Vintage Undervalued Roookies

[AGuinness]

I think the Speaker T206 could be on the list, which is considered his rookie by some (I'm sure that topic could be a whole other post).
Overall, I'm not sure that ANY cards these days are being undervalued. Some of the prices are just jaw-dropping. I don't think this is a bubble, per say, but I think that it's very likely that many cards will drop back down some when the pandemic really slows down and people get back to "normal" lives (some cards certainly much more than others). We'll see how many of the new collector/investors stay active, how many sell to collect the profits and how many shove their cards in the back of the closet.

[packs]

All due respect to Tris Speaker and Eddie Collins but why exactly are they due for a bump? Outside of this board specifically, I think it would be tough to find any casual fan who is familiar with either player. The images on their T206's aren't very inspiring either. I know people like the Collins portrait but it doesn't catch my eye like say, the Lajoie with bat does.

I think when it comes to T206's card image is always going to play a major role in value. That's why Shag and Titus are where they are. And why the Lajoie with bat is where it is. Not sure I see any reason to pay more for Speaker or Collins.

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by packs

All due respect to Tris Speaker and Eddie Collins but why exactly are they due for a bump? Outside of this board specifically, I think it would be tough to find any casual fan who is familiar with either player. The images on their T206's aren't very inspiring either. I know people like the Collins portrait but it doesn't catch my eye like say, the Lajoie with bat does.

I think when it comes to T206's card image is always going to play a major role in value. That's why Shag and Titus are where they are. And why the Lajoie with bat is where it is. Not sure I see any reason to pay more for Speaker or Collins.

Maybe one reason to pay more for Speaker or Collins over Lajoie is that they were better baseball players.

[packs]

Originally Posted by mechanicalman

Maybe one reason to pay more for Speaker or Collins over Lajoie is that they were better baseball players.

That's not how it works though. Otherwise Ten Million's Obak wouldn't be worth what it is. There needs to be an X factor for a card to take off that otherwise hasn't. I don't see a ton of interest coming Eddie Collins' way.

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by packs

That's not how it works though. Otherwise Ten Million's Obak wouldn't be worth what it is. There needs to be an X factor for a card to take off that otherwise hasn't. I don't see a ton of interest coming Eddie Collins' way.

Sorry, I don't know what system of valuation to which you're referring. The topic at hand is undervalued rookie cards; not the premium paid for cool mustaches, funny names, or beautiful sunsets.

[packs]

Originally Posted by mechanicalman

Sorry, I don't know what system of valuation to which you're referring. The topic at hand is undervalued rookie cards; not the premium paid for cool mustaches, funny names, or beautiful sunsets.

Sure, but for something to be undervalued it has to be priced below the level the hobby generally views the player or card. So when someone says Ted Williams' rookie card is undervalued, it's because the hobby more or less loves Williams.

You're talking about Eddie Collins and Tris Speaker, who don't have that same status in the hobby. I think their cards are priced accordingly per the interest they have. So I'm wondering what you see. If you think they were better than people give them credit for, that's not how I interpreted the question about value. But is definitely fair to say. They were great players.

[jchcollins]

Feel free to disagree, but unless it's like the M101 Babe Ruth, I've never thought that some black and white cards have gotten their due simply because of that. Most if we are being honest simply aren't as attractive as color issues.

[Great Winfield]

There are two that stand out to me in a relative sense (making no judgement on whether the overall valuation "tide" is too high or not):

1. 1965 Topps Joe Morgan - There are only 80 PSA 9's and 2 10's. Sure, it is a two-player card, but the 9 at ~$2500 is almost certainly among the very cheapest high-grade rookie cards for any top 20 all-time player.

2. 1939 Play Ball Ted Williams - There are only 88 PSA 8's, 1 8.5, 12 9's and 1 10. Given the soaring prices of other top players, how is the PSA 8 not a six-figure card?? A mythical figure and American hero. His Baseballreference.com page is pure stats porn. Almost 5 prime years lost to military service. Most folks likely know about him not winning MVP in either of his triple crown seasons (not to mention the 1941 0.406 avg season) - but how about posting a 190 OPS+ in his final age-41 season, better than Joe D's BEST ever such figure. Pretty good final AB too!

[rman444]

Originally Posted by Great Winfield

His Baseballreference.com page is pure stats porn.

This made me smile

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Great Winfield

There are two that stand out to me in a relative sense (making no judgement on whether the overall valuation "tide" is too high or not):

1. 1965 Topps Joe Morgan - There are only 80 PSA 9's and 2 10's. Sure, it is a two-player card, but the 9 at ~$2500 is almost certainly among the very cheapest high-grade rookie cards for any top 20 all-time player.

