O'Keeffe Daily News Article this Morning

[calvindog]

So how does one litigate without mentioning or revealing names after receiving information from said people? Protective order? Invisibility cloak?

PS: just counted: more posts on this thread (not including mine) about Corey's feelings than about Dave Forman's family being terrorized at night by Mastro's controller and about revelations of fraud against Mastro made by an ex-Mastro employee. Combined.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by calvindog

So how does one litigate without mentioning or revealing names after receiving information from said people? Protective order? Invisibility cloak?

PS: just counted: more posts on this thread (not including mine) about Corey's feelings than about Dave Forman's family being terrorized at night by Mastro's controller and about revelations of fraud against Mastro made by an ex-Mastro employee. Combined.

On the one hand, as it's just a pleading not evidence, perhaps "a NY collector" or "a prominent collector" would have sufficed. On the other hand, particularly where alleging fraud which has more stringent pleading requirements, most lawyers' inclination is to be as specific as possible including naming names.

[Leon]

I think it totally sucks what happened to Dave. I would be furious if I were him.

Also, the more that comes out, especially with some revelations today, the less sympathy I am having for some "friends" in the business.

As I told the authorities today, I hope every damn person in this hobby, who has committed fraud of any kind, gets their punishment and is forced to pay restitution. Some things in that article really pissed me off and I don't mind saying it. The hobby is still a great place but I sure hope it gets a lot of cleaning up this year. Something tells me there will be some bombshells going off in the not distant future. Maybe not imminent, but I would think certainly in the next year.

As an aside, the cleaner folks will reap the rewards of not being bad people. Sometimes I almost feel like it's going to end up being "the last man standing" wins.

[calvindog]

Leon, good for you -- that is much appreciated. I'm sure Dave feels the same.

[Exhibitman]

Hey, I know: let's start a trade organization to boost the image of the hobby in the public eye. We can orchestrate a fast response public relations effort to handle articles like this. I figure if we get 20 prominent dealers and investors to pony up $10,000 each...

[Peter_Spaeth]

Adam, the price of joining would probably be shilled up.

[Wesley]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Hey, I know: let's start a trade organization to boost the image of the hobby in the public eye. We can orchestrate a fast response public relations effort to handle articles like this. I figure if we get 20 prominent dealers and investors to pony up $10,000 each...

Your organization is more expensive than the one they were trying to set up at the National.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Wesley

Your organization is more expensive than the one they were trying to set up at the National.

franchise fees are costly.....

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Wesley

Your organization is more expensive than the one they were trying to set up at the National.

There were so many clamoring for admission that they had to raise the price to keep membership within reason.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Wesley

Your organization is more expensive than the one they were trying to set up at the National.

Hey, it costs money to build a smooth flack operation. Just the cost of background checks on possible board members for criminal records and civil lawsuits is like a grand a pop, but who'd be stupid enough to try and set up an operation to boost the integrity of the hobby fronted by guys who have to alert their parole officers when they come to meetings? That'd be like putting Tony Soprano on the board for the Policeman's Ball. It would be a laughingstock and DOA.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by Wesley

Your organization is more expensive than the one they were trying to set up at the National.

Wesley,

Adam's organization will offer lifetime, free parking at all, online meetings.


Adam,

If you need someone to "hold" the money, I'm your guy.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Hey, I know: let's start a trade organization to boost the image of the hobby in the public eye. We can orchestrate a fast response public relations effort to handle articles like this. I figure if we get 20 prominent dealers and investors to pony up $10,000 each...

Adam, good idea. You'll also need some fancy stationary on which are written vague threats to unnamed persons who dare to besmirch our great hobby. Because as you can see, vague threats really serve to shut up those pesky critics.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Adam, good idea. You'll also need some fancy stationary on which are written vague threats to unnamed persons who dare to besmirch our great hobby. Because as you can see, vague threats really serve to shut up those pesky critics.

It's those cranky people on chatboards that are the real problem. That is what those "hobby do-good" organizations are going to expose . Or do I have that backwards.....well, anyway, those organizations are going to include, ....I mean root out.....the bad guys!!

[Kenny Cole]

I do a lot of fraud cases. By virtue of the area in which I practice, I have a fraud count in at least half my cases. You always plead the who, what, when, where and why as specifically as possible to avoid motions to dismiss. That's just the way it is.

If my goal was to remain a low profile collector, I probably wouldn't be happy either. Unfortunately, when you become involved in an alleged fraudulent scheme, wittingly or unwittingly, that goal ends up being subordinate to the more important goal of facilitating the truth-finding process. And, as Jeff mentioned earlier, pleadings are open to the media unless there is a pretty compelling reason to seal them. The pleadings aren't evidence, they're just allegations. Either a judge or a jury will sort them out later.

Kenny Cole