Interesting Ebay Bidding

[dariushou]

So i was on the CU boards today and came about a post with the title "Pwcc Description" and of course i couldn't resist. Someone pointed out a 1954 Aaron RC that ended last night. Of course it took all of 2 minutes to realize it was shilled. The same person who won the exact same card on June 12, 2016 (same psa cert number) was bidding on the auction that ended November 22, 2016. Anyhow, here is what i posted over there. When will this stop!!

"
Anyone see this one end last night, lol.

http://http://www.ebay.com/itm/1954-Topps-Hank-Aaron-ROOKIE-RC-128-PSA-7-NRMT-PWCC-/142177026548?rmvSB=true

Is it me or isn't the above card the same exact card as the one below that ended on June 12, 2016 (same psa cert). Oh, wow, correct me if i'm wrong, but it looks like the guy who won on June 12th was bidding up the auction from last night. What a joke? This happens all of the time with PWCC auctions. I don't know what's real or what's fake anymore. One offs can happen, but please...it happens all of the time. And this is just the most obvious type of shills. Sure, someone is going to come on here and say the guy had sellers remorse and wanted to buy his card back.. yeah right! "

http://www.ebay.com/itm/-/401130680730?rmvSB=true

[Snapolit1]

As someone schooled me recently, if you don't shill your auctions on PWCC you will probably do quite poorly.

[Peter_Spaeth]

More notable is how much the price has dropped in a few months.

[dariushou]

Still at inflated prices if you ask me. I love the 54 aaron, but there are ~350 copies in psa 7 - 7.5. It's a lot easier to shill PSA 7's and 8's and hide it because there are a number of examples out there. Of course 9s and 10s benefit from shilling too and from the effect of shilling the lower graded cards.

If someone really lost this kind of money and with the examples of shills out there, i couldn't imagine there not being some major investigations or lawsuits. I mean some guys "lost" over $40K on like a $80k item. People just don't lose that kind of money and chalk that up as part of doing business. The problem is that these are not just one off cases--it's rampant. It's just so obvious.

[HawkFan70]

I've been on this site for a little while but this is my first post. I realize that there is a lot of shilling that happens in the PWCC auctions but we recently had a great experience consigning a few cards for the first time through PWCC.

One of the cards was a PSA 7 1954 Aaron which realized what we were hoping for with no shilling. Just wanted to give examples of a couple of transactions that had real sellers and buyers on the other end.

Happy Thanksgiving everyone! Chris Helmers

[Leon]

Brent and team are doing a great job.
As you are new you might not have noticed the bold print at the top of every page (just look above here) so here it is again, for the future....(and for all new members who might not know)
If you give an opinion of a person or company your full name needs to be in your post.

Even if the opinion is a positive note a members full name needs to be next to it per the rules.
thanks

Originally Posted by HawkFan70

I've been on this site for a little while but this is my first post. I realize that there is a lot of shilling that happens in the PWCC auctions but we recently had a great experience consigning a few cards for the first time through PWCC.

One of the cards was a PSA 7 1954 Aaron which realized what we were hoping for with no shilling. We also consigned a 1952 Topps Mays and it went for more than we expected. Just wanted to give examples of a couple of transactions that had real sellers and buyers on the other end.

Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

[HawkFan70]

Sorry Leon.....I added my name.

Happy Thanksgiving!

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by dariushou

Still at inflated prices if you ask me. I love the 54 aaron, but there are ~350 copies in psa 7 - 7.5. It's a lot easier to shill PSA 7's and 8's and hide it because there are a number of examples out there. Of course 9s and 10s benefit from shilling too and from the effect of shilling the lower graded cards.

If someone really lost this kind of money and with the examples of shills out there, i couldn't imagine there not being some major investigations or lawsuits. I mean some guys "lost" over $40K on like a $80k item. People just don't lose that kind of money and chalk that up as part of doing business. The problem is that these are not just one off cases--it's rampant. It's just so obvious.

There are many BIN's as well that are fake on ebay as well.

[KendallCat]

It is a shame that over a 3-4 month period the collector in question and a***t were allowed to bid up items like Koufax, Clemente, Rose, and a few other rookies in PSA 7 and 8 to the point that people will lose some big $$ on them down the road. I don't see how people could not catch on when a person has 65 bid retractions in a 6 month period with the same seller, and came in second on almost every Clemente and Koufax rookie along with Rose from April/May until early August.

If anyone goes on VCP and looks up those auctions it is plain as day what they were doing, and the bid until they were the high bidder and then retract happened dozens of times - they won 3-4 of these cards while bidding up dozens of each. There is no place for people like that in the hobby, and when I saw them bidding on cards I stayed out of it. Rose rookie went from $6k to $15-18k and now at $5k. Clemente PSA 7 went to $25k/$27k/$31k and now is at $7-8k??

Might see these prices again in 4-5 years after the highs and lows wear off. Very sad for the people who lost $$ on paper.

Keith Conrad

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by KendallCat

It is a shame that over a 3-4 month period the collector in question and a***t were allowed to bid up items like Koufax, Clemente, Rose, and a few other rookies in PSA 7 and 8 to the point that people will lose some big $$ on them down the road. I don't see how people could not catch on when a person has 65 bid retractions in a 6 month period with the same seller, and came in second on almost every Clemente and Koufax rookie along with Rose from April/May until early August.

If anyone goes on VCP and looks up those auctions it is plain as day what they were doing, and the bid until they were the high bidder and then retract happened dozens of times - they won 3-4 of these cards while bidding up dozens of each. There is no place for people like that in the hobby, and when I saw them bidding on cards I stayed out of it. Rose rookie went from $6k to $15-18k and now at $5k. Clemente PSA 7 went to $25k/$27k/$31k and now is at $7-8k??

Might see these prices again in 4-5 years after the highs and lows wear off. Very sad for the people who lost $$ on paper.

Keith Conrad

I not see a recent sale on a clemente (but 8600 to 9500 in october on ebay) but i really think the ebay shilling isnt that big a deal compared to auction house where you dont see any bidder ids at all. If you see a ebay auction and its between just 2 guys, you can price the card when up to point for example when you see 4 or so (can factor in more if you want )unique bidder ids. Its unlikely there would be 4 unique bidders. In another auction houses you have no id if you are just going against 1 unique bidder or 8. etc.