1952 topps Mantle how can this be real

[JustinD]

ooh, that is definitely not kosher...

[G1911]

I'm honestly surprised we don't have many good fakes of this card yet. Especially with it's price run the last three years, we mostly see fakes that are not even remotely close and can be dismissed in two seconds.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by G1911

I'm honestly surprised we don't have many good fakes of this card yet. Especially with it's price run the last three years, we mostly see fakes that are not even remotely close and can be dismissed in two seconds.

What's equally surprising is that people don't take five minutes to educate themselves how to spot obvious fakes. Of course self help is not part of our culture apparently, as is obvious from all the threads asking for contact information which people could have easily found for themselves with one search.

[a761506]

Originally Posted by G1911

I'm honestly surprised we don't have many good fakes of this card yet. Especially with it's price run the last three years, we mostly see fakes that are not even remotely close and can be dismissed in two seconds.

Is there a known card that has been faked so well it could fool an expert?

[G1911]

Originally Posted by a761506

Is there a known card that has been faked so well it could fool an expert?

Off the top of my head, I can't think of any that are so good they regularly can fool a knowledgeable person who has it in hand.

There are definitely some that are pretty good and require the expert or some real research to tell. The graders refuse/refused to grade Star basketball and Fro-Joys because there were some decent fakes. I've seen some pretty good Fleer MJ's and some decent Exhibits. I don't think I've ever seen a fake Mantle that requires more than a 5 second glance at an image to tell it's a fake though. It's fakes I've seen are all very low effort jobs that are immediately wrong. It wouldn't be that difficult of a project to make one that at least looks pretty decent with a vaguely close stock in a picture.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by G1911

Off the top of my head, I can't think of any that are so good they regularly can fool a knowledgeable person who has it in hand.

There are definitely some that are pretty good and require the expert or some real research to tell. The graders refuse/refused to grade Star basketball and Fro-Joys because there were some decent fakes. I've seen some pretty good Fleer MJ's and some decent Exhibits. I don't think I've ever seen a fake Mantle that requires more than a 5 second glance at an image to tell it's a fake though. It's fakes I've seen are all very low effort jobs that are immediately wrong. It wouldn't be that difficult of a project to make one that at least looks pretty decent with a vaguely close stock in a picture.

I have heard there are some modern soccer cards that regularly fool the graders, although I don't know if that's due to how good they are or to incompetence. In theory this should become more and more of a problem as the technology gets even better.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I have heard there are some modern soccer cards that regularly fool the graders, although I don't know if that's due to how good they are or to incompetence. In theory this should become more and more of a problem as the technology gets even better.

Considering even 1 heavily stained example of a Mantle is worth ~$10M; I find it difficult to believe that we won't get fakes on stocks that can pass before all that long. The ROI on putting in the work into mimicking period correct printing is just so big that eventually somebody is going to inevitably seriously tackle this as a professional quality operation.

[nwobhm]

Originally Posted by G1911

Considering even 1 heavily stained example of a Mantle is worth ~$10M; I find it difficult to believe that we won't get fakes on stocks that can pass before all that long. The ROI on putting in the work into mimicking period correct printing is just so big that eventually somebody is going to inevitably seriously tackle this as a professional quality operation.

A premium quality fake doesn’t get caught. IMHO the issue isn’t “if” they exist, the issue is counterfeiters can’t flood a market with hundreds of nice copies without raising suspicion.

[JollyElm]

Originally Posted by a761506

Is there a known card that has been faked so well it could fool an expert?

Sadly, they don't need to fool the experts, just the other 99% of collectors. It's sort of the old "I don't have to outrun the bear, I just have to outrun you!" premise.

[megalimey]

Originally Posted by a761506

Is there a known card that has been faked so well it could fool an expert?

and many Star Basketball from the same era

[steve B]

Originally Posted by a761506

Is there a known card that has been faked so well it could fool an expert?

In hand, probably not.

The best fake I ever saw was back in maybe 81 or 82. The local dealer showed me a really great 51 Mantle. And just asked me what I thought of it. (pretty amazing they'd ask a just out of HS kid that)
After the initial "wow that's incredibly nice" the doubt set in. I couldn't point to anything specifically, but I became sure it was fake. So that's what I said, It's nice, but it's sad that it's fake. but I don't know why.
Apparently that was their opinion, and the opinion of I think 5 other dealers who had been offered that same card.

Being pessimistic, I would almost bet it's gotten past PSA and is now in a holder that's at least an 8.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by steve B

In hand, probably not.

The best fake I ever saw was back in maybe 81 or 82. The local dealer showed me a really great 51 Mantle. And just asked me what I thought of it. (pretty amazing they'd ask a just out of HS kid that)
After the initial "wow that's incredibly nice" the doubt set in. I couldn't point to anything specifically, but I became sure it was fake. So that's what I said, It's nice, but it's sad that it's fake. but I don't know why.
Apparently that was their opinion, and the opinion of I think 5 other dealers who had been offered that same card.

Being pessimistic, I would almost bet it's gotten past PSA and is now in a holder that's at least an 8.

There is a decent counterfeit 89 Fleer Bill Ripken FF card that has made it into a few PSA slabs. Many people even with it in hand say it is real.