2. 1939 Play Ball Ted Williams - There are only 88 PSA 8's, 1 8.5, 12 9's and 1 10. Given the soaring prices of other top players, how is the PSA 8 not a six-figure card?? A mythical figure and American hero. His Baseballreference.com page is pure stats porn. Almost 5 prime years lost to military service. Most folks likely know about him not winning MVP in either of his triple crown seasons (not to mention the 1941 0.406 avg season) - but how about posting a 190 OPS+ in his final age-41 season, better than Joe D's BEST ever such figure. Pretty good final AB too!

With due respect to Bill James, I would not rate Morgan in the top 20 players of all time. Anywhere south of 2 I would not argue with Williams though.

[rats60]

It seems like all the guys who lost prime years to the war are underrated. Joe DiMaggio, Bob Feller, Hank Greenberg, Johnny Mize, etc. Even though Musial only lost 1 year, it still could have made a big difference, such as hitting 500+ HRs. With Williams spending 5 years in the service, people used to give him credit, but not really anymore.

For Williams just give him 154 game averages for those 5 seasons and he has 2400 runs, 3550 hits, 700 2b, 700 HR, 2450 RBI, 6500 TB, 2700 BB and 160 WAR. He is now top 5 in all those and 1st in runs, RBI and BB. If he happens to break Ruth's HR record first then his profile goes higher. As time goes by people just forget and not having those numbers suppress his card values.

[Illustrious]

Originally Posted by Great Winfield

There are two that stand out to me in a relative sense (making no judgement on whether the overall valuation "tide" is too high or not):

1. 1965 Topps Joe Morgan - There are only 80 PSA 9's and 2 10's. Sure, it is a two-player card, but the 9 at ~$2500 is almost certainly among the very cheapest high-grade rookie cards for any top 20 all-time player.

2. 1939 Play Ball Ted Williams - There are only 88 PSA 8's, 1 8.5, 12 9's and 1 10. Given the soaring prices of other top players, how is the PSA 8 not a six-figure card?? A mythical figure and American hero. His Baseballreference.com page is pure stats porn. Almost 5 prime years lost to military service. Most folks likely know about him not winning MVP in either of his triple crown seasons (not to mention the 1941 0.406 avg season) - but how about posting a 190 OPS+ in his final age-41 season, better than Joe D's BEST ever such figure. Pretty good final AB too!

One of the first things I did last Spring when I saw the sports card market was about go into a boom period, was look at the vintage cards I had on my want list and pick 1 or 2 that I knew would probably explode if I didn't get them asap. For me, the number one card I thought would get out of my reach if I didn't make a move was the '39 Play Ball Ted Williams RC, and I was fortunate enough to be able to win a SGC 1 for around $1200. The number two card I on my list, which technically is not a RC, was the '52 Topps Willie Mays, which I bought from Dean's at a inflated price at the time, but in hindsight was quite a deal.

[BRoberts]

Originally Posted by Illustrious

One of the first things I did last Spring when I saw the sports card market was about go into a boom period, was look at the vintage cards I had on my want list and pick 1 or 2 that I knew would probably explode if I didn't get them asap.

Congratulations on being able to forecast this boom period just before it happened. You probably wish you had bought more.

[Illustrious]

Originally Posted by BRoberts

Congratulations on being able to forecast this boom period just before it happened. You probably wish you had bought more.

Well I wouldn't say I forecast it before it happened, I just saw the frenzy in modern cards happening, especially in basketball with the hype from the Last Dance documentary pushing things up, and I knew it would eventually reach the vintage market. Of course I wish I could have bought more vintage cards then, but I was pushing it as-is with what I could afford, and I was more concerned with just having the cards in my collection before I was priced out, over buying multiples for future resale.

[JollyElm]

I beg you, for the love of God, for everything holy, please, please, please, please FIX THE FRICKIN' MISSPELLING IN THE THREAD TITLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I'm begging you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Republicaninmass]

Originally Posted by JollyElm

I beg you, for the love of God, for everything holy, please, please, please, please FIX THE FRICKIN' MISSPELLING IN THE THREAD TITLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I'm begging you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe the OP Is a native Canadian eh?

[Huysmans]

Originally Posted by Republicaninmass

Maybe the OP Is a native Canadian eh?

Impossible. We only care about hockey cards, toques, maple syrup and Rush.

We have no time for silly shit like men running around bases, apple pie, or an overgrown woman made of copper with a sore arm who just loiters and can't seem to find a gown that fits properly.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Huysmans

Impossible. We only care about hockey cards, toques, maple syrup and Rush.

We have no time for silly shit like men running around bases, apple pie, or an overgrown woman made of copper with a sore arm who just loiters and can't seem to find a gown that fits properly.

Triumph would like a word with you...

[Huysmans]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Triumph would like a word with you...

Hold On, don't do Too Much Thinking. Just because I may be an Ordinary Man who's Headed for Nowhere and living in A World of Fantasy, doesn't mean I'm unaware that Somebody's out There like Triumph.

Never say Never and always Follow your Heart, it's the Rocky Mountain Way my friend.....

[bigred1]

Stan Musial for me, even lost age 24 season for military service.