1896-1911 Detroit Tigers Bennett Park Vendor Badge

[Keith H. Thompson]

I received instructions to pay via Paypal. I have done so and have receipt. Please send, authentic or not. keith

[Shoeless Moe]

Sorry, if it's not authentic, and it is not, I can't sell.


And no you have not paid, so please do not.

[Joe_G.]

Hello Shoeless Moe, I've taken interest in this listing. Can you elaborate on three points ?

1) How do you know this piece isn't authentic?
2) Why can't you sell a fantasy piece?
3) What are your plans if not selling?

I don't have interest in purchasing but like to study all things early Detroit baseball. I think this piece, fantasy or not, would make a great addition to Keith's amazing collection if you should make it available. Thank you in advance.

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by Joe_G.

Hello Shoeless Moe, I've taken interest in this listing. Can you elaborate on three points ?

1) How do you know this piece isn't authentic?
2) Why can't you sell a fantasy piece?
3) What are your plans if not selling?

I don't have interest in purchasing but like to study all things early Detroit baseball. I think this piece, fantasy or not, would make a great addition to Keith's amazing collection if you should make it available. Thank you in advance.

Do you know Howard Usher of Vintage Sports Pins and Memorabilia. He advised me with a very long explanation of it be a fake. I'm not selling a fake. Had Keith messaged me within the past 24 hours with a long explanation on how he would be good with a fake then maybe I would have considered, but since he didn't reply and I am in possession of a fake item, I began working on returning it and getting my money back.

[Keith H. Thompson]

I will give my version of the time line.

1. April 2, 9:58 PM (from Paul) Keith, let me know if you are going to pay, or if you changed your mind because I just got messaged by someone to let them know if the person doesn't pay. So, just let me know or PayPal F&F

2. April 3, 11:55 AM (from Keith) "want desperately to pay for the Vendor's Badge"

3. April 3, 1:01 PM (from Keith) "trying to figure out how to send by PayPal"

4. April 3, 1:11 PM (from Paul) Keith don't I'm not sure it's authentic

5. April 3,1:24 PM PayPal transaction ORP25085UL020001U 360.45 (currently pending) (transaction appears as *pgrus.... )

I am very familiar with items like medals and sports related artifacts that have been doctored to indicate they were awarded to a known athlete and hence appraised (and sold) in four figures by auction houses. These appear to come from England, but the methods are available to anyone. An example known to me was a Sam Thompson item and sold in spite of objections of fake, including myself.

I am not an adversarial person by nature, and it was not a private message, but I did indicate in one of my posts that I wanted to purchase, "authentic or not."

The entire time line is less than 24 hours, and I do not see how I can be faulted for lack of interest or reasonable response.

Keith

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by Keith H. Thompson

I will give my version of the time line.

1. April 2, 9:58 PM (from Paul) Keith, let me know if you are going to pay, or if you changed your mind because I just got messaged by someone to let them know if the person doesn't pay. So, just let me know or PayPal F&F

2. April 3, 11:55 AM (from Keith) "want desperately to pay for the Vendor's Badge"

3. April 3, 1:01 PM (from Keith) "trying to figure out how to send by PayPal"

4. April 3, 1:11 PM (from Paul) Keith don't I'm not sure it's authentic

5. April 3,1:24 PM PayPal transaction ORP25085UL020001U 360.45 (currently pending) (transaction appears as *pgrus.... )

I am very familiar with items like medals and sports related artifacts that have been doctored to indicate they were awarded to a known athlete and hence appraised (and sold) in four figures by auction houses. These appear to come from England, but the methods are available to anyone. An example known to me was a Sam Thompson item and sold in spite of objections of fake, including myself.

I am not an adversarial person by nature, and it was not a private message, but I did indicate in one of my posts that I wanted to purchase, "authentic or not."

The entire time line is less than 24 hours, and I do not see how I can be faulted for lack of interest or reasonable response.

Keith

#2 is entirely untrue. I rec'd ZERO email/pms from you after the initial "I'll take it" email. Whereas I sent you a few messages, none receiving a response. We can have Leon check if need be, and you will be 100% proven incorrect. Check your sent messages file on here and take a screenshot, post it. Would love to see these messages. #3 was posted in the thread which I didn't see until I had already been to the Post Office to send it back to the original seller, so I did not see that message until it was on its way back. Thus 24 hours too late. Again, you sent me zero personal messages within 24 hours. By then it was on its way back to the seller.

Or just drop it already, I've given you the original Seller info., you can contact them for it. You will get it cheaper. Not sure the uproar. I just personally didn't want to sell a fake item, but Al next time I get a fake I'll be sure to come to you for first dibs.

[batsballsbases]

Originally Posted by Shoeless Moe

#2 is entirely untrue. I rec'd ZERO email/pms from you after the initial "I'll take it" email. Whereas I sent you a few messages, none receiving a response. We can have Leon check if need be, and you will be 100% proven incorrect. Check your sent messages file on here and take a screenshot, post it. Would love to see these messages. #3 was posted in the thread which I didn't see until I had already been to the Post Office to send it back to the original seller, so I did not see that message until it was on its way back. Thus 24 hours too late. Again, you sent me zero personal messages within 24 hours. By then it was on its way back to the seller.

Or just drop it already, I've given you the original Seller info., you can contact them for it. You will get it cheaper. Not sure the uproar. I just personally didn't want to sell a fake item, but Al next time I get a fake I'll be sure to come to you for first dibs.

