Looking for a 2nd example of the T206 Cobb (bat off shoulder) / Black LENOX card

[RCMcKenzie]

To me, the card looks consistently worn. Beckett is as good as PSA and SGC and I think they would see a 2-part card. Plus, I think Art would know if it were 2 cards glued together. I think he won $200.. Nice card...Rob

[Pat R]

I agree with you Rob. I don't know how anyone could tell that a card is
re-backed from a low resolution scan.

[tedzan]

Hey guys,

Regarding the "Re-Fronted" T206 cards....the more than a dozen of them that were in circulation several years ago....were all graded (either by PSA or SGC).

So, you cannot depend on the Grading Company's to screen out these T206 fakes. The guy(s) who created these fakes were very professional paper restorers
and their workmanship was very high quality.

Fortunately, for us T206 dudes....this guy(s) were not knowledgeable of the legitimate T206 front/back combinations; therefore, we detected they were fakes.


Anyhow, I'm confident that the Cobb / LENOX card that Art posted here is legitimate; and, the REWARD has been mailed to Art.


TED Z
.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by tedzan

Fortunately, for us T206 dudes....this guy(s) were not knowledgeable of the legitimate T206 front/back combinations; therefore, we detected they were fakes.





TED Z
.

Does this include the Mathewson/ Red Hindu card that turned out to be a re-backed fake?

[tedzan]

The Matty (portrait) / red HINDU was one of the first fakes (circa....2000) that alerted us to the numerous re-fronted T206's. If I recall correctly, SGC graded this fake.

Then dozens of these fakes followed and most were good enough that PSA and SGC graded them.

One of the last re-fronted fakes to be detected was back in 2012. A Green Cobb with a CYCLE 350. PSA graded this Cobb. Subsequently, it sold at an auction for $3000 !

Link to thread......
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...cycle+350+back


TED Z
.

[ullmandds]

so whomever made/commissioned these rebacked fakes seem to have been quite savvy to the "feasibility" of different front/back t206 combos, huh?

[Peter_Spaeth]

So despite the existence of all these documented fakes, from the same time period this otherwise non-existent combo is real?

[MW1]

Originally Posted by tedzan

Hey guys,

Regarding the "Re-Fronted" T206 cards....the more than a dozen of them that were in circulation several years ago....were all graded (either by PSA or SGC).

So, you cannot depend on the Grading Company's to screen out these T206 fakes. The guy(s) who created these fakes were very professional paper restorers
and their workmanship was very high quality.

Fortunately, for us T206 dudes....this guy(s) were not knowledgeable of the legitimate T206 front/back combinations; therefore, we detected they were fakes.


Anyhow, I'm confident that the Cobb / LENOX card that Art posted here is legitimate; and, the REWARD has been mailed to Art.


TED Z
.

Ted,

I have great respect for you but I think you need to get your money back. I was the one who helped identify the bogus T206 Red Hindu Mathewson (and removed it from the market) and this card (the Cobb in question) bears many of the same signs of being re-backed. In fact, I would say the job that was done was quite sloppy. Look closely and you'll see evidence on both the right and left edges on front that the reverse side is larger and overlaps the obverse in several areas. Also, the artificial wear that was added is ridiculous. No legitimate T206s, even those with advanced wear, have edges like that.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by MW1

Look closely and you'll see evidence on both the right and left edges on front that the reverse side is larger and overlaps the obverse in several areas.

I can definitely see what you mean on the lower right corner.

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by MW1

Ted,

I have great respect for you but I think you need to get your money back. I was the one who helped identify the bogus T206 Red Hindu Mathewson (and removed it from the market) and this card (the Cobb in question) bears many of the same signs of being re-backed. In fact, I would say the job that was done was quite sloppy. Look closely and you'll see evidence on both the right and left edges on front that the reverse side is larger and overlaps the obverse in several areas. Also, the artificial wear that was added is ridiculous. No legitimate T206s, even those with advanced wear, have edges like that.

I'll tell you where I'm coming from on this subject....I have never seen a black LENOX back on this Cobb ; and, I have been collecting T206's since Bill Heitman published
his famous book "The Monster". Furthermore, more than a dozen long-time serious T206 collectors tell me the same.

Yet, certain websites claim this Cobb front/back combo has been "confirmed".

If this Cobb that Art M. has posted is as you (and some others) suspect a "fake", then my original contention questioning the existence of this Cobb is justified.

In any event, I have a better understanding now as to why this Cobb with a black LENOX back is claimed to exist.


Incidentally,
I really appreciated Art showing us this Cobb. He and I have been trading T206's since back in 2006, and this time he just got a generous advantage on our latest trade.


Take care, and my regards to Brian


TED Z
.

[Peter_Spaeth]

One wonders if PSA and/or SGC deemed it altered before it ended up in a Beckett holder.

[Pat R]

I still don't see how anyone can say the Cobb is re-backed based on the scans.
The card is in rough shape and shows wear that is consistent with many
cards in that condition. Here's a card in better condition that shows similar
wear on the corner and edges.

[MW1]

Originally Posted by tedzan

I'll tell you where I'm coming from on this subject....I have never seen a black LENOX back on this Cobb ; and, I have been collecting T206's since Bill Heitman published
his famous book "The Monster". Furthermore, more than a dozen long-time serious T206 collectors tell me the same.

Yet, certain websites claim this Cobb front/back combo has been "confirmed".

If this Cobb that Art M. has posted is as you (and some others) suspect a "fake", then my original contention questioning the existence of this Cobb is justified.

In any event, I have a better understanding now as to why this Cobb with a black LENOX back is claimed to exist.


Incidentally,
I really appreciated Art showing us this Cobb. He and I have been trading T206's since back in 2006, and this time he just got a generous advantage on our latest trade.


Take care, and my regards to Brian


TED Z
.

Ted,

I think we're on the same page here. If there's a legitimate black Lenox Cobb out there, I'd like to see it. My feeling is that this card is the one that has been catalogued by a number of websites.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by RCMcKenzie

To me, the card looks consistently worn. Beckett is as good as PSA and SGC and I think they would see a 2-part card. Plus, I think Art would know if it were 2 cards glued together. I think he won $200.. Nice card...Rob

I think BVG is as good as PSA or SGC too. However, they all make mistakes. I have seen a Red Cobb Drum in a BVG holder that was rebacked but graded. I don't think anyone said they know for sure that this card is rebacked. But to me, and at least one other fairly experienced person, it has the look.