Now I know where Coach's Corners crap goes

[thetruthisoutthere]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

Whadda you care how much crap Morales certifies? No "real collector" buys his stuff. (A very reliable YouTube source told me that.)

Whoever forged those high-end Ruth balls has done "the hobby" serious--perhaps irreparable--harm. Morales and his fellow clowns are a joke.

What "I care about" and "Why I care about it" is none of your business, Mr. Atkatz.

[GrayGhost]

Not this stuff again. ...

Look, you two are both VERY passionate bout the mess the autograph hobby is in. Yes, the Ruth mess is a MAJOR issue, and the seemingly "automatic" PSA and JSA love on stuff.

But, Chris has exposed SO MUCH garbage, on e'thing from Ruth to Kobe Bryant to Clyde Barrow, that he provides a valuable service too.

Work together guys ..a lot of good has been done, and hopefully much more will come out of everyone trying to kill off these crooks and rid all their garbage from the Hobby.

[thetruthisoutthere]

Originally Posted by GrayGhost

Not this stuff again. ...

Look, you two are both VERY passionate bout the mess the autograph hobby is in. Yes, the Ruth mess is a MAJOR issue, and the seemingly "automatic" PSA and JSA love on stuff.

But, Chris has exposed SO MUCH garbage, on e'thing from Ruth to Kobe Bryant to Clyde Barrow, that he provides a valuable service too.

Work together guys ..a lot of good has been done, and hopefully much more will come out of everyone trying to kill off these crooks and rid all their garbage from the Hobby.

You make a good point, Scott, but Mr. Atkatz has been "baiting" me for awhile now, and for once I took the "bait," but I won't apologize for taking the "bait."

[RichardSimon]

Years ago the young man who forged, among other things, high end team balls (I had a 1920's NY Giants team ball in my hands, offered to me by a conspiraor of the forger, it was a complete forgery with 20+ autographs) did the hobby serious harm and yet here we are years later and the hobby still thrives, albeit an economic slowdown in this country has had an effect.
I have a suspicion, totally unproven, that this person might have had a hand in the high end Ruth baseballs we are seeing now.
Charlie Sheen was taken in years ago, big time spenders were taken in, and yet collectors continue to buy and buy and buy.

[thetruthisoutthere]

Originally Posted by RichardSimon

Years ago the young man who forged, among other things, high end team balls (I had a 1920's NY Giants team ball in my hands, offered to me by a conspiraor of the forger, it was a complete forgery with 20+ autographs) did the hobby serious harm and yet here we are years later and the hobby still thrives, albeit an economic slowdown in this country has had an effect.
I have a suspicion, totally unproven, that this person might have had a hand in the high end Ruth baseballs we are seeing now.
Charlie Sheen was taken in years ago, big time spenders were taken in, and yet collectors continue to buy and buy and buy.

Richard, do you know if that "young man" also forged old-time NY Yankees team-signed baseballs?

[David Atkatz]

There you go again.

[slidekellyslide]

Take it to emails or private messages...I don't care, but I'll lock this thread if it turns into another pissing match.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by GrayGhost

Not this stuff again. ...

Look, you two are both VERY passionate about the mess the autograph hobby is in. Yes, the Ruth mess is a MAJOR issue, and the seemingly "automatic" PSA and JSA love on stuff.

But, Chris has exposed SO MUCH garbage, on e'thing from Ruth to Kobe Bryant to Clyde Barrow, that he provides a valuable service too.

Work together guys ..a lot of good has been done, and hopefully much more will come out of everyone trying to kill off these crooks and rid all their garbage from the Hobby.

I couldn't agree more.... I love CW for what he has done and is doing with the onslaught of forgeries. It is needed so much. I always appreciate Travis just as much for what he has done and is doing. Both are especially passionate, but when you have Travis siding with Morales and the FDE's , Houston, we have a problem. I Know Travis "EVERYBODY KNOWS ABOUT MORALES" We'll guess what.... they don't. He is despicable. Other FDE's that Rubber stamp forgeries are also equally despicable. We all know who they are by now. Alphabet soup doing the things on the inside that they do and the level of forgeries they pass and refuse to correct is equally despicable. SO please, for the Average collector and the love of God, please just stop it already, it is nauseating.

Until these 2 Major Factions (FOREVER CLUELESS RUBBER STAMPER FDE Cheater F'ers vs Alphabet soup and their too big to fail mentality, good ole boy network, refusing to admit their mistakes) come together, it's going to be a long road.

Travis just needs to wrap his noodle around the big picture on this one point, that FDE is just as harmful to the average collector as the Alphabet soup. It is really just so moronic that it is laughable from a collectors point of view.

[Mr. Zipper]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

"EVERYBODY KNOWS ABOUT MORALES" We'll guess what.... they don't. He is despicable. Other FDE's that Rubber stamp forgeries are also equally despicable. We all know who they are by now.

Just look of the parade of FDE junk coming in on Pawn Stars and The Real Deal (new auction show). Clearly "everyone" didn't get the memo about Morales, Max, Frangipani, et. al.

[Sportsnutcards]

I get 100's of dollars of bad autographs that walk into the store every week. Most of these are from the novice collector who have no clue, but many of them paid top dollar for these autographs because they just wanted to have something signed by the player and trusted whoever they were buying it from. While JSA and PSA have made mistakes, there is no way that the amount of bad stuff certified by them is anywhere near equal to the amount of bad autographs that have been certified by the "rubber-Stampers" or from the other major dealers who were found to be selling a large amount of fakes.

[perezfan]

Agree 100%. There's no comparison. It's silly to even mention them in the same breath.

Some people here have an axe to grind... probably because one of their prized possessions was shot down at some point. There's a world of difference between a company that makes a few inevitable mistakes, and companies that knowingly and willfully authenticate bad material for the sake of profit.

[David Atkatz]

Except for the fact that the bad stuff they certify is so bad that no one with an ounce of experience would buy any of it. But a PSA certified forgery can go for $300,000 to a sophisticated collector.

So who's worse for "the hobby"?

I'm certainly not worried about being fooled by a Morales-certified fake. But a really good forgery? Certed by PSA? Yeah, that worries me.

[travrosty]

Originally Posted by Sportsnutcards

I get 100's of dollars of bad autographs that walk into the store every week. Most of these are from the novice collector who have no clue, but many of them paid top dollar for these autographs because they just wanted to have something signed by the player and trusted whoever they were buying it from. While JSA and PSA have made mistakes, there is no way that the amount of bad stuff certified by them is anywhere near equal to the amount of bad autographs that have been certified by the "rubber-Stampers" or from the other major dealers who were found to be selling a large amount of fakes.

the amount isn't as important as the total $ amount of realized sales. which isn't even close though. a ten dollar mantle versus a 50,000, 100,000, or 150,000 dollar or more signed ball?

[thetruthisoutthere]

Originally Posted by travrosty

the amount isn't as important as the total $ amount of realized sales. which isn't even close though. a ten dollar mantle versus a 50,000, 100,000, or 150,000 dollar or more signed ball?

What about 20,000 Mantles that sold anywhere between $20.00 and $100.00? Add to that 1,000 Ali signed photos that sold anywhere between $20.00 and $100.00? Etc., etc.

So the amount still isn't important?

[David Atkatz]

Originally Posted by thetruthisoutthere

What "I care about" and "Why I care about it" is none of your business, Mr. Atkatz.

Dr. Atkatz to you, Chris.

And if it's "none of my business," why do you keep posting it?