Pete Rose Poll

[Topps206]

Originally Posted by Jantz

Pete performed his job as a player well and 50% of me says yes.

The other 50% says no because given the type of human being he is, after getting into the Hall, his smugness will be sickening.

The second part of your statement could also apply to Curt Schilling. I don't think highly of Schilling as a person, but he should've been in by now and yes I support Pete.

[Iron Horse]

A BIG Yes. His performance on the field has HOF written all over. I think baseball needs to get over itself. The world we live in today has so many other issues that what Pete did is dwarfed and honestly is a joke that he is not in the HOF.
I feel both Pete and Shoeless Joe should be inducted into the HOF. Shoeless is no longer with us and Pete has been banned for 26 years. Lets not wait till he is 6 feet under then admit him.

There are many players in the HOF who did not have such stellar credentials off the field.
It is time for the commissioner to get with the times and put him on the Ballot.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Iron Horse

There are many players in the HOF who did not have such stellar credentials off the field.

Yes, but the acts that are keeping Rose out of the Hall were not "off the field", they were committed while he was a manager, while he could impact games and while he was under the rules and jurisdiction of MLB.

That being said, I don't feel strongly either way. I respect his ability and accomplishments, but not his character.

[kmac32]

Originally Posted by Iron Horse

A BIG Yes. His performance on the field has HOF written all over. I think baseball needs to get over itself. The world we live in today has so many other issues that what Pete did is dwarfed and honestly is a joke that he is not in the HOF.
I feel both Pete and Shoeless Joe should be inducted into the HOF. Shoeless is no longer with us and Pete has been banned for 26 years. Lets not wait till he is 6 feet under then admit him.

There are many players in the HOF who did not have such stellar credentials off the field.
It is time for the commissioner to get with the times and put him on the Ballot.

Absolutely agree. His performance as a player is definitely HOF. As I said before, his performance as a manager and the betting while a manager prevents him from being inducted as a manager.

As to the mass murder comments listed earlier, Rose did not murder anyone so those comments are not relavent. The Hall has no bilaws that specifically mention morality so this should not be a criteria for being inducted. Fergie Jenkins ( a wonderful human being in my opinion) was arrested for cocaine posession in an airport during his playing days and that did not stop him from being enshrined in the Hall so who are we to pass judgement? We are all human and we all make mistakes. It is time for Rose to be forgiven for his mistakes and baseball to get back to basics.

The Hall was meant to honor players for their talent and great careers, not to judge their morality.

[Joshchisox08]

I can't believe how close this poll is.

For those who are voting that he get in are there any ........ circumstances ???? Such as letting the 8 men out back into baseball????

[Moonlight Graham]

Wasn't there a story on ESPN this year that he bet on baseball while he was a player?

[bravesfan22]

Originally Posted by Moonlight Graham

Wasn't there a story on ESPN this year that he bet on baseball while he was a player?

Yes, outside the lines revealed there were documents and notebooks taken from his home during a search that showed he was betting as a player in 1986.

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/...ll-player-1986

[rats60]

Originally Posted by bravesfan22

Yes, outside the lines revealed there were documents and notebooks taken from his home during a search that showed he was betting as a player in 1986.

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/...ll-player-1986

It's pretty clear that Rose bet on baseball for at least his last 3 years as a player. Irregardless, Pete knew that what he was doing against the rules, permanent banishment and no hof, see Joe Jackson. Pete still chose to bet. He should just accept the punishment, but Pete thinks he is bigger than the game. He should never be allowed in the hof.

Even putting him on the ballot sends a poor example. If you are good enough, we will just ignore the rules for you. Athletes and gambling should never mix, it is what differentiates mlb from wwe.

For those saying he didn't bet against the Reds, wrong. Everytime he didn’t bet on the Reds, he was betting against them. Don't be naive. The gamblers saw this and used this info, that Pete would not be managing to win like when he had money on the game. Pete's actions harmed the game and the need for fair play. He is getting what he deserves.

[Exhibitman]

I am a huge Pete Rose fan and while I do not want to see him reinstated I would let him on a HOF ballot.

Reinstatement is an MLB employment issue, not a HOF issue. The actual rule created in the wake of the Black Sox scandal, Rule 21, is so important to the game that it is written on every clubhouse wall. Pete Rose knew the rule and blatantly violated it as a player and as a manager. We can get all nitpicky as to whether he bet against his teams or only with his teams but there isn't much point to that because Rule 21 carries a mandatory sentence of baseball death: a lifetime ban from association or employment in the game.

Rose agreed to the sentence. He did not fight the case through to the end, he agreed. He accepted a plea bargain that he now regrets. As a lawyer, that doesn't cut it with me. I've actually been sued by an ex-client who accepted a settlement and decided later he didn't like it, so I am especially unforgiving of people who make their own beds then discover they don't really like laying in them.

The issue in the MLB decision is whether he is a fit potential employee, not whether he can participate in tribUtes. Rose admitted to Manfred during their meeting that he currently bets on baseball. So, despite submitting testimonials from experts to the effect that he is a compulsive gambler with an addiction, he is still betting on baseball. That would and should scare the hell out of anyone in MLB asked to reinstate Rose. If he is a compulsive gambler he really should not be put in a position to influence the outcome of games. He is the equivalent of an alcoholic trucker who has lost his job due to drunk driving applying for reinstatement and telling his potential boss that he is still a social drinker. Would you let that guy drive for you? For the same reasons, I disagree with the assertion that MLB is asking him to grovel or otherwise abase himself. All he is being asked to do is to provide credible evidence that he has his addiction under control, which he did not do.

