Possible newly discovered T205 variation

[egbeachley]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

Tell that to the T206 Demmitt and O'Hara collectors, which variations are only available on Polar Bear backed T206 cards.

I think they know it's a St Louis variation for front collectors. No variation for PB collectors.

Well, assuming they know there isn't a non-St Louis PB back.

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by egbeachley

I think they know it's a St Louis variation for front collectors. No variation for PB collectors.

Well, assuming they know there isn't a non-St Louis PB back.

I'm a little confused --

All Polar Bear T206 Demmitts are the St. Louis variation. Purely from a printing variation perspective, how is that any different from all Polar Bear T205 Doc Whites not having the quotation marks?

[marcdelpercio]

I think the bottom line is that the text and image of the card was intended to be identical regardless of the brand advertisement on the back. I believe that any difference in the text or image of the card should rightfully and by definition be considered a "variation" regardless of whether this appears on only one back.

I think the example of the T206 Polar Bear Demmitt and O'Hara cards is perfectly appropriate here. What does it matter whether the "variation" appears on the front or back of the card? These cards appear with only one back advertisement so if the T205 Doc White Polar Bear card is not a variation, it is impossible to assert that the T206 Polar Bear Demmitt and O'Hara are variations.

There are several quite valuable variations in the T205 set that appear with only one back. To those who honestly do not believe that these are legitimate variations, I will generously offer to pay 150% of book value (of the lower priced variation) for all of your copies of these cards. If you truly believe what you are stating, the offers should begin rolling in pretty quickly.

[Wite3]

My thoughts on the mater....
The Doc White is a variation of the text. It is found on one advertiser.

The big differences here is the perception that it is somehow rare. It is not. It is common. Both ways are fairly common.

The Wilhelm was short printed greatly. This is what causes the value differences. Not the variations. (Same with the Demmit/O'Hara cards in T206s...it is not the variation that causes the value increase it is the print run). Many team, pose variations exist in the T206 and the value is the same for them unless they were short printed or rare.

I personally do not do the registry thing but I feel that if the T205 Matty or White is listed with the advertising type on the slip then that is all you will need. Sounds like people are trying to create value for their sets where none really exists.

Joshua

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Wite3

(Same with the Demmit/O'Hara cards in T206s...it is not the variation that causes the value increase it is the print run).

IMO with Demmitt & O'Hara it's exactly the variation that causes the value increase; there are many other Polar Bear T206s that are only printed in the laster series like the Demmitt and O'Hara and are equally as shortprinted, but carry little to no premium because their text is identical to their Piedmont version. People chasing the T206 master set drive the price of the Demmitt and O'Hara and likewise do/will with the T205 Wilhelm, Matty and to a lesser extent Latham and White when they are cataloged as part of a complete master set.

[marcdelpercio]

Originally Posted by Wite3

The Wilhelm was short printed greatly. This is what causes the value differences. Not the variations. (Same with the Demmit/O'Hara cards in T206s...it is not the variation that causes the value increase it is the print run).

Joshua,
You make some very good points and I certainly respect all of the research you have done on this set. I do have to slightly disagree with your analysis, however, that it is not the variation that causes the value.

To use the T206 Demmitt and O'Hara example, these cards had the same print run as all other Polar Bear 350 only series cards and are presumably equally scarce. If not for the variation (team change), these cards would be looked at as commons, just as the other PB 350 only series cards. Conversely, if it was only the print run that determined the value, all other PB 350 series T206's would command similar values as the Demmitt and O'Hara. Clearly, in this case it is strictly the variation that causes the increased demand and thus, higher value.

I think the same principle applies to some of the T205 variations. While I do not believe the T205 Doc White (no quotes) variation is very scarce or valuable, I do believe that it will command a premium as, by your own tracking numbers, it appears to be about 2-3 times as scarce in total as the other version.

[Mrc32]

Great thread. Another reason I enjoy this set so much.

[Wite3]

Just to clarify...the Polar Bear advertising is the most commonly found back on Doc White in my research. It is not scarce.

Joshua