T206 Reference / Reflections.....Tuesday Nite Trivia

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

I believe no back run is complete without the no-print, if such a front-back combo exists. In this case it does, so I agree with Ron that at worst it should get honorable mention on the list of Lajoie w/ bat, back combos

Ryan

I'm for bestowing honorable mention to Blank-Back (B-B) T206's; but, the problem I have regarding the B-B phenomena is that it's random.

We have mapped out the various T-brands for each and every T206 subject....we know what to hunt for.

The B-B card are an unknown. You can continue on a "wild goose" chase for a B-B of a particular T206 for many years and never, ever find it.

Furthermore, TPG dudes are not always certain if a T206 is a B-B, and therefore they label some "skinned". That's exactly what they did with
my Schulte.....

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TED Z
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[Ronnie73]

Originally Posted by tedzan

Ryan

I'm for bestowing honorable mention to Blank-Back (B-B) T206's; but, the problem I have regarding the B-B phenomena is that it's random.

We have mapped out the various T-brands for each and every T206 subject....we know what to hunt for.

The B-B card are an unknown. You can continue on a "wild goose" chase for a B-B of a particular T206 for many years and never, ever find it.

Furthermore, TPG dudes are not always certain if a T206 is a B-B, and therefore they label some "skinned". That's exactly what they did with
my Schulte.....

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TED Z
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Hi Ted, Ryan was referring to my comment on the Lajoie Sweet Caporal 350-460 Factory 30 "No Print" card. I agree that Blank Backs can be random but the "No Print" Sweet Caporals follow your 350/460 series Group B list perfectly, even though they are basically Scrap cards.


Here is a little T206 History of the "No Prints". It's only my history with them and I'm sure there's missing pieces that I don't know about. I figured I'd share this since David Hall is selling his amazing collection.

I remember in 2010 I was just starting to study all the different combinations and how they lined up. At that time, I was left with two groups of cards I was studying. One group of 29 cards and the other group of 28 cards. Nearly 4 years later, I found my first and second "No Print" and they were both from the 28 card group. Almost 2 years later is when a large group of them started showing up on eBay and they went undetected for a couple weeks until someone posted here on Net54 questioning them and basically costing me a lot more money. That large group of cards was slowly auctioned off over a years time. 27 of the 28 card group showed up during that time. Between 2 and 8 cards of each of the 27 cards were discovered at that time. The only thing was that my checklist from 2010 still showed a card missing from the group that sold on eBay. That card was the Nap LaJoie With Bat. I was determined to find one since I had the other 27 cards. The odds told me that with enough searching, I would find one, and I did. Once I had it in my hands, I shared my checklist with Pete Gustafson, who at the time, we were both working together to corner the market on these cards. Between the two of us, we owned 75 to 80 percent of all the "No Prints" that sold on eBay that year. Once I shared my checklist with Pete, he asked if he could share it with David Hall, which I said yes. After that, things got a bit confusing because I started seeing my checklist show up on posts here on Net54 which was fine, but the posts also said that David had a complete set of the 28 cards. I figured it was possible but it was only a week after I released the checklist. It was then that someone questioned if David had a Lajoie With Bat because one was never seen sold on eBay during that year. I basically knew what David had, since Pete sold his group to David, and I kept track of what I won, what Pete won, and what neither of us won. It was eventually confirmed that David was short a few cards from the 28 card subset, including Lajoie. I still own 54 of the 107 "No Print" cards that were sold that year, along with my original 2 cards and the Lajoie.

[tedzan]

Good morning Ron and Ryan,

Sorry, but I misconstrued Ryan's post (#735). My bad.

Ron, I really appreciate your story regarding the 28 cards from the 350/460 series with the SWEET CAP, Factory #30 backs which were discovered in recent years.
It was nice to see my long-ago theory regarding this group of T206's confirmed by you.

Thanks again,

TED Z
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[tedzan]

I received an email from a Net54 reader regarding my Schulte card and it's back. I'm convinced that 85% of the back
of this card is a legitimate blank back. The upper left part of the back is actually paper loss, which may have resulted
from this card having been pasted in an album.

SGC graded it as "Skinned". Which I strongly disagree with them. And, of course they remarked...."that's my opinion".
Their professional opinion deems it otherwise !


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TED Z
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[tedzan]

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE....Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *



…………….. The 150 Series backs associated with the Elite 11 subjects ……………..


As most of you T206 collectors know by now, these 11 subjects in the 150/350 Series are extremely difficult to find with the PIEDMONT 350 back.
They are also quite tough to find with the EPDG back. These subjects were not printed with the usual SOVEREIGN 350, nor SWEET CAPORAL 350,
nor the various 350 series Assorted backs (as all the other subjects in the 150/350 Series).

This strange curiosity was first explored on this forum back in 2007, when I discovered the Carl Lundgren (Cubs) card with a PIEDMONT 350 back.
This Lundgren card prompted me to post a thread in which we ran several surveys on certain 150/350 Series cards. Check-it-out...… Elite 11

Here's an interesting anecdote I'll include in this post. Some years ago at the Cleveland National a well-dressed gentleman came to my booth, and
sat down and introduced himself.....David Hall. By then, David's Master T206 set comprised of 4000+ cards. He asked me about these rare T206's,
which I refer to as the "Elite 11". He chuckled at the fact that these T206's were considered quite rare with PIEDMONT 350 backs. I recall, the only
Elite 11 card in his collection at that time was Ewing. I had 4 of these cards at my table, and he purchased them. More importantly, it was the start
of a very nice friendship.

OK, I'll start this show with my Elite 11 cards...…






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TED Z
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[tedzan]

Additional info...…

Lundgren (Cubs) was printed with only three backs (PIEDMONT 150, 350, and EPDG).

Ewing and Tom Jones were also printed with SWEET CAPORAL 150, Factory #649 (overprint).


TED Z
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[tedzan]

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE....Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *



…………….. The 150 Series backs associated with the Elite 11 subjects ……………..


I have been tracking the source of these Elite 11 cards since 2008, when I acquired a mid-size lot of T206's from an Antique dealer in Atlanta.
He told me that these cards were from an original collection in a town nearby Atlanta. This collection was strictly PIEDMONT cards; and, I was
pleasantly surprised to find 8 of the Elite 11 cards in this group.

Then approx. 7 years ago, another original collection of T206's was discovered in the Atlanta area. And, this collection included 7 Elite 11 cards.

Furthermore, 2 years ago Turner Engle (asoriano) reported here of an original collection from Georgia.. Georgia Find: 878 T205's and T206's
In this collection were four Elite 11 cards, including the very scarce Spencer card.

It appears that Factory #25 shipped PIEDMONT cigarette packs (containing 1st print run PIEDMONT 350 cards) to Georgia. I say this since some
of the Joe Doyle Nat'L cards have been found in T206 collections originating from Georgia. Best example of this is Senator Richard Russell's T206
collection. It is the first known source of the Elite 11 cards. Russell's original set also includes the Joe Doyle Nat'L card. Russell lived in Winder, a
town not far from Atlanta. He collected Tobacco cards as a teenager during 1909 - 1910.

To date, my records indicate that 4 original collections of T206's discovered in the surrounding area of Atlanta include the rare T206's that I refer
to as the Elite 11 cards.

Please chime in here if you have any of these Elite 11 cards of which you are certain of their provenance.

Thank you,


TED Z
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