Most undervalued HOFers

[Brent G.]

Originally Posted by vintage321

1) musial
2) steve carlton
3) bob gibson

Just noticed recently how cheap Gibson autos are.

[Balticfox]

Jim Kaat, Luis Aparicio, Nellie Fox, Ernie Banks and Bobby Richardson are five more names that have not been mentioned. Check out their Gold Glove wins as well as their other numbers.

[ValKehl]

Most undervalued? Edgar Charles "Sam" Rice, of course!! Except for Walter Johnson, no player had a greater career with the Washington Senators than Sam Rice! Okay, I realize this isn't saying much!

[molenick]

Originally Posted by Balticfox

Jim Kaat, Luis Aparicio, Nellie Fox, Ernie Banks and Bobby Richardson are five more names that have not been mentioned. Check out their Golden Glove wins as well as their other numbers.

Bobby Richardson is probably a favorite of many because he played on some great Yankee teams, and he did win five Gold Glove awards. And I think he is the only player to win a World Series MVP while playing on a losing team (1960).

But he is not in the Hall of Fame and his offensive numbers are not good: .266/.299/.335 for old school slash numbers and .634 OPS, 77 OPS+ new school.

The other choices seems like good ways to get a HOFer from a set without paying too much (although I feel like Banks is more expensive). There are several players from different eras where you can get a HOF type card without it being too costly: Wallace, Sewell, Bancroft, Averill, Haines, Ferrell, Slaughter, etc., etc.

I don't know if that means they are undervalued...but if you want a HOFer, they will cost less than many others.

[Balticfox]

Originally Posted by molenick

Bobby Richardson is probably a favorite of many because he played on some great Yankee teams....

I included Richardson in my list despite that detail.

[John1941]

Eddie Yost, Bucky Walters, Johnny Bassler, and Bobby Grich are undervalued in my opinion, to name just a few.

Also, why are we talking about Bobby Richardson in a thread about undervalued players? Ron Hansen was better than Richardson. Bobby Knoop was better than Richardson. Jim Landis was better than Richardson. Mark Belanger was way better than Richardson

If anything, Richardson is overvalued because he's a Yankee whose stats are superficially impressive because post-Stengel Yankee managers batted him leadoff for some inexplicable reason. Richardson received MVP votes six different years, including a second place finish in 1962, as a mediocre player. He was a very good fielder, but so were the others I've mentioned, and they were much better hitters than him.

[packs]

On the pitching tip, I'll throw Lefty Grove's name out there. He's one of the more anonymous 300 game winners despite winning an MVP, two Triple Crowns and leading the league in ERA and ERA+ 9 times in his career.

He's hurt by having fewer cards than most but even the cards considered to be his rookies (DeLong, Goudey, Diamond Stars) are typically affordable in even mid-grade.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by packs

On the pitching tip, I'll throw Lefty Grove's name out there. He's one of the more anonymous 300 game winners despite winning an MVP, two Triple Crowns and leading the league in ERA and ERA+ 9 times in his career.

He's hurt by having fewer cards than most but even the cards considered to be his rookies (DeLong, Goudey, Diamond Stars) are typically affordable in even mid-grade.

Bill James rated Grove the third best pitcher behind Johnson and (yep) Paige. His US Caramel is before the cards you mentioned if you buy the 1932 date, but even then he has other cards dating back to 1921 IIRC. All that said, he doesn't get much love. Maybe because his raw numbers like ERA were high due to the nature of the game at that point.

[Balticfox]

Originally Posted by John1941

Also, why are we talking about Bobby Richardson in a thread about undervalued players?

If anything, Richardson is overvalued because he's a Yankee whose stats are superficially impressive because post-Stengel Yankee managers batted him leadoff for some inexplicable reason.

I'm first and foremost a Yankee hater when it comes to baseball myself. The reason though that I mentioned Bobby Richardson is that I just looked through the list of Gold Glove winners and I saw Bobby Richardson's name five times from 1961 to 1965. And haven't we all been told since we were kids that fielding is half the game?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Bobby Richardson CAREER WAR -- 8.0.
Next undervalued player please?

