I simply do not understand Modern - Doncic vs Mantle

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Gorditadogg

No, Jordan pushed off and the refs didn't call it. When you go to Utah don't bring it up.

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Al, that was certainly my impression watching the game, and that's what it looks like on the replay.

[Snowman]

Jordans hand may have touched Russell, but it couldn't possibly be what sent Russell to the floor. Jordan crossed him up. It was Russell's own momentum that took him down. It wasn't a flop either. I get that the hand looks deceiving, but if you try to imagine how much force could have possibly been generated by Jordans hand in that instance, it couldn't have been much.

Try to look for the other angle of the play. The one from the side. It shows it better. There is no pushing off at all. He barely touches him.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Snowman

Jordans hand may have touched Russell, but it couldn't possibly be what sent Russell to the floor. Jordan crossed him up. It was Russell's own momentum that took him down. It wasn't a flop either. I get that the hand looks deceiving, but if you try to imagine how much force could have possibly been generated by Jordans hand in that instance, it couldn't have been much.

Try to look for the other angle of the play. The one from the side. It shows it better. There is no pushing off at all. He barely touches him.

From this angle it sure looks to me like he moves in response to the shove. I would not call that barely touching and it looks intentional. Another angle would be interesting if you can find.

[cgjackson222]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

From this angle it sure looks to me like he moves in response to the shove. I would not call that barely touching and it looks intentional. Another angle would be interesting if you can find.

My apologies for prolonging this non-baseball diversion, but:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVGNmQSySvw

Look at 3:07

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by cgjackson222

My apologies for prolonging this non-baseball diversion, but:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVGNmQSySvw

Look at 3:07

Yep, still a push-off.

[Exhibitman]

Here's the thing about hand force: it can be deceiving. I once worked with a structural pest control expert on a construction defect case where water penetration had wrecked a 12' beam under a walkway in a condo complex. One of his favorite things to do in these wood rot cases was to take hold of the beam in a bare hand and pull and crumble chunks of it barehanded. An amazing and incredibly damning piece of evidence: beams that support entire walkways are not supposed to crumble in hand. Play that for a jury and watch the defense try to hide under the table. So i tried it, figuring that if this little guy (probably 150#) could crush a beam with one hand, my 6'4" 250# body could too. Guess what? I couldn't make a dent. Little bastard had hands like pistons. I have little doubt that all of these NBA players are tremendously strong and that what looks like a small push when MJ does it feels like a big push from me.

[Snowman]

If Jordan pushed Russell, it would be evident from all angles. But the side view clearly refutes that theory. Look at Jordan's hand here as it makes contact with Russell's hip. It's a bump at most. The hand bounces off the hip and glides downward, bouncing off his calf. If he was pushing off, you would see Jordan's hand bend. You would see his fingers pressed into Russel's shorts/hip/ass cheek. You would see the hand pressing into Russell. But it doesn't. Not even a little bit. Jordan's fingers are straight. They don't even conform to Russell's hip at any point. Russell's jersey doesn't even move at all. And Jordan's hand just falls down. Jordan crossed him over big-time. Russell's own momentum is what takes him down. If you think this is some sort of Kung Fu Bruce Lee white magic move by Michael Jordan that sent Bryon Russell to the floor, then your license to argue anything on behalf of anyone in any court of law should be revoked because you are an idiot who is completely incapable of reason.


Skip to the 3:05 mark and just watch it on loop. This is absolutely irrefutable. He did not push off at all. He exerts effectively zero force on Bryon Russell.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVGNmQSySvw