Gun ownership poll

[G1911]

This loops back to an earlier main point. If we know it is the person, not the tool, what legislation on the tool are we proposing that is not taking peoples guns or banning guns that will reduce homicides and shootings?

Is there a compromise proposition that could be reached?

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by G1911

This loops back to an earlier main point. If we know it is the person, not the tool, what legislation on the tool are we proposing that is not taking peoples guns or banning guns that will reduce homicides and shootings?

Is there a compromise proposition that could be reached?

Obviously a tough call because what’s already out there is out there and what’s restricted tomorrow can still be obtained. It seems like trying to restrict access, especially younger person access, to rapid fire, large count magazines would do some good. Not even positive that would be a net benefit. I think both sides want less mass shootings. Wish there was a technological solution.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Carter08

Obviously a tough call because what’s already out there is out there and what’s restricted tomorrow can still be obtained. It seems like trying to restrict access, especially younger person access, to rapid fire, large count magazines would do some good.

Does this mean a ban on magazine possession of magazines holding over X number of rounds, and a ban on semi-automatic firearms for under Y age(21?)?

Originally Posted by Carter08

I think both sides want less mass shootings.

Amen.

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by G1911

Does this mean a ban on magazine possession of magazines holding over X number of rounds, and a ban on semi-automatic firearms for under Y age(21?)?



Amen.

Agree with the amen. As for the former, I have no clue. I think it’s responsible gun owners that will actually come up with some good ideas.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Carter08

Agree with the amen. As for the former, I have no clue. I think it’s responsible gun owners that will actually come up with some good ideas.

Responsible gun owners are against these ideas though; beyond the discussions of what might be effective in controlling a small number of psycho’s or the Constitution, criminalizing ourselves or subsegments of ourselves is not very popular in the gun community, as a ban on semi-auto’s and/or magazines will do, for the obvious reasons of common sense self-interest. Their propositions are more in the mental health realm, and the view that while these events are horrible, there is no reason to think any legislation is going to get rid of homicide. Most gun owners do not see why those who have not misused it should be criminalized, particularly when other tools are used in more murders (you are more likely to be bludgeoned than to be shot with a rifle, semi-auto and scary or single shot and not scary). It is exceptionally difficult to endorse a proposition that makes some of us sudden felons for having legally purchased and owning what we have.

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by G1911

Responsible gun owners are against these ideas though; beyond the discussions of what might be effective in controlling a small number of psycho’s or the Constitution, criminalizing ourselves or subsegments of ourselves is not very popular in the gun community, as a ban on semi-auto’s and/or magazines will do, for the obvious reasons of common sense self-interest. Their propositions are more in the mental health realm, and the view that while these events are horrible, there is no reason to think any legislation is going to get rid of homicide. Most gun owners do not see why those who have not misused it should be criminalized, particularly when other tools are used in more murders (you are more likely to be bludgeoned than to be shot with a rifle, semi-auto and scary or single shot and not scary). It is exceptionally difficult to endorse a proposition that makes some of us sudden felons for having legally purchased and owning what we have.

There’s been no such thing as a mass bludgeoning as far as I know. I wouldn’t be scared if my fellow citizens walked around with baseball bats. Allow them to freely walk around with guns, not good as far as I’m concerned. Too many arguments result in people making poor decisions. Would rather have them make those poor decisions without a gun in hand.

[G1911]

Rhode Island's House of Representatives today passed a ban on the possession of any magazine that holds more than 10 rounds, with no grandfather clause, turning thousands of citizens into felons, many of whom will probably not even be aware that legally owned items they bought years or decades ago (magazines holding more than 10 have been common items for about a century) make them a criminal once it is in effect.

This is exactly why gun owners think the gun control agenda is to ban their guns and parts and turn them into felons - because they keep writing these bills, voting for them, and sometimes get them passed which do exactly that, turning law-abiding citizens who have done nothing wrong into overnight felons for owning common items that they legally acquired.

I'm sure murderers, gang members, and massacre-planing psycho's will dispose of their magazines and many lives will be saved.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by Carter08

There’s been no such thing as a mass bludgeoning as far as I know. I wouldn’t be scared if my fellow citizens walked around with baseball bats. Allow them to freely walk around with guns, not good as far as I’m concerned. Too many arguments result in people making poor decisions. Would rather have them make those poor decisions without a gun in hand.

Going by the same standards use to qualify something as a mass shooting...

https://www.spokesman.com/stories/20...hammer-attack/

https://www.liherald.com/hempstead/s...-mother,138650

https://www.nytimes.com/1988/03/09/n...buildings.html


https://www.durangoherald.com/articl...at-strip-club/

[KMayUSA6060]

Originally Posted by Carter08

Agree with the amen. As for the former, I have no clue. I think it’s responsible gun owners that will actually come up with some good ideas.

What if responsible gun owners told you the solution is more firearms in the hands of good guys to stop inevitable bad guys with guns? Qualified military personnel/veterans, for example, staitioned at our schools. What if they said these proposed laws only restrict law abiding citizens, considering murder is illegal already yet bad guys still commit murder with a plethora of "tools"?

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by KMayUSA6060

What if responsible gun owners told you the solution is more firearms in the hands of good guys to stop inevitable bad guys with guns? Qualified military personnel/veterans, for example, staitioned at our schools. What if they said these proposed laws only restrict law abiding citizens, considering murder is illegal already yet bad guys still commit murder with a plethora of "tools"?

That I said before seems like a non-starter. Too many good guys make dumb decisions. If there isn’t a desire to try to restrict high capacity guns from bad guys maybe there is no way to agree on something.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Carter08

That I said before seems like a non-starter. Too many good guys make dumb decisions. If there isn’t a desire to try to restrict high capacity guns from bad guys maybe there is no way to agree on something.

The problem is there is NO WAY to restrict high capacity guns or anything else from the bad guys. All these beyond silly new laws do is restrict things from the good people.

I can't think of even one single thing that a law has kept a bad person from getting or doing.

[cannonballsun]

We are not the only country to have a mass shooting. It has happened in many countries. We are the only country to just stick with things as they are, and basically change nothing, when we have a mass shooting.
Other countries that have had mass shootings have been proactive, and changed things, and they have been successful in greatly lowering these mass shootings.
There's no cure all, there's nothing that works in every situation, but if you can save one life, wouldn't that be worth it ? In the world, we are the outlier. I believe we are 8 times more likely to die by gun than the next highest country. Plus it is estimated that there are 400 million guns in this country. Talk about the elephant in the room ! People continue to say guns are not the problem.
Also, today's responsible gun owner may be tomorrow's gun owner who goes off the deep end. The shooter in Law Vegas was a very successful person. He didn't seem like a risk at all, until he murdered 60 people and wounded many others.
My response to this situation is what the people of Uvalde said : "Do something".

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Carter08

That I said before seems like a non-starter. Too many good guys make dumb decisions. If there isn’t a desire to try to restrict high capacity guns from bad guys maybe there is no way to agree on something.

How are you proposing to do this? It is already illegal for known 'bad guys' to possess arms. You said earlier that gun-owners need to get over their idea that the other side is trying to take our guns away. How are you going to remove these guns from bad people without a record, without removing them from the tens of millions of good guys who own them too?