How does CSG compare?

[Onlineracing]

Thanks for the replies, I'm a prewar collector and i think it's a fair point why someone would send their prewar there as opposed to PSA or SGC.

[Lorewalker]

They very well could be more consistent than PSA and SGC, grade fewer altered cards than SGC and PSA and maybe they even grade more accurately than SGC and PSA but the market barely accepts SGC who has been around a long time.

As has been suggested looking at completed auctions on ebay...and not just 1 or 2...will give you a good idea of what the discount is.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by Lorewalker

They very well could be more consistent than PSA and SGC, grade fewer altered cards than SGC and PSA and maybe they even grade more accurately than SGC and PSA but the market barely accepts SGC who has been around a long time.

As has been suggested looking at completed auctions on ebay...and not just 1 or 2...will give you a good idea of what the discount is.

Perhaps also worth pointing out is that the discount varies by which sub-segment of the hobby you're looking at. With modern basketball and even 1986 Fleer, CSG is pretty much on point with SGC in terms of resale pricing, both of which are behind PSA cards of the same grade. However, if you could find a 41 Playball DiMaggio CSG 8 and the same card in an SGC 8 slab, you're almost certainly going to see a significant difference in the hammer price.

That said, some cards have provenance that can change that dynamic. The 52 Topps CSG 8 Mantle is an example. I think it's public knowledge at this point that that card was in a PSA 7.5 holder before CSG ran this marketing push for it in a CSG 8 holder. I suspect that hammer price will be fairly close to a PSA 7.5 as a result, since the buyer knows with high confidence that they could probably get it back into the PSA 7.5 holder fairly easily.

[Leon]

As I had said before, I sent 25 pre war cards to them. We'll see how they grade and look. I won't use sgc again....maybe psa...I will buy a card in any holder though ...
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[glchen]

As long as Andy Broome is at CSG, I'd buy their cards in their newer holder. I really hate their older green label one, however. I'd still wait to submit to them until they start holdering cards in larger sizes.

[wnp22]

With Andy Broome being in charge of the grading and their parent company being well regarded in the grading areas of other hobbies for a long time, I would have no problems buying a CSG card and I really would like to see them succeed. I've only bought a few cards graded by them, but I love the slabs (notwithstanding all the label nonsense, just the clarity of the slabs)

That said, I wouldn't slab anything with them that I was going to sell just because of the price discrepancies. And I don't really want to slab any personal collection stuff with them because I would like to see that they have some staying power before I do that. But overall, it seems like they have the tools to succeed and become a viable alternative to at least SGC over the next couple of years.

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by Snowman

Perhaps also worth pointing out is that the discount varies by which sub-segment of the hobby you're looking at. With modern basketball and even 1986 Fleer, CSG is pretty much on point with SGC in terms of resale pricing, both of which are behind PSA cards of the same grade. However, if you could find a 41 Playball DiMaggio CSG 8 and the same card in an SGC 8 slab, you're almost certainly going to see a significant difference in the hammer price.

That said, some cards have provenance that can change that dynamic. The 52 Topps CSG 8 Mantle is an example. I think it's public knowledge at this point that that card was in a PSA 7.5 holder before CSG ran this marketing push for it in a CSG 8 holder. I suspect that hammer price will be fairly close to a PSA 7.5 as a result, since the buyer knows with high confidence that they could probably get it back into the PSA 7.5 holder fairly easily.

I probably should have specified that I was referring to vintage instead of suggesting it was all cards. I do not follow 80s and beyond but that is good to know that CSG is hanging in there.

As for the buyer of the 52 Mantle CSG 8 they had better know someone, or be someone, who is close to PSA if it is their intention to get the card back into a PSA 7.5. Not inferring the card is altered but once out of the holder I am certain PSA would treat it as if it had not been seen.

[UKCardGuy]

I have no issue with CSG graded cards. If they're cheaper then I've picked up a bargain. I can't answer the overall discount because that needs a fair bit of analysis, but I'd love to see it if anyone has that level of research.

CSG does seem like a good opportunity for bargains. I'm sure there's people out there who'll make a living by buying CSG graded cards and cross them over to PSA to profit from the difference.

But it doesn't always seem to be the case. Here's an example that I found after a few mins of looking.

56T Mantle PSA 2 White Back


56T Mantle CSG 2 White Back

I'd love to see a more exhaustive analysis.

