Has T206 Ty Cobb Greenback TOPPED OUT

[luciobar1980]

I think it has, for now, and perhaps the Red will begin to surge. I’ve always preferred the Red, as its a bolder, stronger image, IMO.

[bbcard1]

If I may, the whole thing is weird. While, setting aside the Wagner argument, Cobb is clearly the best player in arguably the most popular set of all time, there have always seemed to be enough of them of go around. I have all for in a condition that satisfies me (read low grade) but have been kind of surprised at the surge.

[darwinbulldog]

Originally Posted by bbcard1

While, setting aside the Wagner argument, Cobb is clearly the best player in arguably the most popular set of all time

That's not what clearly means. I'd take the greatest pitcher ever over the 4th(?) best hitter ever.

[Huysmans]

Originally Posted by darwinbulldog

That's not what clearly means. I'd take the greatest pitcher ever over the 4th(?) best hitter ever.

I wouldn't.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by darwinbulldog

That's not what clearly means. I'd take the greatest pitcher ever over the 4th(?) best hitter ever.

I think you could fairly rank Cobb anywhere from 2nd (behind Ruth) to 4th (behind Ruth Williams and Mays).

I don't think you could fairly rank Johnson behind anyone.

That said, pitchers are never going to approach hitters in terms of card values.

[joshuanip]

Leon - My guess is that its the least pop and a portrait, so it checks all collector the boxes from player, type, scarcity characteristics. That said, I think the bat off shoulder aesthetically is his best card in the set.

Dmitry - Here is a good pop article on the T206 Cobb versions, there is more greens than people think...

https://prewarcards.com/2017/09/29/t...ckett-grading/

Ryan - Good comparison on the Ruth's. The (yellow) #53 is similar to the green cobb, but I personally like the one below better, I guess its the "bat off shoulder" version...but his bat is on his shoulder...

[Leon]

144 Ruth....That there is a great card, I want it.

Back to the green Cobb....I guess if I did T206 I might like the green better because of scarcity, and they do look great, but I think it is red as my fave....followed by one of the bat versions....but green is in the hunt there too as nice specimens can really pop.

Originally Posted by joshuanip

Leon - My guess is that its the least pop and a portrait, so it checks all collector the boxes from player, type, scarcity characteristics. That said, I think the bat off shoulder aesthetically is his best card in the set.

Dmitry - Here is a good pop article on the T206 Cobb versions, there is more greens than people think...

https://prewarcards.com/2017/09/29/t...ckett-grading/

Ryan - Good comparison on the Ruth's. The (yellow) #53 is similar to the green cobb, but I personally like the one below better, I guess its the "bat off shoulder" version...but his bat is on his shoulder...

[Touch'EmAll]

Ok, yes, more greens than people think. However, what about when you get out of the low grade stuff and into the true PSA 5 and higher? I understand the pops really drop off.

[esd10]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I think you could fairly rank Cobb anywhere from 2nd (behind Ruth) to 4th (behind Ruth Williams and Mays).

I don't think you could fairly rank Johnson behind anyone.

That said, pitchers are never going to approach hitters in terms of card values.

I think Cobb is the greatest hitter in baseball history and that means better than ruth just look at the hof induction numbers. These votes had been cast right after these to greats careers just ended and cobb had more votes than ruth

[tiger8mush]

Originally Posted by esd10

I think Cobb is the greatest hitter in baseball history and that means better than ruth just look at the hof induction numbers. These votes had been cast right after these to greats careers just ended and cobb had more votes than ruth

1936 HOF Voting

Player / Vote % / War7
1 Ty Cobb 98.2% 69.2
2 Babe Ruth 95.1% 84.7
3 Honus Wagner 95.1% 65.4
4 Christy Mathewson 90.7% 68.5
5 Walter Johnson 83.6% 89.5

Devil's advocate - Matty had a higher vote % than WaJo, but many/most consider the latter to be the best pitcher of all time. Johnson had a better 7 year peak performance than any of those guys yet only placed 5th on the ballot.

