Brent Huigens - PWCC. Do you really want to keep this game up? I'm ready boss.

[Whodunit]

Originally Posted by aloondilana

Jake,
I hate to tell ya, you are NOT the judge and jury of this hobby!
No one really gives a rats ass about what you think.
It's just annoying as hell to constantly read your whining, especially about subjects that are none of your business.

I understand you are a semi struggling lawyer, do you really think practicing "debate" on message boards is gonna help your career?
It's not!

It just makes you look like a jack ass.

I can see the blood pressure rising , John. Im not going to voice my opinion on that sale or the final value from pwcc, but your comment to Jake about made me spit my coffe out laughing. Get him, John!! Lol.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Man, we have a very noteworthy event, a 50K card that PSA supposedly specifically blessed during a live auction after serious questions were raised about it being altered, the card now suddenly gets yanked from the registry, all sorts of questions remain about the supposed explanation from PWCC and the lack of other relevant information, and the thread degenerates into a name-calling and pissing contest.

[Whodunit]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Man, we have a very noteworthy event, a 50K card that PSA supposedly specifically blessed during a live auction after serious questions were raised about it being altered, the card now suddenly gets yanked from the registry, all sorts of questions remain about the supposed explanation from PWCC and the lack of other relevant information, and the thread degenerates into a name-calling and pissing contest.

Excellent point!!!!!

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Man, we have a very noteworthy event, a 50K card that PSA supposedly specifically blessed during a live auction after serious questions were raised about it being altered, the card now suddenly gets yanked from the registry, all sorts of questions remain about the supposed explanation from PWCC and the lack of other relevant information, and the thread degenerates into a name-calling and pissing contest.

Peter, I think you're trying to make the situation more complicated than it is. Perhaps it really was sent in for a review, but PSA didn't know the controversy surrounding it at the time? Then later, after the card was already sent back, they were made aware of it and decided to get the card off the market?


If it really was sent in for a review, it was probably overnighted, PSA spent all of 3 minutes looking at it, then it was probably mailed back the same day.

IDK, maybe your conspiracy theory is better than my logical explanation?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Peter, I think you're trying to make the situation more complicated than it is. Perhaps it really was sent in for a review, but PSA didn't know the controversy surrounding it at the time? Then later, after the card was already sent back, they were made aware of it and decided to get the card off the market?


If it really was sent in for a review, it was probably overnighted, PSA spent all of 3 minutes looking at it, then it was probably mailed back the same day.

IDK, maybe your conspiracy theory is better than my logical explanation?

If after all that Brent did not make them aware of the controversy when he sent it in, and the reason for doing so, then shame on him. And I doubt PSA was unaware of it even if Brent didn't say anything, do you really think nobody made Joe aware of the thread here?

[Leon]

I agree with you David. So far, I feel PWCC has done the right things to make things as right as they can be. A lot of the other stuff seems to be guys whining over speculating and losing money. Just not a ton of sympathy out there for that. On the other hand, if fraud or lies are proven against anyone, things can change. But I spoke with PWCC quite some time ago about the card in question. If I recall correctly I told them, if it were me, I think the deal should be undone at the buyer's discretion. It has been and still the griping and conspiracies..oy vey..move onto the next speculation...

..And I think it's good it came off the pop report (if it did) and it's not in that holder any longer. That being said, to me it didn't look like any worse of a grade than I have seen on a daily basis. How is that for an underhanded compliment and back-stab in the same fell swoop?

**of course PWCC is an advertiser but it's not like they are being protected, this is just my opinion so far....

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Peter, I think you're trying to make the situation more complicated than it is. Perhaps it really was sent in for a review, but PSA didn't know the controversy surrounding it at the time? Then later, after the card was already sent back, they were made aware of it and decided to get the card off the market?

If it really was sent in for a review, it was probably overnighted, PSA spent all of 3 minutes looking at it, then it was probably mailed back the same day.

IDK, maybe your conspiracy theory is better than my logical explanation?

[Peter_Spaeth]

PWCC never should have sold the card without full disclosure of its history of alteration/restoration. It's that simple. The card's history was a clearly material fact, known fully by Brent who personally was involved. How has PWCC done the right things here, Leon? Is a fraudulent omission a "right thing"?

[Leon]

I think they sold a card without full disclosure but it was a graded card. They undid the deal or allowed it to be undone. That was the right thing to do, imo. And I am done as I stated my opinion already. Unless there is something different I will just give the Gorsuch stare.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

PWCC never should have sold the card without full disclosure of its history of alteration/restoration. It's that simple. The card's history was a clearly material fact, known fully by Brent who personally was involved. How has PWCC done the right things here, Leon? Is a fraudulent omission a "right thing"?

[Peter_Spaeth]

To beat the horse again, that it was graded does not excuse the absence of disclosure, particularly where Brent knew the grade was the result of alteration/restoration and that the card had been in a three grades lower holder previously. And I don't think we have the full story on post-sale events.