[Frank A]

I am so sick of hearing which grading company is the best. What makes the grading company you like any better than the rest? I have had cards graded by many, many companies. I absolutely have not found a lot of difference. Yes, I have used PSA and SGC and CSG and GMA and others along the way. You know what? All are just as competent at their job. It seems PSA is always picked as the best. Sorry to say they are no better than the rest. It is like a cult out there. Do PSA cards bring more than other graders cards? Yes and I have no clue why. Maybe because more people have cards graded by them. That doesn't make them better. Then comes the set registry. How many people really make sets today? The price of common cards has become so stupid I can't even think of putting more sets together. Then when the set is sold as a set, the buyer breaks it up to make more money. Why the hell does anyone care about sets any more when only the high dollar cards are really collectable. Which ever grading company you choose is up to you, but thinking that any one is better than the other is nonsense. Frank

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by Frank A

I am so sick of hearing which grading company is the best. What makes the grading company you like any better than the rest? I have had cards graded by many, many companies. I absolutely have not found a lot of difference. Yes, I have used PSA and SGC and CSG and GMA and others along the way. You know what? All are just as competent at their job. It seems PSA is always picked as the best. Sorry to say they are no better than the rest. It is like a cult out there. Do PSA cards bring more than other graders cards? Yes and I have no clue why. Maybe because more people have cards graded by them. That doesn't make them better. Then comes the set registry. How many people really make sets today? The price of common cards has become so stupid I can't even think of putting more sets together. Then when the set is sold as a set, the buyer breaks it up to make more money. Why the hell does anyone care about sets any more when only the high dollar cards are really collectable. Which ever grading company you choose is up to you, but thinking that any one is better than the other is nonsense. Frank

Huh? Maybe I read this thread with zero reading comprehension but I do not recall anyone writing that PSA was the best or even focusing on who is best. That was not the point of the thread. Best is a personal choice. Best if you are selling? Best if you are buying? Best if you are submitting altered cards? Best appearance in the holder? Best for secured holders.

I will say two things...they are all flawed some more than others but when favors are not being done, they do not all do the same job. There are grading staffs that clearly are better and more experienced than others.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Frank A

I am so sick of hearing which grading company is the best. What makes the grading company you like any better than the rest? I have had cards graded by many, many companies. I absolutely have not found a lot of difference. Yes, I have used PSA and SGC and CSG and GMA and others along the way. You know what? All are just as competent at their job. It seems PSA is always picked as the best. Sorry to say they are no better than the rest. It is like a cult out there. Do PSA cards bring more than other graders cards? Yes and I have no clue why. Maybe because more people have cards graded by them. That doesn't make them better. Then comes the set registry. How many people really make sets today? The price of common cards has become so stupid I can't even think of putting more sets together. Then when the set is sold as a set, the buyer breaks it up to make more money. Why the hell does anyone care about sets any more when only the high dollar cards are really collectable. Which ever grading company you choose is up to you, but thinking that any one is better than the other is nonsense. Frank

Different services are better for different cards. Gonna go with PSA for a mainstream Topps card. Not so much for a card that needs specialized holdering. SGC is good for that but not for a thinner card because they tend to slip the gasket. And so on.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by Lorewalker

I probably should have specified that I was referring to vintage instead of suggesting it was all cards. I do not follow 80s and beyond but that is good to know that CSG is hanging in there.

As for the buyer of the 52 Mantle CSG 8 they had better know someone, or be someone, who is close to PSA if it is their intention to get the card back into a PSA 7.5. Not inferring the card is altered but once out of the holder I am certain PSA would treat it as if it had not been seen.

I think that's true normally. But they know exactly which card this is and what they graded it previously. With Nat on his kick about cards receiving the same when resubmitted, I would think there would be significant pressure to put it back in a 7.5 holder just to avoid the hobby blowback of people posting before vs after pics and revealing that PSA graders have no pants.

If they do grade it lower, it would probably be because they want to make a statement about CSG and want to make an example out of someone by pretending that CSG "damaged" the card when cracking it out. That way, they could damage their reputation and lessen the number of PSA crack outs finding their way into CSG slabs.

[rjackson44]

The ugliest holders in the hobby sorry .resale sucks

[parkplace33]

Avoid at all costs.

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by Snowman

I think that's true normally. But they know exactly which card this is and what they graded it previously. With Nat on his kick about cards receiving the same when resubmitted, I would think there would be significant pressure to put it back in a 7.5 holder just to avoid the hobby blowback of people posting before vs after pics and revealing that PSA graders have no pants.

If they do grade it lower, it would probably be because they want to make a statement about CSG and want to make an example out of someone by pretending that CSG "damaged" the card when cracking it out. That way, they could damage their reputation and lessen the number of PSA crack outs finding their way into CSG slabs.

I know nothing about the Mantle card in question...no idea when it was originally graded by PSA and who submitted it, etc. I hear what you are saying but I would not want to buy any card, that had once resided in a PSA holder, with the expectation upon owing it that it would just walk back into the same PSA holder it had previously been in.

Nat might want to control the grades of previously submitted cards but there is also a risk they decide this time, the card is altered. Not suggesting the Mantle is. It does not appear to be messed with but it is a 52 Mantle.

Once a card is out of the PSA holder the worthless "guarantee" is long gone but so is the guarantee of the grade.

[Snowman]

Something else I almost forgot about when I submitted cards to CSG. I had sent in about a dozen or so 1952 Topps cards in my first submission with them, and they returned a few of them as "service not available". I'm not sure why though, because they graded the others. They also falsely flagged one as being trimmed. The rest received accurate grades. One was over graded.