Ohtani CARDS are Mostly UNDERVALUED

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Carter08

Ohtani and Judge probably the two best hitters in the game. Judge has never pitched to my knowledge.

At least for now, Soto is in that discussion IMO.

[conor912]

Undervalued? Seems to me that first ballot HOF entry is already 1000% baked into everything of his. Every single one of his 100 million cards printed is being treated like gold.

[packs]

I don't think the comparisons to Babe Ruth will ever be in the realm of realistic but Ohtani is clearly playing well above expectations and is in a class of his own in the modern game. But there is no comparing to Ruth. Nobody will ever compare to Ruth.

Ruth hit 59 home runs but he also batted 378 that year. The year he hit 60 he batted 356. He's a career 342 hitter with 714 home runs. Nobody will ever be that good.

And now a card:

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Such a disgusting autograph. With his star power, I wish he'd put a little bit into his own brand by at least adding some recognizable style to it.

Jeter's autograph is not up my alley, either, but you can at least spot it from a mile away. Even Trout's "autograph" is recognizable to so many (can't even be bothered to lift the Sharpie up between a whopping two-lettered autograph). Everyone is so concerned about their "brand". Definitely an overused, nausea-inducing term, but a stylistic, if not even legible autograph should be a part of that. That thing shown above is just a scrawl that an angry toddler could convincingly emulate without even meaning to.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by BillyCoxDodgers3B

Such a disgusting autograph. With his star power, I wish he'd put a little bit into his own brand by at least adding some recognizable style to it.

Jeter's autograph is not up my alley, either, but you can at least spot it from a mile away. Even Trout's "autograph" is recognizable to so many (can't even be bothered to lift the Sharpie up between a whopping two-lettered autograph). Everyone is so concerned about their "brand". Definitely an overused, nausea-inducing term, but a stylistic, if not even legible autograph should be a part of that. That thing shown above is just a scrawl that an angry toddler could convincingly emulate without even meaning to.

90 percent or more of modern players sign like this.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

90 percent or more of modern players sign like this.

Doesn't make it right. And precisely why I quit collecting current players' autographs nearly 30 years ago.

[Peter_Spaeth]

...

[Yoda]

Originally Posted by BillyCoxDodgers3B

Such a disgusting autograph. With his star power, I wish he'd put a little bit into his own brand by at least adding some recognizable style to it.

Jeter's autograph is not up my alley, either, but you can at least spot it from a mile away. Even Trout's "autograph" is recognizable to so many (can't even be bothered to lift the Sharpie up between a whopping two-lettered autograph). Everyone is so concerned about their "brand". Definitely an overused, nausea-inducing term, but a stylistic, if not even legible autograph should be a part of that. That thing shown above is just a scrawl that an angry toddler could convincingly emulate without even meaning to.

I couldn't agree more. The hen scratching that so many stars call their autograph demonstrates their pumped up egos. Compare the Otani sample to, say, Charlie Gehringer.

[BioCRN]

Originally Posted by Yoda

I couldn't agree more. The hen scratching that so many stars call their autograph demonstrates their pumped up egos. Compare the Otani sample to, say, Charlie Gehringer.

It would be one thing if they lived in an era where they're at the park signing and occasionally at shows/events, but when you're signing 1000s of cards on contract many times a year we're no longer in an era where your autograph can expected be a work of art.

Andre Dawson's autograph might look a lot different if at age 20 he signed a few thousand cards a year for many different card companies.

In a way, the card and memorabilia industry ruined autographs.

Not baseball, but here's John Cena signing some autographs..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j8F3_rKCU8

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by BioCRN

It would be one thing if they lived in an era where they're at the park signing and occasionally at shows/events, but when you're signing 1000s of cards on contract many times a year we're no longer in an era where your autograph can expected be a work of art.

Andre Dawson's autograph might look a lot different if at age 20 he signed a few thousand cards a year for many different card companies.

In a way, the card and memorabilia industry ruined autographs.

Not baseball, but here's John Cena signing some autographs..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j8F3_rKCU8

That's nuts. Puts things into perspective a bit.

[seanofjapan]

Originally Posted by BillyCoxDodgers3B

Such a disgusting autograph. With his star power, I wish he'd put a little bit into his own brand by at least adding some recognizable style to it.

Jeter's autograph is not up my alley, either, but you can at least spot it from a mile away. Even Trout's "autograph" is recognizable to so many (can't even be bothered to lift the Sharpie up between a whopping two-lettered autograph). Everyone is so concerned about their "brand". Definitely an overused, nausea-inducing term, but a stylistic, if not even legible autograph should be a part of that. That thing shown above is just a scrawl that an angry toddler could convincingly emulate without even meaning to.

Agreed. In Ohtani’s case his autograph in Japanese is way more legible and he actually writes out each character. It was only when he started doing his autograph in English that it became a mess, probably because he was just copying the sloppy way everyone else was doing it.

Sadaharu Oh’s approach was way different, his autograph in English is easier to read than his Japanese one. Times have changed.

[JollyElm]

Originally Posted by seanofjapan

Agreed. In Ohtani’s case his autograph in Japanese is way more legible and he actually writes out each character.

Wow, that brings up an interesting question from this gaijin (had to look that one up). Is there a loose 'script' way of writing Japanese characters? The way an autograph in English doesn't comply with what each letter 'should' look like? That sorta thing?

[seanofjapan]

Originally Posted by JollyElm

Wow, that brings up an interesting question from this gaijin (had to look that one up). Is there a loose 'script' way of writing Japanese characters? The way an autograph in English doesn't comply with what each letter 'should' look like? That sorta thing?

There is, but it doesn’t get used much in autographs.

Ichiro is a good example. His name is formally written in kanji characters as 一郎 and is a fairly common first name. But when his name is written in Japanese they always used the simplified katakana characters as イチロー.

But his signature in Japanese is just a huge mess of squiggly lines and I can’t tell which version he is trying to write.

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

At least for now, Soto is in that discussion IMO.

Betts and Witt too. Henderson knocking on the door.

[packs]

Mookie Betts is a good player but he's no Aaron Judge. Even at his peak he is overshadowed:

Betts MVP season: 186 OPS+ - pretty incredible year BUT
Judge MVP season: 210 OPS+ and his OPS+ right now is even better at 226

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by packs

Mookie Betts is a good player but he's no Aaron Judge. Even at his peak he is overshadowed:

Betts MVP season: 186 OPS+ - pretty incredible year BUT
Judge MVP season: 210 OPS+ and his OPS+ right now is even better at 226

69.1 WAR and he's only 31. That's more than a "good" player.

[packs]

Sure but he's not Aaron Judge even on his best day and that was my point.

[BigfootIsReal]

IF the Dodgers allow Ohtani to pitch again, I'll take Ohtani over Judge every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

[packs]

As a complete player sure but my comment was in reference to who the best hitter in baseball is. I believe it is Judge.

Soto put up a 200 OPS+ in 2020 during a short season. I think you have to go all the way back to Frank Thomas in 1994 to find the last 200 OPS+ season and that was still a strike shortened season.

I am purposely excluding Bonds / McGwire / Sosa for reasons I think are clear.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by BigfootIsReal

IF the Dodgers allow Ohtani to pitch again, I'll take Ohtani over Judge every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

You can have him! I'll take the judge!

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Carter08

Betts and Witt too. Henderson knocking on the door.

Witt is too young IMO to make any judgments yet.