My impromptu chat with Joe O.

[TONY-III]

Originally Posted by Leon

Ok, so I tried to say something good about Joe O, who seems like a good guy. I think this thread is very indicative of what many folks who I frequently speak with say about this board. I sort of cringe when they say it but it's the truth. There is so much negativity it sometimes turns people off. If you are so disgusted with the hobby and that bitter about everything, why not just find another one? I, for one, would rather spread good will towards other collectors and try to see the positive, at least sometimes. It's not like all of our 3000'ish members are going to let bad things be done without pointing them out. And yeah, I get the fact everyone likes a train wreck. I admit I slow down to take a look too. And then there are the few people who would rather post positively on other boards and then come here to post their hatred, venom and vile. That really sucks....Just look up in this thread and you will see all of what I say.

Joe- if you are reading this, keep up the good work.

I have to admit that when my partners and I were discussing our marketing budget for our new company and we were looking into where to advertise, we all came to the conclusion that we really weren't thrilled about spending any of our advertising dollars on such a negative forum. In the end, we decided that we wouldn't judge this forum by only the negative people who never seem to have anything nice to say about anything, but we reminded ourselves that there are many good people who don't speak up because they don't want to waste their time on negative crap. We watched the forum for some time and quickly realized that if you look past the few, you will see many real collectors with alot of knowledge, who appear to be friendly and want to share and help others. Thanks to all who have a positive impact on this forum! I for one appreciate the information I have gained by being a member.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by TONY-III

I have to admit that when my partners and I were discussing our marketing budget for our new company and we were looking into where to advertise, we all came to the conclusion that we really weren't thrilled about spending any of our advertising dollars on such a negative forum. In the end, we decided that we wouldn't judge this forum by only the negative people who never seem to have anything nice to say about anything, but we reminded ourselves that there are many good people who don't speak up because they don't want to waste their time on negative crap. We watched the forum for some time and quickly realized that if you look past the few, you will see many real collectors with alot of knowledge, who appear to be friendly and want to share and help others. Thanks to all who have a positive impact on this forum! I for one appreciate the information I have gained by being a member.

Tony, is this a serious post or are you just being satirical? I'm being earnest I just can't tell for sure. I'm thinking it's satirical and it's the funniest post of the year. Congrats!

[TONY-III]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Tony, is this a serious post or are you just being satirical? I'm being earnest I just can't tell for sure. I'm thinking it's satirical and it's the funniest post of the year. Congrats!

100% serious...Just my point of view. Guess you'll have to take back that "Congrats!", but thanks anyway.

[calvindog]

Still the funniest post of the year.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by TONY-III

100% serious...Just my point of view. Guess you'll have to take back that "Congrats!", but thanks anyway.

Hi Tony
I think I got the jest of your message correctly. And I am sure you realize it, but I don't manage this site based on advertising. I manage it based on it being an open forum. My guess is that if you did advertise you wouldn't be happy. Most of your customers probably read the board but I don't protect advertisers or anyone else. The day I do that, especially based on any advertising, is the same day I shouldn't moderate this board anymore. Fortunately the 23 current advertisers and their customers are happy. There were 67 new members that registered last month, almost that many every month since inception, I don't have any open spots for advertising right now and the Indians aren't too restless. I guess something is going right.

** One other thing. I notice you have been on the board at least 2 yrs yet you have only started 2 threads. Both of them looking for help. On the first one it looks like no response on your 1985 TOPPS McGuire in a PSA 10, but you did get some help with your Mel Ott signed ball thread. Thanks for sharing so much. take care

[mr2686]

** One other thing. I notice you have been on the board at least 2 yrs yet you have only started 2 threads. Both of them looking for help. On the first one it looks like no response on your 1985 TOPPS McGuire in a PSA 10, but you did get some help with your Mel Ott signed ball thread. Thanks for sharing so much. take care

Down goes Frazier...Down goes Frazier!

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Leon

Hi Tony
I think I got the jest of your message correctly. And I am sure you realize it, but I don't manage this site based on advertising. I manage it based on it being an open forum. My guess is that if you did advertise you wouldn't be happy. Most of your customers probably read the board but I don't protect advertisers or anyone else. The day I do that, especially based on any advertising, is the same day I shouldn't moderate this board anymore. Fortunately the 23 current advertisers and their customers are happy. There were 67 new members that registered last month, almost that many every month since inception, I don't have any open spots for advertising right now and the Indians aren't too restless. I guess something is going right.

** One other thing. I notice you have been on the board at least 2 yrs yet you have only started 2 threads. Both of them looking for help. On the first one it looks like no response on your 1985 TOPPS McGuire in a PSA 10, but you did get some help with your Mel Ott signed ball thread. Thanks for sharing so much. take care

Leon, it was awful watching that arrest at the National and put me in such a crappy mood about the hobby. But somehow I managed to soldier on and despite my negative feelings about fraud in the hobby I still spent 11K on cards in the past ten days. I just want you to know that some of us Negative Nellies still have disposable income. And I read the shit out of those banner ads. I read them so much I think they're burned into my eyeballs. Carry on.

[TONY-III]

Originally Posted by Leon

Hi Tony
I think I got the jest of your message correctly. And I am sure you realize it, but I don't manage this site based on advertising. I manage it based on it being an open forum. My guess is that if you did advertise you wouldn't be happy. Most of your customers probably read the board but I don't protect advertisers or anyone else. The day I do that, especially based on any advertising, is the same day I shouldn't moderate this board anymore. Fortunately the 23 current advertisers and their customers are happy. There were 67 new members that registered last month, almost that many every month since inception, I don't have any open spots for advertising right now and the Indians aren't too restless. I guess something is going right.

