Safeguards at shows

[steve B]

Originally Posted by ClementeFanOh

SteveB- I’m afraid I disagree completely with your remark that showing ID to a show employee, would be like giving a Christmas list to thieves. The show employer/ID person is the least of someone’s worries at a card show. And a name and photo that matches the attendee, isn’t vital or sensitive information. I get it that some people just don’t want others to know who they are- even when they are legitimate in their attendance. I also know that resistance to something so basic is exactly the kind of thing that makes it difficult to provide the “better security” most people want. It won’t come without cost. The question the individual would need to answer within, is if showing a photo ID is actually a “cost”. Trent King

Showing an ID isn't a problem. Hopefully they have enough ticket/door staff to handle it.

When they start saving that data anywhere is when it becomes a security concern. Even a temporary list of attendees with their address is something a house breaker would probably be very interested in.
Include the full drivers license info or full info from all Ids, and it's not only a catalog of who might have cards or other stuff worth stealing, and when they will be out -obviously the next show- but a list that's saleable in many ways, many of them illegal.

And if you don't save the ID info even temporarily? I have no idea what value the fact that you'd looked at IDs would have to someone investigating a crime.
Nothing but meaningless security theater.

Yes, I do slightly worry about the door prize slips you fill out for a mailing list to be sent a notice about the next show, but you can usually opt out of putting your physical address.

[ClementeFanOh]

LEHR- if you truly believe that showing an ID I “jumping through a hoop”, then you may be part of the problem rather than the solution. The effort- if that’s even the right word- required to open a wallet and display a card is minimal. Jeesh…. Steve B- I didn’t state, nor would I want, ID checkers to copy a license or passport at the door. I’d suggest they make sure the photo on the ID matches the person holding it, and perhaps (I don’t run card shows) write name and ID type on a legal pad/IPad. That’s it, nothing more. Such an effort isn’t “meaningless security theater” IF it’s done diligently. It may well discourage potential thieves from even attempting the crime in the first place. The idea is for a combination of dealer vigilance and more formal security measures to put a dent in theft. The idea is sound, it breaks down only when promoters/dealers/customers insist that security is up to everyone but themselves. I don’t claim to have all the answers; however, pushing the problem or balking at basic concepts simply helps the bad guys. Trent King

[Rich Klein]

Is one of my friends had his "fanny pack full of cash" stolen from behind his table when the person next to him invited a whole bunch of people behind their table.

In this case, there was not a vendor pass or anything else required and it was a pure robbery of cash. Thankfully he could absorb the financial loss but it was a major wake up call for the DCS people.
'
So that theft may actually in retrospect help solve this theft.

Rich

[LEHR]

Originally Posted by ClementeFanOh

LEHR- if you truly believe that showing an ID I “jumping through a hoop”, then you may be part of the problem rather than the solution. The effort- if that’s even the right word- required to open a wallet and display a card is minimal. Jeesh….

Once again you completely missed the point someone was trying to make.
Why should I have to take any extra steps when the burden of security should rely on the show promotor and the dealer. Hire more/better security. Actually be accountable for your inventory. And I'm not trying to be part of the solution as it's not my problem to solve.
Showing ID is just a Band-Aid for a much bigger problem and I also don't trust that a show promotor wouldn't sell my information if they could make a buck. We know this hobby is just full of upstanding citizens.

Just my $0.02. You don't have to agree with it.

[Yoda]

Given the lax gun laws in Texas, I wonder how many dealers were packing? I know I would draw down on some guy walking away with my case holding a couple of million bucks worth of some of the most precious cards in the hobby, while yelling for security, if there was any, at the top of my lungs.
Some 15 years on, I am still haunted by a theft at my table at a Ft. Washington show. Can't imagine how Ash feels.

[Johnny630]

Dealers could be packing but you're not going to be pulling your weapon on someone for just stealing/walking off with your merchandise. I'm all for lawful carry and protecting yourself but in this case a gun would have done nothing.

[sb1]

This was not an $80 or 100 card it was $2million worth. In our booth we have a police officer/dealer and another dealer with conceal carry and armed. Also there are Allen police officers in all parts of the building during show hours. Apparently not any after the show closes.

[G1911]

I'm a little disturbed some people appear to think that drawing a gun or shooting a snatch and grab thief at a card show is somehow realistic or appropriate. It's not in any way a reasonable response to a card thief in a room crowded with innocent people. Come on

[ClementeFanOh]

LEHR- You went from opinion to fact, and blew it. I have not "missed the
point". The point is that a hobby consisting of involvement from multiple
groups of people (hobbyists/dealers/show promoters), that is confronted by
a potentially serious problem affecting each group, can't simply pass the
problem to one group if they wish to address that problem fully and well.

Your take is, sadly, somewhat typical of a segment of the hobby: there's a
problem, I don't want to be stung by it, but I'm not willing to lift the
smallest finger to address it. The notion that showing a photo ID is
somehow supposed to be taxing and extraordinary is absurd, it makes no
sense. A person's "2 cents" must have some basis in reality, even if slight,
to be taken seriously. It's obvious this is everyone's problem rather than
everybody else's problem but mine. The issue is how best to resolve it.

Trent King

[LEHR]

Originally Posted by ClementeFanOh

LEHR- You went from opinion to fact, and blew it. I have not "missed the
point". The point is that a hobby consisting of involvement from multiple
groups of people (hobbyists/dealers/show promoters), that is confronted by
a potentially serious problem affecting each group, can't simply pass the
problem to one group if they wish to address that problem fully and well.

Your take is, sadly, somewhat typical of a segment of the hobby: there's a
problem, I don't want to be stung by it, but I'm not willing to lift the
smallest finger to address it. The notion that showing a photo ID is
somehow supposed to be taxing and extraordinary is absurd, it makes no
sense. A person's "2 cents" must have some basis in reality, even if slight,
to be taken seriously. It's obvious this is everyone's problem rather than
everybody else's problem but mine. The issue is how best to resolve it.

Trent King

Trent,

You're trying to make someone else's problem everyone's problem.
Example: If someone breaks into my house and steals my safe, is that my neighbors problem? Hell no. I should have had installed a better security system, I should have bolted the safe to the floor as an added deterrent, or I should have let fewer people know about the safe to begin with. I'm not going to run out and start a neighborhood watch and waste everyone else's time over my problem. It's called personal accountability which is also lacking for a lot of people.

And as far as the ID's go, I was making fake ID's at 16 and even given the technological advances, I bet I could make a pretty convincing one now given the time. Do you really think the 17 year old kid or 51 year old mom of four manning the doors at these card shows are going to know the difference in real of fake ID, or even give a rats ass? It's not like show promotors are hiring TSA agents to screen you as you walk in.

But regardless, we will never see eye to eye on this so there's no sense in going back and forth, so this will be my last response. Please come back in a year or two and post on this thread to let us know about how your ID idea saved the hobby from the boogieman.