[jingram058]

Chuck Klein.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by jingram058

Chuck Klein.

I came here to say this, but from an autograph perspective. He passed away young, was nearly non-responsive through the mail and additionally had others signing mail requests on his behalf. Being a Phillie on some truly awful teams certainly didn't help matters any. Adding to this is how little he was appreciated post-career and how it took decades for him to be inducted. It feels like he's truly forgotten about. Finding his autograph on anything decent, even a nice index card, is actually quite the challenge. He's usually encountered on multi-signed album pages which can be had for what I feel is a pittance.

Another fellow who deserves more value is Hugh Duffy. While he was with the Red Sox for so long after his playing days and was responsive to autograph requests, it seems as though he simply wasn't flooded with as much mail as other HOFers of his era who also passed in the 1950's. It's just strange to me. Another factor to consider regarding Duffy's autograph is that there is so often some sort of condition flaw; be it a smear, a bad pen, or simply an unappealing autograph due to advancements of Duffy's age. Finding a nice signature on any medium is always more difficult.

[RayBShotz]

All Pitchers.

Such an undervalued aspect of the hobby is the hitter value bias.

The pitchers are such an important part of the history of the game and one of the biggest reasons I have followed the sport all my life.
Only a very few are fairly valued.
Bu that could just be me.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by RayBShotz

All Pitchers.

Such an undervalued aspect of the hobby is the hitter value bias.

The pitchers are such an important part of the history of the game and one of the biggest reasons I have followed the sport all my life.
Only a very few are fairly valued.
Bu that could just be me.

This.

Especially for postwar vintage. For pitchers not named Koufax or Ryan, most cards besides rookies in nice shape are unbelievably affordable. This includes:

Ford
Feller
Spahn
Marichal
Gibson
Seaver
Palmer
Perry
Carlton
Jenkins

And doubtless others I'm failing to mention.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by RayBShotz

All Pitchers.

All?! That's a preposterous, blanket statement.

Have you seen what even beat-up Leaf Paige "RCs" that aren't even really RCs have been selling for? There are countless examples, but the value of this card confounds me considering it's not even a true RC.

[Brent G.]

Originally Posted by BillyCoxDodgers3B

All?! That's a preposterous, blanket statement.

Have you seen what even beat-up Leaf Paige "RCs" that aren't even really RCs have been selling for? There are countless examples, but the value of this card confounds me considering it's not even a true RC.

With his story and so few cards, I think Satch is in a class of his own.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by BillyCoxDodgers3B

All?! That's a preposterous, blanket statement.

Have you seen what even beat-up Leaf Paige "RCs" that aren't even really RCs have been selling for? There are countless examples, but the value of this card confounds me considering it's not even a true RC.

If you are basing the value on the fact that it's a "RC", you are missing the point. It's valued the way it is because it's (supposedly) a very short print in a tough set. How short of a print it is and how rare it actually is may be debatable, but I think the fact that it's Paige's first card in a nationally issued set may be relatively down on the list. Same with the Bob Feller in that set, which is most definitely not a RC.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

If you are basing the value on the fact that it's a "RC", you are missing the point. It's valued the way it is because it's (supposedly) a very short print in a tough set. How short of a print it is and how rare it actually is may be debatable, but I think the fact that it's Paige's first card in a nationally issued set may be relatively down on the list. Same with the Bob Feller in that set, which is most definitely not a RC.

I appreciate the insight and clarification. At the same time, its value assurdely still has much to do with the fact that it depicts Paige as opposed to Andy Lapihuska. Therefore, brining it back to the point that stating all (or nearly all) HOF pitchers' cards are undervalued makes no sense. Some? Sure, but the same can be said of even more non-pitchers.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by Brent G.

Just noticed recently how cheap Gibson autos are.

Doesn't mean they are undervalued per se though. That dude signed a ton. So did Bob Feller.