Hey Shoeless Blow GTH DUDE!!

[batsballsbases]

Originally Posted by Shoeless Moe

#2 is entirely untrue. I rec'd ZERO email/pms from you after the initial "I'll take it" email. Whereas I sent you a few messages, none receiving a response. We can have Leon check if need be, and you will be 100% proven incorrect. Check your sent messages file on here and take a screenshot, post it. Would love to see these messages. #3 was posted in the thread which I didn't see until I had already been to the Post Office to send it back to the original seller, so I did not see that message until it was on its way back. Thus 24 hours too late. Again, you sent me zero personal messages within 24 hours. By then it was on its way back to the seller.

Or just drop it already, I've given you the original Seller info., you can contact them for it. You will get it cheaper. Not sure the uproar. I just personally didn't want to sell a fake item, but Al next time I get a fake I'll be sure to come to you for first dibs.

Hey Shoeless Blow GTH DUDE!!

[batsballsbases]

Originally Posted by Shoeless Moe

Do you know Howard Usher of Vintage Sports Pins and Memorabilia. He advised me with a very long explanation of it be a fake. I'm not selling a fake. Had Keith messaged me within the past 24 hours with a long explanation on how he would be good with a fake then maybe I would have considered, but since he didn't reply and I am in possession of a fake item, I began working on returning it and getting my money back.

Paul I know Howard Usher very well and I did see you had this item listed on the Vintage Pin Back site. You took it down as soon a s Howard told you he thought it was bad.... People are wrong from time to time also.
But I look at it this way if Mr Thompson (And I dont know him at all) wants to buy the pin sell it to him. Looks like to me that you already did as he committed to buying it... You should honor your word.... EVEN if it is fake or not hes a big boy. Let him be the judge.. I think your wrong here Paul fake or not you should honor your post...

[Shoeless Moe]

Dude, it was already in the mail on the way back to the seller the minute I learned it was fake. I shipped it out Monday afternoon. Keith had not replied in 24 hours. Had he replied at any point within the 24 hours since he ghosted it would be his. He messed up, not me.

I also messaged Keith and gave him the seller's information and contacted the seller and advised the seller that someone will be contacting you to purchase and he doesn't care if its real or fake, so the seller was very happy I did that for them. So the ball in in Keith's court.

He will still get it and for about 60-70 bucks cheaper. Not much else I can do here.

Court adjourned.

[batsballsbases]

Originally Posted by Shoeless Moe

Dude, it was already in the mail on the way back to the seller the minute I learned it was fake. I shipped it out Monday afternoon. Keith had not replied in 24 hours. Had he replied at any point within the 24 hours since he ghosted it would be his. He messed up, not me.

I also messaged Keith and gave him the seller's information and contacted the seller and advised the seller that someone will be contacting you to purchase and he doesn't care if its real or fake, so the seller was very happy I did that for them. So the ball in in Keith's court.

He will still get it and for about 60-70 bucks cheaper. Not much else I can do here.

Court adjourned.

Oh and by the way DUDE court may be adjourned but the jury is still out on how you conduct yourself here... And also I found it funny how you posted it up on the other board even after this man said he wanted to buy it. Then you took it down after Howard Usher posted in your post I believe it doesnt look good. Cant check it because you deleted it....

[Keith H. Thompson]

1. original listing says the badge was found in a lot of Detroit pins and like, and should be a "Detroit Collector's hands." I qualify since I have been collecting Detroit items since 1938.
2. seller: item sold pending payment
3. seller sends me a message requesting payment via Paypal F&F
4. seller sends me a message saying "don't pay, may not be authentic." but I have already send payment via Paypal F&F as requested. I have receipt but now understand that a recipient can refuse to accept it for any reason.
5. as to authenticity, I'm as good a judge as anybody in the Net54 room when it comes to 19th century Detroit memorabilia, excepting Joe Gonsowski and Jay Miller.

The most irksome thing of all is that an item appears, I go through all the ethical and proper steps, but I am not allowed to bid on the item, as I believe is happening.

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by Keith H. Thompson

1. original listing says the badge was found in a lot of Detroit pins and like, and should be a "Detroit Collector's hands." I qualify since I have been collecting Detroit items since 1938.
2. seller: item sold pending payment
3. seller sends me a message requesting payment via Paypal F&F
4. seller sends me a message saying "don't pay, may not be authentic." but I have already send payment via Paypal F&F as requested. I have receipt but now understand that a recipient can refuse to accept it for any reason.
5. as to authenticity, I'm as good a judge as anybody in the Net54 room when it comes to 19th century Detroit memorabilia, excepting Joe Gonsowski and Jay Miller.

The most irksome thing of all is that an item appears, I go through all the ethical and proper steps, but I am not allowed to bid on the item, as I believe is happening.

You went radio silent for 24 hours. After you said "how do I pay?" I immediately messaged you - no response.

You still have not replied to me via email or pm here and I sent you messages to both.

You claim you have some receipt for payment - lets see it - because I sure never got payment nor refused it - send me a pix of it via pm or email, or since for some odd reason you refuse to message me direct post it here, would love to see this receipt.

Had you messaged me within 24 hours you might have had a chance at it.

You could have said I'll pay tomorrow, or ANYTHING, but to not reply for 24 hours after saying I'll take it is a bit odd. Especially as you have been on here, yet again you don't reply to my PMs here or to my email to you.