Frankly, I find the attitude here to be too forgiving of our idols' clay feet at times: for example, I would never advocate for Joe Jackson to be in the HOF because he took money and agreed to throw the World Series. Screw him. A better analogy to Rose vis a vis MLB is Bill Mastro. Like Rose, he was arguably the best in his field and like Rose, he broke the rules and the law, and has accepted a sentence and ban [albeit self-imposed] which shocked and disappointed many of his fans. I don't care if Bill Mastro swears on a stack of bibles that he has reformed, I sure as hell would not ever bid in an auction he is running. I would feel the same as to Rose being involved with a team on the field. But the HOF is not an influence on the current game. He was one of the greatest players I ever saw so I'd let him at least get a vote before he dies. If the voters agree he should be out so be it.

[BearBailey]

Should be in the HOF without question.

[Joshchisox08]

"Frankly, I find the attitude here to be too forgiving of our idols' clay feet at times:...."

+ how ever many votes voted for him to be in.

[GregMitch34]

I am surprised and disappointed by the poll results and pro-Rose arguments--on this site, where I'd expect different. Take this simple test: Let's say you are a big Cubs fan. Let's say Joe Madden next spring announced that he was going to bet on baseball games all year but, hey, NOT on the Cubs to lose, never, take my word for it, and I'd never fudge it. Wouldn't you then question, or at least wonder about, every odd move (and he would, like all managers, make a few) in any game? Holding back an ace reliever or putting him in a game that didn't seem that important? Pinch-hitting choices? Resting players at odd times? And on and on. Wouldn't that sort of ruin your rooting enjoyment all season? And think Madden was wrecking enjoyment of baseball?

Plus there's no proof that Rose DIDN'T bet on his team to lose.

[Mountaineer1999]

Originally Posted by GregMitch34

I am surprised and disappointed by the poll results and pro-Rose arguments--on this site, where I'd expect different. Take this simple test: Let's say you are a big Cubs fan. Let's say Joe Madden next spring announced that he was going to bet on baseball games all year but, hey, NOT on the Cubs to lose, never, take my word for it, and I'd never fudge it. Wouldn't you then question, or at least wonder about, every odd move (and he would, like all managers, make a few) in any game? Holding back an ace reliever or putting him in a game that didn't seem that important? Pinch-hitting choices? Resting players at odd times? And on and on. Wouldn't that sort of ruin your rooting enjoyment all season? And think Madden was wrecking enjoyment of baseball?

Plus there's no proof that Rose DIDN'T bet on his team to lose.

I think we all acknowledge the crime. I think most in the YES camp feel the 26 year ban should serve as the punishment. If they trust their HOF voters to do the right thing then he will lose the HOF vote anyway. Joe Jackson was on the ballot so lets give Pete the same opportunity.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by GregMitch34

I am surprised and disappointed by the poll results and pro-Rose arguments--on this site, where I'd expect different. Take this simple test: Let's say you are a big Cubs fan. Let's say Joe Madden next spring announced that he was going to bet on baseball games all year but, hey, NOT on the Cubs to lose, never, take my word for it, and I'd never fudge it. Wouldn't you then question, or at least wonder about, every odd move (and he would, like all managers, make a few) in any game? Holding back an ace reliever or putting him in a game that didn't seem that important? Pinch-hitting choices? Resting players at odd times? And on and on. Wouldn't that sort of ruin your rooting enjoyment all season? And think Madden was wrecking enjoyment of baseball?

Plus there's no proof that Rose DIDN'T bet on his team to lose.

Good argument but for me, I voted no because he has never come clean. If he did that then I would consider it. (not a shoe in by any means, his playing days aside) In other words, no doubt he would be in on his playing days alone but, even if he comes clean, it's still not a shoe in....but I would consider it. As it is, from what I know now, no way.

[Jim65]

No way. Rules say lifetime ban, he hasn't served his complete sentence yet

[Joshchisox08]

Pete you forgot to mention that they are in the news every week for a shooting, battery, assault, domestic violence, murder, etc.

So in addition to getting away with PED's and other drugs they get away with all of that as well.

I to this day can't comprehend why anyone would support a league or organization full of criminals that go widely unpunished.

[Huysmans]

Originally Posted by Joshchisox08

Pete you forgot to mention that they are in the news every week for a shooting, battery, assault, domestic violence, murder, etc.

So in addition to getting away with PED's and other drugs they get away with all of that as well.

I to this day can't comprehend why anyone would support a league or organization full of criminals that go widely unpunished.

+1

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Joshchisox08

Pete you forgot to mention that they are in the news every week for a shooting, battery, assault, domestic violence, murder, etc.

So in addition to getting away with PED's and other drugs they get away with all of that as well.

I to this day can't comprehend why anyone would support a league or organization full of criminals that go widely unpunished.

Just my opinion and it's worth less than two cents, but given the essentially violent nature of football, which deny it or not is a large part of its appeal, I don't think we really expect these guys to be normal the way we expect the same of baseball players -- who we relate to on a more personal level, because for the most part they are the same size as us, they don't wear helmets obscuring their faces, etc. I mean can you really relate to a 325 pound lineman under a helmet the way you relate to a baseball player?

[bbcard1]

I grew up a huge fan of Pete Rose. I don't really care all that much, but Rose personally is better off not in the hall. If keeps him in the public eye and conversation and opens personal income opportunities for him that are not available to comparable players.

[GregMitch34]

Note to folks who compare use of greenies to PEDs: Babe Ruth's and Roger Maris' home run records stood for years, for decades, until steroids era when everyone and their mother hit 50 dingers or more. And after steroids crackdown--whoops, we are back to pre-1990s power levels. What a coincidinky.