Memory lane auction results last night

[raulus]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It's like buying any other commodity -- you expect the price to go up, or hope so anyway.

Maybe beyond that, you like nice stuff, and prefer it when the nice stuff has been acknowledged by an authority on the matter. Just how much it’s appropriate to rely on the authority is a matter of personal conviction. But obviously in the marketplace, the results suggest that the level of reliance is fairly high.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by raulus

Maybe beyond that, you like nice stuff, and prefer it when the nice stuff has been acknowledged by an authority on the matter. Just how much it’s appropriate to rely on the authority is a matter of personal conviction. But obviously in the marketplace, the results suggest that the level of reliance is fairly high.

I guess that's the sad part. The level of reliance on something that is proving (or already proven) to be more and more unreliable and apathetically accepted by a community of impaired collectors that seem to be blinded by it all.

Sorry, but in the end this has impacted a lot of collectors and turned a hobby that used to be fun into a circus sideshow.

It would be nice if the TPGs actually did what they were supposed to do. Kind of hard for the main TPG to say that they were trying to improve the hobby when the first card they encapsulated was a sham.

Sorry for the rant.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Fred

I guess that's the sad part. The level of reliance on something that is proving (or already proven) to be more and more unreliable and apathetically accepted by a community of impaired collectors that seem to be blinded by it all.

Sorry, but in the end this has impacted a lot of collectors and turned a hobby that used to be fun into a circus sideshow.

It would be nice if the TPGs actually did what they were supposed to do. Kind of hard for the main TPG to say that they were trying to improve the hobby when the first card they encapsulated was a sham.

Sorry for the rant.

Just once, I would love to eee who is consigning these high end cards that people are so dazzled by.

[Snapolit1]

I dont understand why grading would ruin the hobby for people who profess they don’t care about grading. That makes no sense to me.

Just collect what you want to collect.

[trambo]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

I dont understand why grading would ruin the hobby for people who profess they don’t care about grading. That makes no sense to me.

Just collect what you want to collect.

Agree w/this 100%.

[jsfriedm]

Small sample size, but when it comes to high grade T205s, that is always the case. The PSA 7 T205 Cy Young sold for $53,874 - exact same card sold in ML in October 2021 for $110,084, so over 50% drop. The PSA 8 T205 Speaker sold for $30,508, while one sold in Heritage in November 2021 for $49,200, so nearly 40% drop.

[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by jsfriedm

Small sample size, but when it comes to high grade T205s, that is always the case. The PSA 7 T205 Cy Young sold for $53,874 - exact same card sold in ML in October 2021 for $110,084, so over 50% drop. The PSA 8 T205 Speaker sold for $30,508, while one sold in Heritage in November 2021 for $49,200, so nearly 40% drop.

This is with reposting.

But here is VCP data on the last several t205 Speaker PSA 8 sales. I think that November 2021 could be a major outlier, and we would all agree that the result the other night is great compared to these other results

Also not that the recent sale is not (hopefully, yet) in VCP

[trambo]

Originally Posted by jsfriedm

Small sample size, but when it comes to high grade T205s, that is always the case. The PSA 7 T205 Cy Young sold for $53,874 - exact same card sold in ML in October 2021 for $110,084, so over 50% drop. The PSA 8 T205 Speaker sold for $30,508, while one sold in Heritage in November 2021 for $49,200, so nearly 40% drop.

But don't forget about the 3rd t205 PSA 8 (Mordecai Brown) that sold in the auction for about $17.5k. That was about a 20% increase over the December 2023 sale price for a similar 8 of that card.

T205 high grades are a little different than t206 at auction, I think as the PSA 7 and higher t205s are much, much more difficult than t206 in similar grades. I looked at all 3 of the t205s and all would be upgrades for me (I have 7 Speaker, 6 Young, 7 Brown). I knew the Young would be about a $50k card and thought it sold the right level. Speaker I pegged around $25-$30k and the Brown at around $15k. I went for the Brown only because I liked the card and knew the potential for the other two to go nuts again left me not wanting to even remotely chase those.

As for the price drop on the other two from your post, I followed both of those auctions based on where my t205 set was and is grade wise. The Young sale went absolutely nuts on the last day and it felt like two people ultimately having a measuring contest to see who was bigger. I had hoped to score that card for price that was more in line w/the sale before. The Speaker was not as crazy but similar. and I didn't chase that one at all since I like my PSA 7 Speaker. I chalk neither of those up to any downturn in the market but just two guys deciding to play a game of chicken and had unlimited funds to do so.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

I dont understand why grading would ruin the hobby for people who profess they don’t care about grading. That makes no sense to me.

Just collect what you want to collect.

Grading has brought out the "competitive" wallets that "have to have the best". Nothing wrong with that except the result is auction hammer prices that have marked increases which leads to investors driving up the price of the top graded cards which then leads to an increase in price to the lower grade material which drives the price up on everything which makes "people that don't care" if the card is raw or graded pay more for something that used to be much less. You've heard the saying "A rising tide lifts all boats".

It's probably the evolution of the hobby. However it would help if the TPGs actually did what they were supposed to do, without bias and with an adherence to published "industry standards" (which includes actually making a determination cards are TRIMMED).

I can predict the thoughts of some that believe that TPGs do more good than not. To that I say, try to find an old auction catalog that had a collection of T206s from a famous collector and then attempt to tell yourself that many of the cards in the TPG holders were not trimmed. This is from the earlier days of grading which would indicate there was bias and a bit too much "subjectivity" in grading from the beginning and one couldn't imagine things have changed much since then.

I think a lot of collectors are waiting/hoping for the bubble to pop and then see a precipitous drop in interest in what was once a hobby.

However, I could be wrong.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by Fred

I think a lot of collectors are waiting/hoping for the bubble to pop and then see a precipitous drop in interest in what was once a hobby.

Even some of us set registry goons are waiting/hoping for more affordability.

[Snapolit1]

Everyone has their own opinion on these things. I do not believe that the bat shit crazy market for Ricky Henderson rookie PSA 10's has raised the interest level or market value one iota of raw cards or the same card in a PSA 1, 2 , etc. Maybe it has raised the value of PSA 9, as speculators think that they will break it out and go for a 10.

Rising tide pf the grading game may have lifted a few boats. Not all of them.

Originally Posted by Fred

Grading has brought out the "competitive" wallets that "have to have the best". Nothing wrong with that except the result is auction hammer prices that have marked increases which leads to investors driving up the price of the top graded cards which then leads to an increase in price to the lower grade material which drives the price up on everything which makes "people that don't care" if the card is raw or graded pay more for something that used to be much less. You've heard the saying "A rising tide lifts all boats".

It's probably the evolution of the hobby. However it would help if the TPGs actually did what they were supposed to do, without bias and with an adherence to published "industry standards" (which includes actually making a determination cards are TRIMMED).

I can predict the thoughts of some that believe that TPGs do more good than not. To that I say, try to find an old auction catalog that had a collection of T206s from a famous collector and then attempt to tell yourself that many of the cards in the TPG holders were not trimmed. This is from the earlier days of grading which would indicate there was bias and a bit too much "subjectivity" in grading from the beginning and one couldn't imagine things have changed much since then.

I think a lot of collectors are waiting/hoping for the bubble to pop and then see a precipitous drop in interest in what was once a hobby.

However, I could be wrong.

[Republicaninmass]

Yeaaaa

NOBODY would overpay and submit 10 psa 9s for review to try for a 10. Cracked or otherwise.

Sarcasm...in