SGC T206s....It needs to be brought up, it's scary, very scary if you are a collector

[rocarroll]

I don't know why PSA's sell for more, probably a "self fulfilling prophecy" because people think they are worth more and should sell for more so they pay more for no other reason than that. It's certainly not for PSA's beautiful holders in comparison to SGC

I keep hearing about PSA being stricter in their grading. I disagree on that, at least in the low to mid grade cards say grades 2-6. SGC has been crazy picky on some of the cards that I have had graded and when it comes to any type of paper loss I've found them to be much harder on that than PSA. I've submitted to both many times and have had many more comparison cards. Depending on the issue(s) that a card may have that usually determines where I send it (that and whether or SGC has a good monthly special ) If the card has a small amount of paper loss I can be certain that SGC is going to grade that 1.5 or maybe 2. I can usually get a 3 out PSA all other things being equal.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by rocarroll

I don't know why PSA's sell for more, probably a "self fulfilling prophecy" because people think they are worth more and should sell for more so they pay more for no other reason than that. It's certainly not for PSA's beautiful holders in comparison to SGC

I keep hearing about PSA being stricter in their grading. I disagree on that, at least in the low to mid grade cards say grades 2-6. SGC has been crazy picky on some of the cards that I have had graded and when it comes to any type of paper loss I've found them to be much harder on that than PSA. I've submitted to both many times and have had many more comparison cards. Depending on the issue(s) that a card may have that usually determines where I send it (that and whether or SGC has a good monthly special ) If the card has a small amount of paper loss I can be certain that SGC is going to grade that 1.5 or maybe 2. I can usually get a 3 out PSA all other things being equal.

Fair point. I was not really talking about low grade cards with wrinkles or paper loss, but mid to high grade cards where the grade is going to depend on centering and corners.

[rocarroll]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Fair point. I was not really talking about low grade cards with wrinkles or paper loss, but mid to high grade cards where the grade is going to depend on centering and corners.

Understood. From what I've seen from you and the OP you guys tend to be more involved in the higher graded cards than I am so I have no frame of reference on those 6-8 type grades. I usually spend money on rarer backs and HOF as opposed to the ultra high grade so I've never subbed those high grades.

I have had several situations with paper loss with SGC that floored me with their strict grading. I had a BEAUTIFUL Zack Wheat that had some small paper chipping in the lower right corner. The card looked like at least a 7 it was that nice. But b/c of that small paper chip they gave it a 1.5. And that's just one example.

In regards to PSA vs SGC pricing, in my opinion I for the most part trust both companies grading and review of the cards the same in regards to trusting the card is what it is. If I am buying off EBAY I am not more or less worried about the card if its PSA or SGC. I personally wouldn't pay a dollar more for a PSA over an SGC with the same grade or vice versa if the cards looked to be in identical condition.

There are 2 reasons I have more SGC's that PSA and neither have to do with the quality of the grading. 1 is that normally it cost $17 per card with PSA and I can get it for $10 at SGC with their specials. The second reason is that as the OP said, PSA tends to sell for more so I've been able to get the SGC for cheaper.

[bnorth]

The part I don't get is the PSA people always say my cards sell for more. So what they paid more to get the card. A real comparison would be the difference in increase/decrease in value and not the selling price.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by bnorth

The part I don't get is the PSA people always say my cards sell for more. So what they paid more to get the card. A real comparison would be the difference in increase/decrease in value and not the selling price.

paying more for for the same grade for the psa versus the SGC proves they sell for more.

I do agree I don't think grading standards are better for PSA or that their holders are better .....its the analogy of the other thread about would you buy from someone you not like and I said if they are handing you free money or a bargain I think most people would put their feelings behind and buy the card

if a PSA and SGC card were selling for the same price from a private seller and the card looks the same I don't think the SGC lovers will end up buying the SGC card, they will take the PSA card because of sell price...even if they don't like the holder and don't think their grading standards are better.......money talks.

[GregMitch34]

No comparison at all between PSA and SGC values on CJ 14s. Quite stark and one of the most obvious pre-war. I imagine it's the registry.

[bounce]

When you say SGC cards won't "cross", is it safe to assume you mean they don't often crossover to the equivalent PSA grade?

You're not suggesting they won't cross at all, are you?

[glynparson]

I have very little problems getting cards that deserve the grade to cross. If you are picky and dont just assume it's going to cross I have had great success. I'd say around 70-80%. I usually crack those that don't cross and probably get the grade I wanted on about half of those. I have only had one come back altered after cracking I did miss the minor alteration and could see how the graders did as well so it didn't upset me they are human after all. I do agree that over a certain dollar amount they are very reluctant to cross cards. I am talking about under 5 figure cards.

[rocarroll]

Originally Posted by rocarroll

I don't know why PSA's sell for more, probably a "self fulfilling prophecy" because people think they are worth more and should sell for more so they pay more for no other reason than that. It's certainly not for PSA's beautiful holders in comparison to SGC

I keep hearing about PSA being stricter in their grading. I disagree on that, at least in the low to mid grade cards say grades 2-6. SGC has been crazy picky on some of the cards that I have had graded and when it comes to any type of paper loss I've found them to be much harder on that than PSA. I've submitted to both many times and have had many more comparison cards. Depending on the issue(s) that a card may have that usually determines where I send it (that and whether or SGC has a good monthly special ) If the card has a small amount of paper loss I can be certain that SGC is going to grade that 1.5 or maybe 2. I can usually get a 3 out PSA all other things being equal.

