Harry Wright Autograph

[Leaf]

Originally Posted by Matt

I don't think it would hurt to ask the seller, but the seller sold a JSA authenticated autograph and the buyer received a JSA authenticated autograph. I don't think the seller is accountable if the auto is a fake.

I absolutely believe the seller is responsible.
Third party is just an opinion. The seller is ultimately on the hook for knowing what he's selling, UNLESS it is sold at the time of sale as no returns for ANY REASON with item sold AS IS on baisis of JSA authentication.
BG

[36GoudeyMan]

I'm not sure if this has been settled or not, but the practice when sending telegrams for a long period of time was not only to dictate to the Western Union employee, but also to fill out a telegram form by hand, sign it and hand it over to Western Union for an employee to transmit at some later point. This was done to avoid the time it took for each telegraph sender to stand at the clerk's window dictating, whereas the written submission form could be handed over and then queued up to be sent when time was available. This was also done to ensure accuracy of the text being sent, and to ensure that any discrepancy between what was received (or intended to be sent) could be compared against the written and signed submission form.

There was recently available a written and signed Western Union telegram form from, I believe, Lou Dials of the Negro Leagues, which follows the same pattern.

[SteveVerkman]

I was not aware of any controversy with this piece. I believe it was consigned to us with a full LOA from JSA and beyond that, we physically showed it to JSA at our offices.

I have sent the image again to JSA once again to review. We are not looking to be misleading in any way, and this is all we know about the piece. If JSA changes their mind, the item will CERTAINLY be withdrawn right away.

This will be my final post on this thread. If anyone wishes to contact me, kindly email me at info@csauctions.com and I will respond with any degree of detail requested.

Thanks much, Steve Verkman Clean Sweep Auctions

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by Leaf

I absolutely believe the seller is responsible.
Third party is just an opinion. The seller is ultimately on the hook for knowing what he's selling, UNLESS it is sold at the time of sale as no returns for ANY REASON with item sold AS IS on baisis of JSA authentication.
BG

Well I asked a lot earlier in the thread but never really got an answer.

WHO DOES have final say on the matter?

6 out of 10 experts say it's good?
7 out of 10?
8 out of 10?
9 out of 10?
10 out of 10?

Is every autograph out there a hot potato until somebody, somewhere, says it's no good?

[mighty bombjack]

What I don't understand is that it seems to be marked "received" and the recipient's name is on the envelope. Isn't this the handwritten note from the receiving end of the telegraph?

[mighty bombjack]

This has been pulled from the CS auction.

[mighty bombjack]

This has been pulled from the CS auction.

[Piedmont Sport]

Hey Guys - lets address the Harry Wright Telegram - First JSA took over 30 days to give the ok on the auto - Jimmy Spence came to my shop and spent the whole day working on my stuff - he then told me he was taking a box of auto's with him - JUST TO MAKE SURE - The Harry Wright Telegram was one of them. I clearly saw the auto was much different the the body of the telegram - and if you take the time to google Telegrams, it was common practice in the 90's for the western union person to either have you write it out yourself - or - sign it as to agree the information to be correct. Jimmy stands by his findings that the auto is correct and different then the paragraph above the auto. I don't by any means put myself out there as an expert - but I do take every measure to make sure what I sell is true - can we all make mistakes - of course - but this autograph is real. It's ashame a few of you scared CS autions and we pulled the item.

[mighty bombjack]

Originally Posted by Piedmont Sport

Hey Guys - lets address the Harry Wright Telegram - First JSA took over 30 days to give the ok on the auto - Jimmy Spence came to my shop and spent the whole day working on my stuff - he then told me he was taking a box of auto's with him - JUST TO MAKE SURE - The Harry Wright Telegram was one of them. I clearly saw the auto was much different the the body of the telegram - and if you take the time to google Telegrams, it was common practice in the 90's for the western union person to either have you write it out yourself - or - sign it as to agree the information to be correct. Jimmy stands by his findings that the auto is correct and different then the paragraph above the auto. I don't by any means put myself out there as an expert - but I do take every measure to make sure what I sell is true - can we all make mistakes - of course - but this autograph is real. It's ashame a few of you scared CS autions and we pulled the item.

What about the fact that the accompanying envelope has the adressee's name on it? And that the telegraph seems to be marked "received"? Wasn't it also common practice to have the receiving telegraph operator write the message out?

[Piedmont Sport]

Many times there were 2 copies and no it wasn't always common pratice for the receiving operator to write it out - lets be real - it's 2 sets of handwritting - look at the value of letters - slant - size - look at the T and G and compare to the body - also compare to similar Wright auto's - i have - Jim has and it's on point. Fact of the matter PSA/DNA also gave it a thumbs up and i could have ruined a piece of baseball history by cutting and mounting on a 3x5 - The debate can continue and I know everyone wants to say it's bad - it's popular to expound knowledge - but many staements in this blog are only assumptions without fact - while I respect each person - it's my opinion based on my experience and the professional knowledge and opinion of JSA - JIM SPENCE - I beleave this auto to be true -and i can't explain the receiving party or who wrote the body of the message - but i can say I did my best without destorying the telegram - So it's also noted i've been turned down on many other auto's Jimmy took with him. I went through similar agruments about grading cards.

[novakjr]

Both the content and the name are written in the exact same handwriting, that can clearly be seen...Keep in mind that it's also probably not an actual signature as it is more appropriately his name written so that it is perfectly legible to the people at the telegraph company. The first name does seem to fit his signature style as opposed to his handwriting though, maybe pointing to indecision as to whether or not he wanted to sign or script his name... He may or may not have even hand delivered it to the company himself. He possibly kept a small stack of slips and may have filled it out himself and had someone else do the footwork. I know if I was a busy guy, I'd have probably done the same.

Now as to the received stamp...I imagine both the initial slip and the one on the receiving end would both have been marked as received. Basically after delivery, it would've been communicated back to the original office and stamped there as well...That way a person could confirm that(and when) their telegram was received..

Anyways, I also like that the President and General Manager was "Albert B. Chandler". Yeah, I know, it's definitely not Happy, but still somewhat interesting. Maybe a relative? Possibly his namesake?

[19cbb]

And now on ebay...

http://cgi.ebay.com/1891-Telegram-SI...-/130473903110