Tinker Evers Chance photo

[BobC]

Originally Posted by Shankweather

Thanks for all the great responses on this. I admit I noticed that Tinker looked a bit off, but assumed everything was fine because it’s LOTG. I emailed Al tonight and he responded almost immediately. He said, “In a quick review of our notes, we did explicitly ask the authenticator to confirm that was Tinker in the photo and he did, but in looking at the photo I’d like to learn a bit more about why he is so certain.”

This has taken quite the turn but it’s fun nonetheless. LOTG is the best in the business so I’m certain we’ll get this figured out.

Al is a great guy, and diligent and thorough in his work. If he's relying upon an outside expert/authenticator, you can't fault him at all. Even so, there's currently no 100% certainty one way or the other on who that is.

Meanwhile, it is interesting (and fun) to have people throw out different observations and theories, along with doing some real time research, in trying to not only come up with exactly who is in the photo, and where it was taken, but also the possible situation and significance behind it. If it turns out to not be Tinker in the photo, and instead has something to do with Chance and Evers passing the managerial torch, so to speak, due to Chance's health, this could end up being one of the last photos of Chance before taking a turn for the worse. That in of itself would make this a remarkable photo, with a great backstory, and still quite valuable. Good luck, and be sure to let us know if you find out any further info or background on this. Great photo regardless.

[RCMcKenzie]

Bob, I agree that these photo id threads are fun. I know Dave is posting photos to show that Tinker is not the guy in the bar, but to me, his photos support my thinking that the guy in the bar is Tinker. I was glad to learn on here that I'm not the only person that thinks it's Tinker.

[jingram058]

Originally Posted by RCMcKenzie

Bob, I agree that these photo id threads are fun. I know Dave is posting photos to show that Tinker is not the guy in the bar, but to me, his photos support my thinking that the guy in the bar is Tinker. I was glad to learn on here that I'm not the only person that thinks it's Tinker.

Well, if Tinker and Evers didn't speak 1905 to 1938, could not even stand each other, then how could the guy in the middle of this photo be Tinker?

[RCMcKenzie]

Originally Posted by jingram058

Well, if Tinker and Evers didn't speak 1905 to 1938, could not even stand each other, then how could the guy in the middle of this photo be Tinker?

James, see post #29, unless we are prepared to say that Tinker is also not pictured in that photo. I know from haggling around on these ID threads, that it's easier to say or show that it is not a match.

[Jobu]

The Sporting News photo is a nice find - and it shows Tinker's teeth. The guy in question has a broken left incisor while Tinker's is intact in the Sporting News photo from about the same period. As I pointed out above with the earlier photo of Tinker, the teeth don't match so I stand by my thinking that this probably isn't him now that we see his teeth again from the later period.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by jingram058

Well, if Tinker and Evers didn't speak 1905 to 1938, could not even stand each other, then how could the guy in the middle of this photo be Tinker?

Also go back to my last line in the first paragraph of post #10. Despite the rumor of them not speaking till 1938, I pointed out how that was untrue apparently due to them appearing in a theatrical skit together in 1929. Plus, as Rob pointed out, there is the 1923 photo that is of Tinker, Evers, and Chance to supposedly show they did get together for at least one other possible group photo.

[RCMcKenzie]

Maybe Pete can weigh in on teeth. Here's the back of the photo in question. It's interesting that the only id is "Chance". Maybe because it was for West Coast publication, and Chance was regionally more famous, or maybe the person who wrote, "Chance" thought the other id's were more obvious.

I hope LOTG's expert chimes in with his thoughts, or anyone else.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by RCMcKenzie

Bob, I agree that these photo id threads are fun. I know Dave is posting photos to show that Tinker is not the guy in the bar, but to me, his photos support my thinking that the guy in the bar is Tinker. I was glad to learn on here that I'm not the only person that thinks it's Tinker.

Yeah Rob, this is a great thread. I still don't know for sure if it is or isn't Tinker in the LOTG thread. And without some additional info or source surfacing, we'll likely never know for sure one way or the other. But with all the additional info and pictures Bryan keeps posting, I have to admit to leaning more and more to it not being Tinker in the LOTG photo.

One thing I am a bit surprised about is no one mentioning or commenting on my contribution regarding the possible height difference between Tinker and Evers. I thought that LOTG photo clearly shows Tinker as being shorter than Evers, despite them both supposedly being the same height. And then looking at the 1923 picture and using the ears and seats in the background as a reference, that photo appears to show the two of them as being about the same height, which they should be. That, to me, is an even more clear indication that they may not be the same person over the perceived differences in facial features or teeth. The photo quality and one person with a cigar in their mouth and the other without, can possibly distort or obscure things to some extent. But the height, especially when factoring in the seats behind them in the 1923 photo, is really convincing to me. Now we can't really see the chairs they are sitting on in the LOTG photo, so we can only assume they are all of equal height. Obviously, the stadium seats in the 1923 photo are all of equal height, so at least that is a given. You just have to take all these different points and factors, put them together, and then weight them in your own mind to decide if you believe it is Tinker in both photos, or not. Great stuff!

[Casey2296]

Tinker clearly has bright blue eyes in the Thompson photo, I just don't see that in the subject photo. It's not him.

[RCMcKenzie]

Also, look at the body language. The guy in the middle has a confident grin and has his left hand draped on the guy on the lefts left shoulder like he's his brother-in-law, or school day's buddy. The three are acting like 3 bffs.

The guy in the middle has a ring on his left hand, maybe a diamond ring. I wonder if there are other photos of Tinker that show that same ring.

Bob and Phil, good points about height and eye color. B&W photography can produce some artistic interpretation.

[brass_rat]

I don't have any sleuthing to add, but I've enjoyed reading this constructive, respectful, and informative discussion.

Steve

[RCMcKenzie]

I agree, Steve, a fun discussion. Here's a Tinker photo from RMY and he's wearing what appears to be the same ring in 1913. If my scanner was working, I could enlarge the photos to 2200 dpi like a Columbo episode.

[D. Bergin]

They’re both wearing wedding rings.

Jeez, just look at the ears. Cigar chopper has a smoother interior pattern and lower hanging lobes.

You can’t just put two different sets of ears on the same guy.

You don’t have to prove a guy is somebody else, in order to prove he’s not the right guy. This isn’t a Mr. Potato Head doll. If one piece doesn’t fit…you must acquit……………..that it’s not him.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by BobC

One thing I am a bit surprised about is no one mentioning or commenting on my contribution regarding the possible height difference between Tinker and Evers. I thought that LOTG photo clearly shows Tinker as being shorter than Evers, despite them both supposedly being the same height. And then looking at the 1923 picture and using the ears and seats in the background as a reference, that photo appears to show the two of them as being about the same height, which they should be.

Ordinarily I don't think it's necessarily accurate to judge a person's relative height when they are sitting next to each other, because people carry height differently (short or long legs.) But since you are comparing two photos where both guys are sitting next to each other, I think you make a very valid point. On top of all the other points made.

It's true Evers and Tinker were in the same photo when Chance was with the Red Sox, but clearly neither are at all happy about it. Look at their expressions. I know Evers' nickname was "The Crab," but seriously, it looks like he wants to spit. Maybe they did get together in the late 1920s, but Chance was gone by then. I'm thinking perhaps the strongest argument against might be the fact everyone is genuinely smiling in the original photo.