Piggy backing on what I said earlier about it being a "self fulfilling prophecy" I really do think it is a heard mentality. People think PSA is better cause that's what other people are telling them. Its almost like certain auctions that take place and their stuff sells for more just because they are selling it. Have you ever noticed when PWCC has an auction on EBAY their cards sell for about 30%or more than they would if I were selling them. I looked at that previous auction that closed recently and compared it to almost identically graded cards selling at the same time by individual buyers and they were going for way more. Tolstoi PSA 3's by an individual selling for in the $80s PWCC going for $110-120. In short its a reputation that has no real gold backing the currency so to speak. People just think its better.

If an industry wide rumor started next week that SGC was better within a month you would see the pricing reverse.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by rocarroll

Piggy backing on what I said earlier about it being a "self fulfilling prophecy" I really do think it is a heard mentality. People think PSA is better cause that's what other people are telling them. Its almost like certain auctions that take place and their stuff sells for more just because they are selling it. Have you ever noticed when PWCC has an auction on EBAY their cards sell for about 30%or more than they would if I were selling them. I looked at that previous auction that closed recently and compared it to almost identically graded cards selling at the same time by individual buyers and they were going for way more. Tolstoi PSA 3's by an individual selling for in the $80s PWCC going for $110-120. In short its a reputation that has no real gold backing the currency so to speak. People just think its better.

If an industry wide rumor started next week that SGC was better within a month you would see the pricing reverse.

when talking about things with no real useful purpose....value is what people will pay for things...so whatever mentality it is why people by things..its the fact they are buying them.....value is what someone will pay for it..so what people think no matter what the reason is what the market is..

[rocarroll]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

when talking about things with no real useful purpose....value is what people will pay for things...so whatever mentality it is why people by things..its the fact they are buying them.....value is what someone will pay for it..so what people think no matter what the reason is what the market is..

Agree with you 100% I think there are two questions, one of which seems to have been answered "yes" by the sell history. Does a PSA sell for higher on average than SGC - yes. The other being is PSA actually better than SGC and actually adds value because of something tangible, i.e. finds flaws that the other doesn't find thus its grades are more legit or is it just because that it is generally accepted to be the case. As you said, either way, the market is the market regardless of the reason. But as anything that doesn't have real value, that is subject to change depending on how the wind blows popular opinion. Spend a lot of money today on PSA because that's the "rumor" and you could lose a lot tomorrow because the "rumor" changes.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by rocarroll

Agree with you 100% I think there are two questions, one of which seems to have been answered "yes" by the sell history. Does a PSA sell for higher on average than SGC - yes. The other being is PSA actually better than SGC and actually adds value because of something tangible, i.e. finds flaws that the other doesn't find thus its grades are more legit or is it just because that it is generally accepted to be the case. As you said, either way, the market is the market regardless of the reason. But as anything that doesn't have real value, that is subject to change depending on how the wind blows popular opinion. Spend a lot of money today on PSA because that's the "rumor" and you could lose a lot tomorrow because the "rumor" changes.

PSA is so strong that you would be talking a major major rumer...some rumors that could further kill the other TPG would do nothing to PSA......anything can happen of course but going to take more than just a normal 'rumor' to change the current perception of the ebay buyers out there..

[ajjohnsonsoxfan]

If SGC was smart they'd rebrand their registry by allowing other TPG holders so that collectors with mixed sets could register all their cards in one spot.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by ajjohnsonsoxfan

If SGC was smart they'd rebrand their registry by allowing other TPG holders so that collectors with mixed sets could register all their cards in one spot.

I always wondered that...I also wondered why hasn't PSA made a mid grade classification for older cards...best psa 4-5 set etc....so all of sudden people would be fighting for and bidding on psa 5 goudeys for example....in boxing you have different weight classes...my analogy would be you could be the best in your class..even its psa 5

in addition...to protect from fraud I wonder why they don't allow registered owners to be contacted by prospective buyers of a card (in a way to protect privacy ) to see if the card they are bidding on is real...example..you see a cert verified 1952 mantle psa 4...and would like to bid on it..wouldn't it be nice to have an email sent to the person that owns that card who can advise if his card is really on ebay..?

[Joshchisox08]

Originally Posted by rocarroll

Piggy backing on what I said earlier about it being a "self fulfilling prophecy" I really do think it is a heard mentality. People think PSA is better cause that's what other people are telling them. Its almost like certain auctions that take place and their stuff sells for more just because they are selling it. Have you ever noticed when PWCC has an auction on EBAY their cards sell for about 30%or more than they would if I were selling them. I looked at that previous auction that closed recently and compared it to almost identically graded cards selling at the same time by individual buyers and they were going for way more. Tolstoi PSA 3's by an individual selling for in the $80s PWCC going for $110-120. In short its a reputation that has no real gold backing the currency so to speak. People just think its better.

If an industry wide rumor started next week that SGC was better within a month you would see the pricing reverse.

Ryan you really hit the nail on the head with this !!!

[chipperhank44]

Originally Posted by rocarroll

Piggy backing on what I said earlier about it being a "self fulfilling prophecy" I really do think it is a heard mentality. People think PSA is better cause that's what other people are telling them.........In short its a reputation that has no real gold backing the currency so to speak. People just think its better.

If an industry wide rumor started next week that SGC was better within a month you would see the pricing reverse.

The above truth can be directly applied to the comment below

Originally Posted by callou2131

I would love to send a T206 to BGS just to see the confusion on the graders face