Mastro Auctions Mastro's Stuff?

[calvindog]

Brian, you have an interesting take on the Mastro investigation. You primarily believe that the federal investigation of Mastro will be bad for our investments if the public learns that Bill Mastro is a crook. (Yes, that's probably true -- and it most certainly will cost me money if collectors who might be buying my cards in the future believe that they're overvalued due to such news.) So the alternative is that the laws of our country should not be applied to Bill Mastro and Doug Allen because such an application will cost all of us money? Apparently you and some other Net 54 members believe that. I don't. I'd rather live in a country where the laws are applied equally to all. If that means I'll lose some money, well, I'll be pointing a finger not at the federal government who is enforcing those laws but at the people who violated the laws. And take this from someone who earns a living fighting the government.

If charges of fraud are made and proven, yes, we'll have to 'pick up the pieces' as you say but perhaps it will be a first step in ridding our hobby of the rampant fraud which infects it. Imagine a hobby where you know that when a lot sells in an auction it really sold for that price, that you weren't defrauded along the way. Imagine a Net 54 where people with financial interests tied to wrongdoers won't contort themselves in all kinds of positions in an effort to divert and stifle criticism of the wrongdoers. I can. And at least until I'm banned from here I'll keep speaking out about these issues.

[brian1961]

Originally Posted by calvindog

So the alternative is that the laws of our country should not be applied to Bill Mastro and Doug Allen because such an application will cost all of us money? Apparently you and some other Net 54 members believe that. I don't. I'd rather live in a country where the laws are applied equally to all. If that means I'll lose some money, well, I'll be pointing a finger not at the federal government who is enforcing those laws but at the people who violated the laws. And take this from someone who earns a living fighting the government.

calvindog----I did not think I was coming across as if the laws of our land should not be applied to someone who is prominent or wealthy. Perish the thought.

In the first place many of you speak as if Mr. Mastro has already been found guilty of every single accusation. I'd rather live in a country where you are innocent until proven guilty. Then again, all you have to do is say, "OJ". I also believe Bruno Richard Hauptmann was innocent, and our country's judicial system just wanted a culprit. Still, tarring and feathering Bill and Doug verbally based on what the FBI is investigating them for with the understanding a la innuendo that any and all levels of questionable activity must of a certainty have been duly conducted with a system as thorough and far-reaching as the Mafia is reckless. When the findings come out, then I'm sure the leather-lunged will belt it out. (EXCEPT ME; I'M GETTING TI-RED OF THIS. ONE OR TWO OF YOU ARE PROBABLY FEELING THE SAME WAY ABOUT ME!)

Furthermore, WHILE I IN NO WAY CAN SPEAK FOR EVERYONE WHO WON AN ITEM IN A MASTRO AUCTION, during the course of the years that I participated in a Mastro Auction, and won several items, never did I get the impression that I overpaid. In some instances, I almost won them cheaply. I can think of several choice pieces that I gave up on, only to truly regret not bidding higher, as the items have since skyrocketed.

However, I must admit that I never put in an up to or ceiling bid. Why? I have never trusted that strategy of winning an item. It would be too easy for someone at the auction house to shill. Now cal, that is my own philosophy of bidding for any item, from EVERY auction house. I will gladly give up a great night's sleep to keep on top of the auction action.




If charges of fraud are made and proven, yes, we'll have to 'pick up the pieces' as you say but perhaps it will be a first step in ridding our hobby of the rampant fraud which infects it. Imagine a hobby where you know that when a lot sells in an auction it really sold for that price, that you weren't defrauded along the way.

----Calvindog, you speak as if most of the items were cranked due to shilling. Granted, by all means, I agree with you in the respect that you should only pay what was fairly bid. I feel the buyer's premiums have gotten too high, but that's an industry issue. Imagine a Net 54 where people with financial interests tied to wrongdoers won't contort themselves in all kinds of positions in an effort to divert and stifle criticism of the wrongdoers. Cal-----just so you know, in the small chance you should care, I only have one minor item consigned to Legendary's November auction. I can. And at least until I'm banned from here I'll keep speaking out about these issues.

The major issue that I am concerned with is the doctoring of cards. Though I do not collect uniforms, the finding by the Baseball Hall of Fame that the uniform of Joe Jackson was a fake was pretty interesting. I think with the value of these sports artifacts at a salty level on par with the Dead Sea, the temptation for fraud of various sorts arises within all kinds of con artists.


We shall see but we shall see. Thanks to Leon's reassurance, we can all continue to rant and even praise in freedom. Thanks for your perspective, calvindog. I sincerely admire and appreciate a good watchdog. If I have the wrong idea, I do want to be set straight. ---Brian Powell

[iggyman]

If that's the case, then lets forget all about Felix the Cat. Afterall, when was the last time he saved an industry? Jeff, I really do think that this little guy is more appropriate for you:

mouse.jpg

"Here I come to save the day!"

[Exhibitman]

As far as the damage to the card market presumed from the fallout of the FBI investigation, I am with Jeff on this: if that is the price of cleaning house and deterring further misadventures, so be it. I am a collector--I don't plan to sell my cards so whether the cards are 'worth' any specific price is meaningless to me; it is just theoretical, like appreciation on my house. Besides, if prices drop markedly I can buy more cards.

Price drop = calamity = investor

Price drop = opportunity to pick up more stuff = collector

[calvindog]

Adam, exactly. Which is why you won't be found twisting yourself into a pretzel with 'logic' trying to support the Mastros of this world, solely to protect either your investment, your possible future income, your potential job opportunity, or your good friends who have always been nice to you while they rob you blind.

It's not hard to pick out the people with the transparent agendas; just follow the dollars.

[Leon]

If I have heard it from one board member I have heard it from a hundred.......So many one trick ponies on this board, especially lawyers from NY . I hope they enjoy the hobby as much as I do. Giddy up....

[calvindog]

I'd rather be an honest pony than a Mastro monkey any day.