[joshuanip]

Originally Posted by tiger8mush

1936 HOF Voting

Player / Vote % / War7
1 Ty Cobb 98.2% 69.2
2 Babe Ruth 95.1% 84.7
3 Honus Wagner 95.1% 65.4
4 Christy Mathewson 90.7% 68.5
5 Walter Johnson 83.6% 89.5

Devil's advocate - Matty had a higher vote % than WaJo, but many/most consider the latter to be the best pitcher of all time. Johnson had a better 7 year peak performance than any of those guys yet only placed 5th on the ballot.

They were all great. Matty is #1 below. Haha.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndica...-time.amp.html

In all seriousness, the induction list screwed up the voting tally for the 19th century players. I bet you that cy would have been in the first class had they not discount the veterans vote by half and still kept the 75% threshold. Could be a good thing too, excluded cap.

[Touch'EmAll]

Couple things to consider.

Ty Cobb was primarily a dead ball era player. The emphasis on power and home runs was extremely minimal. Cobb was a large man for the era - at least 6'1" and 175-180 lbs. If Cobb came along 15 years later, I suspect his power/HR numbers would infact be significant.

And his cards, especially the green, could be quite a bit overstated on population. I bet a lot of his cards have been sent in to PSA/SGC multiple times trying to squeeze out the highest grade possible. This is especially true when you get to the true VG/EX to EX+ grade cards. When you see the PSA pops on, say, an EX 5 how reliable is that number? I have seen quite a few green Cobb's that are off centered and/or with other problems - which can pose troubles for true investment caliber status.

[packs]

Cobb led the league in slugging 6 years in a row during the dead ball era. I think it's reasonable to assume if he were at his peak in the lively ball era he'd have done some serious damage. He was 33 when Ruth (age 25) hit 54 in 1920, so he was well over his physical peak by the time the ball started jumping. He averaged 39 doubles and 16 triples a season over his career.

[brianp-beme]

As a collector you can't go wrong with any of the Cobb T206 cards. The Bat Off is probably the most aesthetically pleasing, the Green and Red are both nice portraits, but I have always had a soft spot for the Bat On. It is Cobb's one T206 card that depicts best both the competitive and ornery side of his personality, which of course is what drove him to such great baseball heights, and the aspect of his career and life that has continued to fascinate us about him a century later.

Brian

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by luciobar1980

I think it has, for now, and perhaps the Red will begin to surge. I’ve always preferred the Red, as its a bolder, stronger image, IMO.

I have no idea on prices, but for me the Red is perhaps THE classic pre-war card.

[MR RAREBACK]

I hope they go down I need more

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I have no idea on prices, but for me the Red is perhaps THE classic pre-war card.

I like the green cobb but think it is at a fairly high point but, or course, no one knows for sure..
Red Cobby is a great and classic card. If I get another I want something other than a T206....probably a nice Coupon, as I used to own, but they too have soared.

[packs]

I bought my green before the jump so I'm perfectly happy with the current price point. BUT I have to say, I really don't understand how the Bat Off card isn't the most expensive of the bunch. In my opinion it is the most beautiful card in the set, let alone the most beautiful Cobb:

[RedsFan1941]

Originally Posted by packs

I bought my green before the jump so I'm perfectly happy with the current price point. BUT I have to say, I really don't understand how the Bat Off card isn't the most expensive of the bunch. In my opinion it is the most beautiful card in the set, let alone the most beautiful Cobb:

agree! Great card!

[joshuanip]

Of the big 4, Wagner and Plank are unattainable, and Doyle and Magee are not popular as players to the common collector.

As someone said earlier, who is the best player in the set, hands down Cobb. Which Cobb card is the best in the set (backs aside), hands down its greenie. Although the scarcity of the green is not that far off from the others, the simple fact that its his "best" card of the bunch makes demand the trump card of its popularity. And I think that will continue to influence the relative values between the cobb types. Ala 52 mantle supply/demand dynamics.