** One other thing. I notice you have been on the board at least 2 yrs yet you have only started 2 threads. Both of them looking for help. On the first one it looks like no response on your 1985 TOPPS McGuire in a PSA 10, but you did get some help with your Mel Ott signed ball thread. Thanks for sharing so much. take care

Oops! Hit submit too soon...

After re-reading what I wrote, I guess I need to clarify:
1) My company does advertise on this site and we are happy
2) My point was that if we only went by what we heard about and initially saw on this forum, instead of checking things out ourselves, we may not have made the right decision to advertise here. It was only with an open mind that we realized that, with negativity aside, there is alot of great info/knowledge to be gained and good people too. I just personally wish that there was less negativity and people/company bashing (especially when things are said that are not true) - that's all. Again, my opinion.
3) I don't expect you or anyone else to manage/censor or control this site outside of what the rules state and especially not for your advertisers.
4) Thanks for reminding me that this forum is a give-and-take proposition. I have contributed a few times more than what you stated, but haven't started any threads other than the two you mentioned.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by TONY-III

Oops! Hit submit too soon...

After re-reading what I wrote, I guess I need to clarify:
1) My company does advertise on this site and we are happy
2) My point was that if we only went by what we heard about and initially saw on this forum, instead of checking things out ourselves, we may not have made the right decision to advertise here. It was only with an open mind that we realized that, with negativity aside, there is alot of great info/knowledge to be gained and good people too. I just personally wish that there was less negativity and people/company bashing (especially when things are said that are not true) - that's all. Again, my opinion.
3) I don't expect you or anyone else to manage/censor or control this site outside of what the rules state and especially not for your advertisers.
4) Thanks for reminding me that this forum is a give-and-take proposition. I have contributed a few times more than what you stated, but haven't started any threads other than the two you mentioned.

Then I take back everything I said..... I love ya' man.....Thanks for advertising. Quite honestly I can't keep up with every one of ya'll but did get to meet many at the National. Truth be known I almost have a phobia with remembering names but am damn good remembering at faces .

I have an overwhelming desire to let folks hang themselves if they want to. That being said there will never be anonymity allowed when arguing with or berating others....

Something tells me we are actually in full agreement on just about everything. I too speak my mind and have put my foot in my mouth on occasion (see last post)......You have contributed but have only started 2 threads....which is actually more than most members probably have. Most folks don't want to get into the fray. Me, I jump in and ask questions later. You would think I would know better.

Jeff- I can't say I was joyous about the arrest at the National but I am of a different opinion. I am glad it happened and I think the guy should have been paraded around the room twice, with trumpeters trumpeting in front of him. I absolutely think that sort of thing can help act as a deterrent. I wish there were no fraud in the hobby but, to me, it's nice to know someone is watching. best regards

[botn]

...

[Misunderestimated]

I think that for the most part PSA (and SGC and Beckett Grading) are "a necessary evil" and their leaders (like Joe Orlando) are well-intentioned. Joe has always impressed me as interested in the hobby's well-being. He obviously recognizes that the success of PSA is inextricably linked to that of the hobby. He is a good cheerleader (for want of a better word) for the hobby and works hard at it. My understanding is that he was an enthusiastic hobbiest before he came to PSA and that this enthusiasm drives him today.
That said, he works for PSA not the hobby and when the interests of the two are in conflict PSA pays his salary.
Ultimately my experiences are consistent with what Leon wrote at the beginning...

Perhaps PSA (and SGC/BGS) could offer tamper proof holders at a higher price point (presumably they would cost the grading companis more).... Or maybe these holders should simply be used whenever a card is valued over $1000 (or something) since PSA/SGC etc. charge more to grade them anyway.
---
if someone already suggested this I'm sorry for not giving credit I started to skim the thread around page 3....

[theseeker]

Joe Orlando always struck me as a glorified ID braclet, pinky ring, and white shoe wearing used car salesman. His company reflects that image I have off him. In no way good for the hobby, IMHO. And Joe Orlando is in it for himself. Evoking this ceaseless self-promoter in the same breath as the selfless Jefferson Burdick is just plain wrong, again IMHO.

And on this board as with any other, it's not negativity for negitivities sake, it's honest emotion on a hot button topic.

And you want a list of guys that are good for the hobby you can start with this board, where members freely share their knowledge and passion for the hobby. I've benefitted emensely from it. And Leon heads the list.

[bcornell]

Originally Posted by TONY-III

In the end, we decided that we wouldn't judge this forum by only the negative people who never seem to have anything nice to say about anything...

Oh, please. This sounds like another one of those 'teams' consisting of 1 person. And, for the record, I only say positive things about everything, which is why my opinion is worthless.

Bill

[HRBAKER]

Bill,

Someone has to be a ray of sunshine. Good to see you in Chicago.

Jeff

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by bcornell

Oh, please. This sounds like another one of those 'teams' consisting of 1 person. And, for the record, I only say positive things about everything, which is why my opinion is worthless.

Bill

LOL. Yes, the executive decision on where to throw a few hundred dollars a month to advertise usually requires a full quorum before any decision can be made. These are weighty matters.