OT: The Trevor Bauer Case

[Chris-Counts]

Originally Posted by G1911

A bad cat should not be held guilty of rape and abuse, in court or by society and reasonable people, if he did not commit in fact commit rape or abuse. One may dislike or hate someone for any or no reason, but we should not let our opinion of a person conflate with what they have actually done. This woman's case fell apart by the evidence contradicting her story. To say that he is not guilty of the crime is not to say he is perfect or great or good, it is to acknowledge the evidence. I think it will be a sad day when we as a people no longer discern guilt from innocence for people we simply don't like. We are well on that path.

Well said. I worry about the loss of due process and the presumption of innocence in a world that's so quick condemn. I'm amazed at how often I hear someone spout off about how so-and-so is guilty of this or that — without offering a stitch of evidence.

[BobbyStrawberry]

Originally Posted by Chris Counts

Well said. I worry about the loss of due process and the presumption of innocence in a world that's so quick condemn. I'm amazed at how often I hear someone spout off about how so-and-so is guilty of this or that — without offering a stitch of evidence.

There's plenty of evidence that Bauer beats up women and has been a misogynistic, harassing troll on social media (with a legion of incel fanboys) for years. That's the opposite of "quick to condemn"

[G1911]

Can anyone link or source any evidence he is guilty of violent abuse and/or rape? I can't find any. Just a claim, that was contradictory to the evidence, and got thrown out. I don't know much about Bauer before this case got attention outside of the baseball world, I don't watch much anymore. I am neither for nor against him. But claims of criminality should require evidence; the standard of western justice and thought for centuries.

[BobC]

Great, let's see the evidence since there is plenty of it.

[campyfan39]

Nose rings, eyebrow, lip or tongue piercing is an automatic turnoff IMO.

With respect, some of you are naive in regards to how common this kind of mess goes on. In my line of work I have counseled numerous women who have low self esteem and self worth and who actually cannot orgasm without violent sexual acts. People act like this is some kind of anomaly but sadly it is getting more and more common in part because of porn and extreme cultural trends. I believe based on her contradictions that Bauer is a weird guy and should know better given his position, but this was consensual.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by campyfan39

Nose rings, eyebrow, lip or tongue piercing is an automatic turnoff IMO.

With respect, some of you are naive in regards to how common this kind of mess goes on. In my line of work I have counseled numerous women who have low self esteem and self worth and who actually cannot orgasm without violent sexual acts. People act like this is some kind of anomaly but sadly it is getting more and more common in part because of porn and extreme cultural trends. I believe based on her contradictions that Bauer is a weird guy and should know better given his position, but this was consensual.

Very true! We definitely live in a very weird and odd world, with an awful lot of differences in how people are and interact with others. And kudos to you Campyfan39 for trying to help and assist those that have issues and need assistance, help, and understanding.

I do not have specific confirming evidence, but I've heard that if you take all the activity for an entire day across the world on all the social media type sites like Facebook, Twitter, etc., and add them all up, they still don't come close to the amount of online porn activity each day, in total, around the world. And strangely enough, it would not surprise me if that is actually true.

There are so many people in the world that are closed-minded and judgmental, and only want and expect others to think and act exactly like they do. And many that are biased and suffer from racial fears and hate, and everything else that can be a bad part of the human experience and existence. At the end of the day, we are all human animals, and subject to the very real instincts, desires, fears, hopes, and dreams that come with being human. And I am no better than anyone else. But I try to be open-minded and think through things, looking for information and evidence to support or discredit whatever issue or thinking is at hand after learning as much as possible about it, and try not to rush to judgement or carry pre-conceived notions and ideas.

This entire issue with Bauer is one of those extraordinary situations that get exacerbated and made worse by the fact that we now have the internet, and worldwide access to virtually anything and everything happens almost instantaneously. He and this woman have no privacy, and the media jump on this stuff for their own ratings, making money off stories like this. They care nothing for Bauer and this woman, and just use them for their own selfish purposes. Situations like this back in say Ruth's time would likely not be out there like they are today, as reporters would be more conscious and concerned with not blatantly sharing personal and private information of athletes lives like the media does today. News people, like Walter Cronkite, or Huntley and Brinkley, took pride in presenting the news and facts to the people, not adding and twisting the news with their own personal and political thoughts and feelings, like virtually all news reporting appears to be today. People need to be more open-minded and think for themselves, using common sense, and not just believe what they my initially hear and see. I've always felt that of all the rules, laws, beliefs and such that are in the world, the most important of all is the "Golden Rule". If more people tried to follow and live by that one simple rule, the world would likely be a much, much better place for all of us.

[glynparson]

Consent or not what he did was freaking disgusting and I wouldn’t want to employ or associate with an individual like him.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by glynparson

Consent or not what he did was freaking disgusting and I wouldn’t want to employ or associate with an individual like him.

right but than you have wife beaters that still get a job later on

issue is if cant tell one way or another which side is telling the truth than shouldnt you give the person thats accused the benefit of the doubt

someone argued here that 'guilty' people walk free all the time when the prosecution doesnt have the goods but thats how the system should work..

also realize just because you cant prove a civil slander case because you dont have the goods doesnt mean you were not slandered so you cant have it both ways when you need that person to prove a slander case to prove they are innocent...

also i do think people in their teens in early 20s make some decisions before and after events in which they dont think long term or think enough how things will play out...not sure you can always say '99% of people would do this" when you are that young you do and can say things later that are more fringe that that 99%. Especially when there are older people with various incentives pulling the strings as well.

I always say a lot of bad decisions in life come down to this analogy..

Go to a Bar and stare at some big person, when that person says 'why you looking at me' Then you say 'what you going to do about it'

After you get beat up, you can sue for injuries right? You did 'start' it but you arent at fault to getting beat up. However most people arent going to want to say 'what you going to do about it'

This kind of thing happens all the time in society when there are clear victims but there is a level of causation to making them a victim, not enough to say the victim deserved it, but enough causation that most people simply would not be that position to be a victim