Oh, and let me add...

[cincyredlegs]

Originally Posted by Leon

I agree with you David. So far, I feel PWCC has done the right things to make things as right as they can be. A lot of the other stuff seems to be guys whining over speculating and losing money. Just not a ton of sympathy out there for that. On the other hand, if fraud or lies are proven against anyone, things can change. But I spoke with PWCC quite some time ago about the card in question. If I recall correctly I told them, if it were me, I think the deal should be undone at the buyer's discretion. It has been and still the griping and conspiracies..oy vey..move onto the next speculation...

..And I think it's good it came off the pop report (if it did) and it's not in that holder any longer. That being said, to me it didn't look like any worse of a grade than I have seen on a daily basis. How is that for an underhanded compliment and back-stab in the same fell swoop?

**of course PWCC is an advertiser but it's not like they are being protected, this is just my opinion so far....

It seems to me PWCC only did "the right thing" after Courtney blew the lid off of this issue. I truly believe PWCC would not have done ANYTHING if Courtney had not come on here. So, I won't give PWCC the "easy pass".

We have similar threads/issues over their years where people were caught doing shady things and only did "the right thing" after getting called out on here.

Mark

[Batpig]

One of the things that may be overlooked here is that it appears that PSA is stating (without actually stating) that before and after photos are in fact enough to deem a card "Evidence of cleaning", regardless of a lack of chemical smell or other indicators.

[Beastmode]

Originally Posted by Batpig

One of the things that may be overlooked here is that it appears that PSA is stating (without actually stating) that before and after photos are in fact enough to deem a card "Evidence of cleaning", regardless of a lack of chemical smell or other indicators.

++This is true. The 2nd item overlooked is the fact this crap happens every day at the AH's and nobody seems to give a hoot.

[gnaz01]

Originally Posted by cincyredlegs

i truly believe pwcc would not have done anything if courtney had not come on here. So, i won't give pwcc the "easy pass"

totally agree!!!

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by cincyredlegs

It seems to me PWCC only did "the right thing" after Courtney blew the lid off of this issue. I truly believe PWCC would not have done ANYTHING if Courtney had not come on here.

Mark

I liken it to theft. Someone gets caught stealing something, they return the item, they apologize. Because the item went back to the owner, doesn't mean that a crime or misdemeanor wasn't committed and that there isn't consequences to the actions. The police could still get called, and that person could still be charged.

Regardless of the fact that they ate the commissions, price of the card, the card was pulled from the registry, all does not change the fact that the act actually occurred, and that there should be and could be consequences to that.

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by Leon

And I think it's good it came off the pop report (if it did) and it's not in that holder any longer.

Where did you read/hear this? It is not in Brent's post. That's why I asked the question as to what the end state of the card would be.

[nsaddict]

Well, the SMR on this card in PSA 1 is 950 (authentics not listed). I would be willing to help the hobby and buy this infamous card at "their" valuation

[Leon]

I assumed (yikes) this from what I read, I don't know if it is there or not, personally. I thought I read it got cracked out of the holder (and therefore wouldn't be there) but am not wading to find out. Again, if it is still in the 7 holder and on the report, so be it. I don't really care that much.

Originally Posted by swarmee

Where did you read/hear this? It is not in Brent's post. That's why I asked the question as to what the end state of the card would be.

[BengoughingForAwhile]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Man, we have a very noteworthy event, a 50K card that PSA supposedly specifically blessed during a live auction after serious questions were raised about it being altered, the card now suddenly gets yanked from the registry, all sorts of questions remain about the supposed explanation from PWCC and the lack of other relevant information, and the thread degenerates into a name-calling and pissing contest.

I think Jake might be secretly working undercover for PSA/PWCC. Just kidding!

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Man, we have a very noteworthy event, a 50K card that PSA supposedly specifically blessed during a live auction after serious questions were raised about it being altered, the card now suddenly gets yanked from the registry, all sorts of questions remain about the supposed explanation from PWCC and the lack of other relevant information, and the thread degenerates into a name-calling and pissing contest.

Are you new here?

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by Whodunit

I can see the blood pressure rising , John. Im not going to voice my opinion on that sale or the final value from pwcc, but your comment to Jake about made me spit my coffe out laughing. Get him, John!! Lol.

Still waiting on the photos that you said you couldnt download from your phone. Im sure there are a lot of people laughing right now....

No offense but i dont think many net54 posters would be looking for you to endorse any of their posts...

Lets get to issue in hand like Peter S. states...

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

Still waiting on the photos that you said you couldnt download from your phone. Im sure there are a lot of people laughing right now....

Lets get to issue in hand like Peter S. states...

+1. Don't hold your breath. He said he got them off of his phone. He can't release something he doesn't have.