E98 Old Put reprint

[Tim Kindler]

Scott is correct. This is not a reprint or a fake E98 Old Put Back. It is simply a scan of my card. I won the only E98 Wagner with an Old Put Stamp in the 2007 REA auction. You can see a picture of the back of my Wagner on the SGC Registry with the rest of my Old Put Backs or go into REAs Archives. The scary thing is how real it looks. I know it is a scan of my card because of the chip above Wagner's head and the crease in the lower left bottom. Also, the Old Put Stamp is in the exact position as mine on the back, so we know it is a scan, not a fake stamp which was stamped on a reprint.

Here is my question? DM Sportscards, how thick is it? Is it on cardboard the thickness of a real E98? The back of it has been exagerated in its staining. My Wagner, the real one, is much whiter/cleaner on the back. It doesn't have a stain line where the crease is on the lower corner.

This is the reason why I had a thread going last May where we tried to document all existing Old Put Backs in existence. I tried to get a scan of all the existing ones out there as well. This will help all of us, buyers, sellers, auction houses, grading companies, etc. authenticate real E98s with an Old Put back. As I stated in that thread, I'm not saying that when one pops up in the future it is a fake, but it will have to be highly scrutinized without the provenance of its previous documentation.

This is where we left off with the thread. The names/owners of the cards are on the previous thread therefore, I put them on this post. If you have any to add or scans please provide:

5 Blues with an Old Put back
1. Clarke Leon's
2. Dooin Mine, I purchased from Rob A. this summer.
3. Dooin Collector who wishes to be anonymous
4. Kling Collector who wished to be anonymous


14 Reds with an Old Put back
1. Chance On the SGC Registry
2. Cobb Mine SGC 40 Bought REA 2009
3. Wagner Mine SGC 30 Bought REA 2007
4. Brown Mine SGC 30 Bought from Toby Peterson 2007, from H & S 2007
5. Brown Collector who wishes to be anonymous
6. McGraw Mine SGC 30 Bought 19th Century Only 2009, Used to be Rob
Adesso's I believe
7. Young Mine SGC 30 Bought from Scott Brockelman 2008
8. Collins Mine PSA 2 Bought from Mastro 2008
9. Bresnahan Leon's
10. Myers I saw it in a Festberg Auction around 2000 I think.
11. Clarke It was TBOB's but it was lost in shipping. (Sorry to bring that
up again Bob) If it comes up again, IT IS BOB's!
12. Vaughn Board member gabinus
13. Mack Bruce Babcock's
14. Mullin Board member Hal Kaplan provided a scan of it, but he stated
that it is not his card.

Well, that is 18 total confirmed. Of course there are probably more out there, but these are the ones our forum members have confirmed.

[barrysloate]

Tim- you might want to email the seller and ask him why he feels he has the right to steal your scan and then sell it as some kind of reprint. This is a bad trend that should be stopped.

[Tim Kindler]

Barry,
I totally agree with you that this is not a good thing happening in our hobby.
It is pretty sad. But I guess it has been going on for years. When I was a kid I used to get reprints of the classic cards in my elementary book orders that were reprints. Some company was making money of those images then.
The only difference here I guess, is that this is a one-of-a-kind which can be easily seen through the flaws on the card, not just a generic image of a classic card.

But really, what can I do about it? Yes it is my card, but the image is out there in cyberspace and on places like REAs site. I own the card, but do I own the image? Does anyone know what really can be done, if anything?

At least he said it was a reprint. Some Richard Cranium with the ID bigbadgodofwar1 on iOFFER was trying to sell a reprint of my card for $15,000. Of course after I confronted him with an email he put out there in cyberspace that I was threatening him and that I needed to back off, even though I never saw the card again on iOffer.

Tim Kindler

[barrysloate]

You're right Tim, there probably is little you can do. Even if he agrees to stop selling it, there are hundreds of others who will do the same thing.

[Kawika]

Richard Cranium. Good one. Hadn't heard it before. Reminded me of General Scheisskopf in Catch-22. The esteemed Rawoysterman has been doing the same thing with some of my cards as Tim's E98 guy. I posted about it last month (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=119646). No laws broken as far as I know, just a little more douchebaggery in a hobby lousy with it already.

[Leon]

I think the "other one" I was thinking of, on the Blue Old Puts, were those two that were documented before, the Kling and Dooin....which a board member sent me years ago and then again last time we were talking about it. So, you can edit that part of the blues. I don't think I have known of any besides those 2 and my 1...other than what you documented. I am sure there are more out there....