I don't think its being manipulated, I bought my green Cobb a couple months ago, in its highs.... I only have 2 T206 cards, my green cobb and a Cy young...

I don't care if it comes down in price, all things are cyclical. From ole Kass - Price is what you pay, value is what you get.

[Leon]

I am just curious, why is it hands down Cobb greenie? What makes it the best?

Originally Posted by joshuanip

Of the big 4, Wagner and Plank are unattainable, and Doyle and Magee are not popular as players to the common collector.

As someone said earlier, who is the best player in the set, hands down Cobb. Which Cobb card is the best in the set (backs aside), hands down its greenie. Although the scarcity of the green is not that far off from the others, the simple fact that its his "best" card of the bunch makes demand the trump card of its popularity. And I think that will continue to influence the relative values between the cobb types. Ala 52 mantle supply/demand dynamics.

I don't think its being manipulated, I bought my green Cobb a couple months ago, in its highs.... I only have 2 T206 cards, my green cobb and a Cy young...

I don't care if it comes down in price, all things are cyclical. From ole Kass - Price is what you pay, value is what you get.

[sterlingfox]

Originally Posted by joshuanip

... Although the scarcity of the green is not that far off from the others...

I disagree. It's clearly scarcer than the other three.

Scarcity Rank:
Cobb Portrait, Green Background 73
Cobb Bat on Shoulder 266
Cobb Bat off Shoulder 414
Cobb Portrait, Red Background 524

[sterlingfox]

Originally Posted by luciobar1980

I think it has, for now, and perhaps the Red will begin to surge. I’ve always preferred the Red, as its a bolder, stronger image, IMO.

The problem with the red is that it's dead last in terms of scarcity (it's a super print, and there's more red Cobbs out there than any other T206 card).

That alone will hurt it's ability to be run up. There's enough (for now) to meet demand, and is preventing a similar huge run up - although it is still going up, just at a much slower pace.

The green port is 73rd out of 524 in scarcity, and is by far the hardest to find of the 4 Cobbs.

[Paul S]

Originally Posted by sterlingfox

The problem with the red is that it's dead last in terms of scarcity (it's a super print, and there's more red Cobbs out there than any other T206 card).

That alone will hurt it's ability to be run up. There's enough (for now) to meet demand, and is preventing a similar huge run up - although it is still going up, just at a much slower pace.

The green port is 73rd out of 524 in scarcity, and is by far the hardest to find of the 4 Cobbs.

I'll take your word as to the relative scarcity of the green, but "hardest"Cobb to find? Money aside, you can pick one up whenever you want - just hang out until you find the one you like the most.

[tiger8mush]

Originally Posted by Paul S

I'll take your word as to the relative scarcity of the green, but "hardest"Cobb to find? Money aside, you can pick one up whenever you want - just hang out until you find the one you like the most.

He qualified it by saying "of the 4 Cobbs". His statement is true, its the least supply of the 4 T206 Cobbs. Its obviously not the toughest of ANY Cobb card.

[Paul S]

Originally Posted by tiger8mush

He qualified it by saying "of the 4 Cobbs". His statement is true, its the least supply of the 4 T206 Cobbs. Its obviously not the toughest of ANY Cobb card.

Agreed - I could have phrased myself a bit better, although the title of THIS thread is about the greenie - so obviously I meant hardest of the Cobb T206s, and not 'any".

As an aside to the comments a few posts above, the bat off is my fave of the T206 Cobbs.

[Rhotchkiss]

I think there is an interesting parallel to the 1933 Goudey Ruths. There are 4 Cobb T206s and 4 Goudey Ruths. The Green Cobb is the most expensive and is most scarce. I am not a Goudey guy, but I am pretty sure the Yellow Ruth is the one to have, no? Why is that? Is it scarcity? And the Yellow Ruth just seems to go up and up -- has that topped out?