Anyone changing their collecting plans when Topps is gone?

packs · #1 08-24-2021, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deweyinthehall

Me too and, sadly, I agree. Had our generation (boomers and those immediately after) been presented with the options kids have today, traditional cards would have died out before Donruss and Fleer came to market. We were lucky we managed come of age in a different era. For many reasons, some not having anything to do with cards.

Lucky for you, maybe. But aren't those people who grew up with wax packs the same people who now run these companies and have decided to shift the market to adult-only consumers?

ASF123 · #2 08-24-2021, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

Lucky for you, maybe. But aren't those people who grew up with wax packs the same people who now run these companies and have decided to shift the market to adult-only consumers?

I don't think they're the ones "deciding" to shift the market. They're responding to structural changes.

packs · #3 08-24-2021, 12:24 PM

Those changes are driven internally. No one asked for products that cost 300 or more per box.

deweyinthehall · #4 08-24-2021, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

Those changes are driven internally. No one asked for products that cost 300 or more per box.

Correct, but there seem to be more than enough willing to buy them - a fact which will confound me to my dying day.

Bigdaddy · #5 08-24-2021, 08:39 PM

So a couple of predictions:

The Topps name will live on, either bought out by Fanatics or licensed by them. It has value, but only if it is producing cards
Fanatics will not produce cards for the demographic on Net54
Fanatics will not produce cards for kids
Fanatics will go in directions that Topps has started, but with vigor - severely limited releases, shiny stuff, NFTs, electonic cards, etc.
We (Net 54ers) will clamor for the good ol days, but it is demand from collectors that forced the market to where it is today

deweyinthehall · #6 08-25-2021, 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigdaddy

So a couple of predictions:

The Topps name will live on, either bought out by Fanatics or licensed by them. It has value, but only if it is producing cards
Fanatics will not produce cards for the demographic on Net54
Fanatics will not produce cards for kids
Fanatics will go in directions that Topps has started, but with vigor - severely limited releases, shiny stuff, NFTs, electonic cards, etc.
We (Net 54ers) will clamor for the good ol days, but it is demand from collectors that forced the market to where it is today

Pretty much. The only thing I might quibble with is the use of the terms "demand" and "collectors". The hobby has created at least some of the demand themselves in the same way the tobacco industry creates "demand" for that next smoke or the gaming industry creates "demand" for that next spin of the wheel or roll of the dice. Like an earlier commenter said, few if any "collectors" were sitting there saying - "what this hobby needs are some hyper expensive offerings and an end to real distribution". Though I have strong personal feelings on this, I really don't mean it prejudicially when I say the people in the market for these $$ things and for the lottery mentality aren't collectors in any sense of the word as it's been used in this hobby. They're investors or, perhaps less kindly, if not more accurately, gamblers. A Venn Diagram would should show some overlap between them and the traditional collector base, but I'm not certain it's significant.

It would be interesting to see what would happen if, after Fanatics takes over and does whatever they're going to do, some company could get the rights to produce a single, comprehensive (say, 800 or so cards) with wide and varied distribution channels, a handful of inserts, a few autos, a few parallels, and a traditional, almost Topps Heritage-like quality - I think there'd be a HUGE market for it.

clydepepper · #7 08-25-2021, 07:51 AM

I have never been so glad to be a 'little fish'.

.

Bigdaddy · #8 08-25-2021, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deweyinthehall

Pretty much. The only thing I might quibble with is the use of the terms "demand" and "collectors". The hobby has created at least some of the demand themselves in the same way the tobacco industry creates "demand" for that next smoke or the gaming industry creates "demand" for that next spin of the wheel or roll of the dice. Like an earlier commenter said, few if any "collectors" were sitting there saying - "what this hobby needs are some hyper expensive offerings and an end to real distribution". Though I have strong personal feelings on this, I really don't mean it prejudicially when I say the people in the market for these $$ things and for the lottery mentality aren't collectors in any sense of the word as it's been used in this hobby. They're investors or, perhaps less kindly, if not more accurately, gamblers. A Venn Diagram would should show some overlap between them and the traditional collector base, but I'm not certain it's significant.

