Split-personality of the 350/460 series..re: AB460, BL460, SC460, HINDU & UZIT T206's

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by parkerj33

Ted, is that a typo in your first post? you first say 66 subjects but then go on to list two groups adding up to 63 subjects.....

Hi Jim

Your question is a good one, and I will clarify.

Shown here is my concept of a simulated sheet of the 66 different subjects in SOVEREIGN 350 apple green printing. Actually, 63 of these 66 subjects that American Litho.
had planned to continue printing with the various 460 Series backs were printed.

Due to the fact that the Major League careers of Joe Doyle, Simon Nicholls, and Bob Rhoades (seen on this sheet) had ended prior to the time of the 460 series press runs.
Therefore, these 3 guys were discontinued.


Note....If your computer screen displays only 6 cards per row on this 72-card simulated sheet, decrease the image (Control - ) until there are 12 cards across the display.







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TED Z
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[sreader3]

Hi Ted,

Initial reaction: Your 35 Group 1 subjects correspond with the AB 460 "no prints" identified on T206 Resource, except that your Group 1 includes Ames. So I am going to tentatively agree with you that your Group 1 subjects were printed together--probably on the same sheet--with the caveat that Ames was likely swapped-in for Dougherty on that sheet midstream as Chris Browne as suggested elsewhere. Thus, I am going to accept 34 subject sheets as most likely, with the understanding that we may part company on that. More reaction later.

Scot

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by sreader3

Hi Ted,

Initial reaction: Your 35 Group 1 subjects correspond with the AB 460 "no prints" identified on T206 Resource, except that your Group 1 includes Ames. So I am going to tentatively agree with you that your Group 1 subjects were printed together--probably on the same sheet--with the caveat that Ames was likely swapped-in for Dougherty on that sheet midstream as Chris Browne as suggested elsewhere. Thus, I am going to accept 34 subject sheets as most likely, with the understanding that we may part company on that. More reaction later.

Scot

With all due respect to Chris B's suggestion. I have to differ with his swapping games regarding Ames and Dougherty. There is no justification for ALC switching these guys.
Their careers did not change during the T206 timeline (1909 - early 1911). Ames played with the Giants and Dougherty with the White Sox. And, as we've seen throughout
the make up of the T206 set, where ALC has modified certain subjects in their printing there was valid reasons (trades, retirements, etc.). Replacing Ames with Dougherty
sounds like an unwarranted arbitrary change, which in my opinion did not occur.

Ames has been confirmed with both the SWEET CAP 460/25 and SWEET CAP 460/42 backs. ALC's printing pattern regarding these two backs correlates with the red HINDU
backs. The red ink is exactly the same on all 3 of these backs. And, it would not surprise me if ALC printed all 3 of these backs simultaneously on this group of 35 subjects.

In the past year, Murphy & Dougherty were discovered with red HINDU backs; and, I expect that Ames will eventually surface with a red HINDU back (and/or BL 460 back).

Furthermore, the red HINDU story is not complete yet. There are 3 other subjects that have yet to be confirmed with red HINDU backs......

Mathewson (dark cap)
McIntyre (Brooklyn & Chicago)
Reulbach (no glove)

So, my expectations regarding Ames are not just my "wild imagination" in overdrive.


TED Z
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[tedzan]

I had more of these 460 series double same name cards, but I traded them away. They certainly do lend credence to the fact that these T206's were Double-Printed on their sheet.


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TED Z

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[Pat R]

Ted,

If you're talking about the vertical rows I think most of us would
agree that all the subjects were at least triple printed on most if not
all sheets.The double name, two name, plate scratch ect..... are pretty
good evidence to support this.

Patrick

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by Pat R

Ted,

If you're talking about the vertical rows I think most of us would
agree that all the subjects were at least triple printed on most if not
all sheets.The double name, two name, plate scratch ect..... are pretty
good evidence to support this.

Patrick

Pat

Yes, we are all in agreement with this vertical printing format of T206's. But, have you ever seen any evidence of horizontal multiple printing of T206's ?

The back of my T205 Collins confirms that American Litho. also double-printed cards horizontally (at least T205's). Are there any examples of this with T206's ?






TED Z
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[t206hound]

Originally Posted by tedzan

Pat

Yes, we are all in agreement with this vertical printing format of T206's. But, have you ever seen any evidence of horizontal multiple printing of T206's ?

The back of my T205 Collins confirms that American Litho. also double-printed cards horizontally (at least T205's). Are there any examples of this with T206's ?






TED Z
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First off, that's an awesome card.

To the best of my knowledge, there are no known instances of the same subject adjacent horizontally (and until now I hadn't seen a T205 like that). With regards to double printing on a sheet, absence of a side-by-side subject T206 example doesn't necessarily mean it didn't occur; and note that there would also be the possibility of the same subject horizontally, but just not adjacent.

[Pat R]

Originally Posted by tedzan

Pat

Yes, we are all in agreement with this vertical printing format of T206's. But, have you ever seen any evidence of horizontal multiple printing of T206's ?

The back of my T205 Collins confirms that American Litho. also double-printed cards horizontally (at least T205's). Are there any examples of this with T206's ?






TED Z
.

Ted,

I haven't seen any evidence of horizontals of the same T206 subject
on a sheet but I certainly wouldn't rule out the possibility.

BTW that Collins is a really neat card.


Patrick

[t206hound]

Originally Posted by tedzan

I had more of these 460 series double same name cards, but I traded them away. They certainly do lend credence to the fact that these T206's were Double-Printed on their sheet.

TED Z

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Yes, just like every other series of T206, there were multiples of the same subject stacked vertically. I believe it was very likely that four or more of each subject stacked.

When I see/hear the the term "double-print", I assume that is in reference to twice of many of one subject appearing on the sheet than other subjects. If I've been using that term wrong, please let me know what term I should be using.