Poll: is Mariano Rivera one of the top 10 pitchers of all time?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

You are comparing apples and oranges. Save rate is not win rate. You can blow the save and still win the game so save rate is the more restrictive of the two. I think we can all agree that starter and closer are two different pitching positions. We can also agree that Mariano was by far the greatest closer ever. Mariano was superior to any other closer ever by more than the best starting pitcher ever (you fill in your choice)has been to the second best starting pitcher ever. I’ll stop there. If I had to get one hitter out and could pick one pitcher to do it it would be Mariano. If I needed a starting pitcher for game 7 of the World Series, and I would be hoping he could go deep into the game, it would not be Mariano.

You have to wonder at his remarkably low inherited runner total. If he was indeed the best ever at getting that one batter out, why wasn't he used more in emergency situations, as opposed to starting the ninth with a lead? 8th inning, two men on, none out, down by a run, don't you want your best pitcher in there to keep the game in check? But I think Rivera was rarely the guy who got that call.

[Throttlesteer]

I'm really dreading the discussion that comes about when Jeter goes in. I'm sure he'll be considered the greatest ever by someone.

[doug.goodman]

Originally Posted by Throttlesteer

I'm really dreading the discussion that comes about when Jeter goes in. I'm sure he'll be considered the greatest ever by someone.

At least he played entire games...

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Throttlesteer

I'm really dreading the discussion that comes about when Jeter goes in. I'm sure he'll be considered the greatest ever by someone.

It will be very hard to argue he was better than Wagner or Ripken or (assuming you count him as a SS) ARod. For Jeter I think much of your rating depends on how much you count defense for a SS -- if you count it a lot, that's going to take away from him because he was pretty average all told.

[doug.goodman]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It will be very hard to argue he was better than Wagner or Ripken or (assuming you count him as a SS) ARod. For Jeter I think much of your rating depends on how much you count defense for a SS -- if you count it a lot, that's going to take away from him because he was pretty average all told.

If you take Jeter out of the Yankees lineup, does Mariano have nearly as many save opportunities?

[Bigdaddy]

Originally Posted by doug.goodman

If you take Jeter out of the Yankees lineup, does Mariano have nearly as many save opportunities?

And if you take Mo out of the Yankees lineup, are there as many post season victories?

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Throttlesteer

I'm really dreading the discussion that comes about when Jeter goes in. I'm sure he'll be considered the greatest ever by someone.

I would not say he is the greatest ever or even the best shortstop but I doubt you can name a singe player that tried harder while playing.