It would be interesting to see what would happen if, after Fanatics takes over and does whatever they're going to do, some company could get the rights to produce a single, comprehensive (say, 800 or so cards) with wide and varied distribution channels, a handful of inserts, a few autos, a few parallels, and a traditional, almost Topps Heritage-like quality - I think there'd be a HUGE market for it.

I think you're Venn diagram comment is spot on. In earlier times, there was much more overlap between collectors (the majority) and investors/gamblers (the minority). But as $$ have flowed into the hobby, those two circles have separated and now the overlap is much smaller. And if the investors become disillusioned with their returns or distracted by some other shiny object, their money will flow out of the hobby, distressing prices. I think the modern market (and somewhat the high end vintage market) is the most prone to this occurrence. And it's not a matter of if, but rather when.

Bcwcardz · #9 09-02-2021, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deweyinthehall

Correct, but there seem to be more than enough willing to buy them - a fact which will confound me to my dying day.

The people buying now just look for �hits�. They are looking to make $ only. There are people who actually trash the base cards. These aren�t collectors coming into the hobby. They are gamblers looking to make money.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

robert67 · #10 09-02-2021, 02:01 PM

Just before the craziness of 2020, I sold or gifted almost all my modern cards.

Unfortunately, I liquidated my vintage cards many years ago. Not my brightest moment.

Now, I am 100% collecting vintage items.

As for Topps, I would consider 2022 the end even if Fanatics purchases Topps.

As stated above, it won't be the same.

jchcollins · #11 08-24-2021, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

Lucky for you, maybe. But aren't those people who grew up with wax packs the same people who now run these companies and have decided to shift the market to adult-only consumers?

Me personally, no. If you want to blame it on a generation I suppose you can but not sure what that solves.

packs · #12 08-24-2021, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jchcollins

Me personally, no. If you want to blame it on a generation I suppose you can but not sure what that solves.

I don't know if every problem needs a solution but they all have a start.

#13 08-24-2021, 04:36 PM

Topps is Done My post MLB Drops Topps After 70 Years, Trading Card SPAC Deal Terminated Topps Topps went down hill after 1985 some might disagree.

jchcollins · #14 08-31-2021, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

I don't know if every problem needs a solution but they all have a start.

Market forces and consumer habits of a different century are a lot more to blame than the notion of those in power somehow making shifts only upon curmudgeonly, generational lines. Times change yes, and that is low hanging fruit I suppose - but I would disagree with the generational answer outside of a punchline.

packs · #15 09-02-2021, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jchcollins

Market forces and consumer habits of a different century are a lot more to blame than the notion of those in power somehow making shifts only upon curmudgeonly, generational lines. Times change yes, and that is low hanging fruit I suppose - but I would disagree with the generational answer outside of a punchline.

I said a group of people collectively decided to raise the prices of products. Products began rising in price in the early 2000s. No one born in the late 80s, 90s, or 2000s could have made those decisions, but the people who did make the decision to raise pricing were the same people who grew up paying nickels and dimes for cards. Those things did happen. It's not an attack on a generation.

jchcollins · #16 09-02-2021, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

I said a group of people collectively decided to raise the prices of products. Products began rising in price in the early 2000s. No one born in the late 80s, 90s, or 2000s could have made those decisions, but the people who did make the decision to raise pricing were the same people who grew up paying nickels and dimes for cards. Those things did happen. It's not an attack on a generation.

Yes, but it's coincidental - and not because they were or were not of any certain generation. Had people born later been in the same position, it stands to reason they would have made the same or similar decisions based on the current situation. Correlation v. causation. That's my only point. You can blame whoever you like.

cardsagain74 · #17 08-24-2021, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jchcollins

Me personally, no. If you want to blame it on a generation I suppose you can but not sure what that solves.

But no day on the internet would be complete without bumping into the "my generation is so superior to younger one" ego-massaging posts somewhere

I just found the news disappointing from a sentimental perspective. Even with all the industry changes since '81, I think most of us who grew up anytime from the '50s through the '80s (when it comes to baseball cards and especially all the nostalgia we feel from them) think "Topps".

So it's a bit sad how the name won't be part of the hobby now. Especially after 70 years.

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