Let's talk about Hall of Fame candidates who have been "neglected"

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by SD

Oh I'm not questioning his credibility. I guarantee he has allot of insight and truths. I think his motives/ actions have been handled cowardly and his integrity/ timing has always been questionable .

His integrity is questionable. His motives have been horrible. But, again, anybody he's falsely accused? That's what I was responding to - the idea that an accusation is false because it came from Canseco. I'd argue the opposite is far more likely - that it's TRUE because it came from him.

[ThomasL]

Ok...rats60... as they say there is some ocean front property in Arizona for you to buy.

I guess you are trying to make the argument that you are innocent until proven guilty which I can appreciate...but realistically lets be honest here...probably at least 5-10 guys in the HOF used roids/PEDs and Selig as an owner and commish turned a blind eye for the sake of baseball.

And once Ortiz, Manny and A-Rod get in...who all actually tested positive post rule change will help my point and I will have a bigger argument for Raffy

My personal schoolboy idol Ivan Rodriguez I would bet used PEDs (named by Jose) as well as Piazza and several other HOFers (Tom House said Hank Aaron did by the way so stick that in your pipe and smoke it) and like I said if one is in all are in...

so a good question is should Jose Canseco be in the HOF???...based on 1. performance and 2 whistle blower status????

[Mike D.]

Originally Posted by ThomasL

so a good question is should Jose Canseco be in the HOF???...based on 1. performance and 2 whistle blower status????

I wouldn’t call him a “whistle blower” - he was more “The Godfather of steroid use in baseball who got mad when nobody wanted him when he thought he could still play and lashed out”.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by ThomasL

Ok...rats60... as they say there is some ocean front property in Arizona for you to buy.

I guess you are trying to make the argument that you are innocent until proven guilty which I can appreciate...but realistically lets be honest here...probably at least 5-10 guys in the HOF used roids/PEDs and Selig as an owner and commish turned a blind eye for the sake of baseball.

And once Ortiz, Manny and A-Rod get in...who all actually tested positive post rule change will help my point and I will have a bigger argument for Raffy

My personal schoolboy idol Ivan Rodriguez I would bet used PEDs (named by Jose) as well as Piazza and several other HOFers (Tom House said Hank Aaron did by the way so stick that in your pipe and smoke it) and like I said if one is in all are in...

so a good question is should Jose Canseco be in the HOF???...based on 1. performance and 2 whistle blower status????

If you have any evidence, present it. I don't believe baseless claims. I am not buying your Arizona land because it is also a baseless claim.

Manny is at 28% in the HOF voting. He isn't ever getting in. ARod never tested positive, but I don't see him ever getting in. Ortiz was rumored to have tested positive, he will be an interesting case. Even if he slides in, it will do nothing for the case of someone who did test positive, peaked at 13% and fell off the ballot after the 4th year.

[Peter_Spaeth]

It's a hugely difficult, and inevitably somewhat arbitrary, line drawing problem. But yes Ortiz is going to mess up any effort to explain the way the line has been drawn.

[Ricky]

Originally Posted by ThomasL

Ok...rats60... as they say there is some ocean front property in Arizona for you to buy.

I guess you are trying to make the argument that you are innocent until proven guilty which I can appreciate...but realistically lets be honest here...probably at least 5-10 guys in the HOF used roids/PEDs and Selig as an owner and commish turned a blind eye for the sake of baseball.

And once Ortiz, Manny and A-Rod get in...who all actually tested positive post rule change will help my point and I will have a bigger argument for Raffy

My personal schoolboy idol Ivan Rodriguez I would bet used PEDs (named by Jose) as well as Piazza and several other HOFers (Tom House said Hank Aaron did by the way so stick that in your pipe and smoke it) and like I said if one is in all are in...

so a good question is should Jose Canseco be in the HOF???...based on 1. performance and 2 whistle blower status????

What was it that Ortiz tested positive for?

Tom House said Henry Aaron used PEDs? Please provide a link. In Aaron’s autobiography he said he tried greenies once and felt so weird that it scared him and he never tried them again.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by Ricky

Tom House said Henry Aaron used PEDs? Please provide a link. In Aaron’s autobiography he said he tried greenies once and felt so weird that it scared him and he never tried them again.

He also went from 29 homers in 160 games at age 34 to 40 homers in 120 games at age 39.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Tabe

He also went from 29 homers in 160 games at age 34 to 40 homers in 120 games at age 39.

His totals fluctuated throughout his career. Some years as low as the 20s, back as far as the 1950s, many of course in the 40s. If you're suggesting Aaron's career arc suggests he used, you need a better analysis than that.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

His totals fluctuated throughout his career. Some years as low as the 20s, back as far as the 1950s, many of course in the 40s. If you're suggesting Aaron's career arc suggests he used, you need a better analysis than that.

His career arc suggests that he would put up his best home run % at the age of 39?!!? In an era when players were basically never even good at that age?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Tabe

His career arc suggests that he would put up his best home run % at the age of 39?!!? In an era when players were basically never even good at that age?

You haven't analyzed his career you've juxtaposted two cherry picked seasons.

The age 34 season isn't really even relevant to the point you are now making.

[Ricky]

Originally Posted by Tabe

His career arc suggests that he would put up his best home run % at the age of 39?!!? In an era when players were basically never even good at that age?

As someone who watched Aaron closely in these years, there was no PED use that explained his home run arc. His minor fluctuations were throughout his entire career and he was extremely consistent. The 29 HRs in 1968 were in the year of the pitcher when everyone's totals were down. He put up 47 in 1971 in a home run friendly ballpark but hitting 44 or so was the norm for him. In 1973, Evans and Davey Johnson were kids, they weren't 40 years old. The bad information in this thread concerning Aaron is astounding.