lyricist Frank Burkett can do a version of Tainted Love called Tainted Stuff?

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I wonder if the great lyricist Frank Burkett can do a version of Tainted Love called Tainted Stuff?

Tainted Stuff

PWCC I've got to run away
I've got to stay away
From the stuff you drive into the heart of me
The love we share has ended in dispair.
Since you've lost your light to Gary you turn - can you sleep at night
Once I ran to you
now I'll run from you
This tainted stuff you've given
supported by your tenets, don't justify
Take my tears and refund, refund my
Tainted stuff, tainted stuff
Now I know I've got to run away

I've got Blowout to show me the way.
You now really want them to just shut up
To make things right you need someone to lock you up
And you think the hobby needs your stuff, but
tainted stuff is now on display
The jokers will run to you
filling your pockets is the only fun to you
But this tainted stuff you're peddling
Will get the authorities meddling
Take my name off your list
Of tainted stuff, tainted stuff
Me and my friends are really pissed.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Sing it accompanying yourself on sax and post the video.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Sing it accompanying yourself on sax and post the video.

I want to be the guy who just plays the "DANH DANH" on the keyboard.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Sam I have shared what I know with law enforcement. They read the boards and any time they want to talk to me again they know how to reach me. I'm not outing names on a public message board at this point. Candidly, it carries risks and when I see person after person posting they are going to buy anyway I don't see much point. Most of these guys aren't selling directly anyhow, so outing the names would not help anyone avoid them. My point is simply to convey that the recent revelations are not isolated and people who care need to be very diligent.

The gist of the conversation I referenced was that that AH regularly took consignments of cards from card doctors, and that many of his fellow AHs did the same, and that any collector who truly cared about not having altered cards needed to be very careful buying high grade cards out of AHs. I think that's probably true nowadays for mid grade significant cards with high eye appeal too, I'm sorry to say. It affects a whole lot of us.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Tainted Stuff

PWCC I've got to run away
I've got to stay away
From the stuff you drive into the heart of me
The love we share has ended in dispair.
Since you've lost your light to Gary you turn - can you sleep at night
Once I ran to you
now I'll run from you
This tainted stuff you've given
supported by your tenets, don't justify
Take my tears and refund, refund my
Tainted stuff, tainted stuff
Now I know I've got to run away

I've got Blowout to show me the way.
You now really want them to just shut up
To make things right you need someone to lock you up
And you think the hobby needs your stuff, but
tainted stuff is now on display
The jokers will run to you
filling your pockets is the only fun to you
But this tainted stuff you're peddling
Will get the authorities meddling
Take my name off your list
Of tainted stuff, tainted stuff
Me and my friends are really pissed.

Darn it, Frank - I think I stained an oblique laughing at that!


/

[Republicaninmass]

Originally Posted by clydepepper

Darn it, Frank - I think I stained an oblique laughing at that!


/

PWCC can send it to Moser to have it removed

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by Republicaninmass

PWCC can send it to Moser to have it removed

While I definitely 'fat-fingered' that, it's actually funnier that way.

At my age, I actually can 'stain' things when laughing...and that's no laughing matter.


You're missing a lot in life if you can't laugh at yourself.