JSA, really?! Come on

[djson1]

Aside from all this TPA arguing, I just want to say that I would never pay that much for a horrible shaky Koufax signature (assuming that it IS authentic).
As Shelly pointed out in a previous thread, some recent Steiner certed Koufax sigs are showing signs of serious aging (like Aaron's). Up until just a year or so ago, Koufax' signature was really nice and flowing. There are plenty of them to still go around and probably under $300. Go buy one of those before resorting to one of his recent shaky ones.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by djson1

Go buy one of those before resorting to one of his recent shaky ones.

So you know there are recent shaky ones that look like this?

Unless you are the one, I'm surprised there isn't anyone here who has recently gotten Koufax' autograph. At least if we found that it hadn't changed, this could only be, as Steve suggested, a "crowd signature", or bogus.

I agree with others that TPA's should certainly authenticate it if it is legit. The decision to purchase or not is personal.

[djson1]

Originally Posted by Runscott

So you know there are recent shaky ones that look like this?

I didn't know it got this shaky until recently when I saw some Steiner certed Koufax balls that were pretty shaky. I'm not sure how Steiner has his signings set up, but I would assume the player is seated at a table with a Steiner rep watching....and yet some recent examples were pretty bad.

[shelly]

Originally Posted by djson1

I didn't know it got this shaky until recently when I saw some Steiner certed Koufax balls that were pretty shaky. I'm not sure how Steiner has his signings set up, but I would assume the player is seated at a table with a Steiner rep watching....and yet some recent examples were pretty bad.

The only ball we have seen so far from spring training looks good. Do you have any examples of what you are talking about from the signings. It would be a big help.
I have looked at ever steiner ball on ebay and not one look like the one we where shown at the start of this thread.

[djson1]

Originally Posted by shelly

The only ball we have seen so far from spring training looks good. Do you have any examples of what you are talking about from the signings. It would be a big help.
I have looked at ever steiner ball on ebay and not one look like the one we where shown at the start of this thread.

Shelly, I was actually referring to a picture that you posted in an earlier thread here:
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...86#post1324086

This is the Steiner example I was thinking of when I thought of Koufax' signature not looking like his signature of old. Ok, so after looking at it again, maybe it’s not necessarily "shaky"...but definitely off from his usual examples.

Plus, there are some recent auction lots I've seen where there are some shaky ones....I think they were just PSA certed though. I can't remember which auction, but I think there's one now or one that just ended recently that had a lot of 5 or so Koufax balls and they were all pretty sloppy...but still with some good bid prices on them.

[shelly]

Originally Posted by djson1

Shelly, I was actually referring to a picture that you posted in an earlier thread here:
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...86#post1324086

This is the Steiner example I was thinking of when I thought of Koufax' signature not looking like his signature of old. Ok, so after looking at it again, maybe it’s not necessarily "shaky"...but definitely off from his usual examples.

Plus, there are some recent auction lots I've seen where there are some shaky ones....I think they were just PSA certed though. I can't remember which auction, but I think there's one now or one that just ended recently that had a lot of 5 or so Koufax balls and they were all pretty sloppy...but still with some good bid prices on them.

Off for sure but not like the one posted in this thread.

[Runscott]

This discussion has been productive, even though I'm sensing wincing by some who think criticism is 'TPA-bashing'. There tends to be a confusion between constructive criticism and bashing - thin skin on both sides, understandably.

Personally, I think if it's an authentic signature, it should be certified. The problem is that JSA keeps his exemplars to himself, and he has approved too many clubhouse signatures for me to have any faith in his hidden exemplars.

PSA, on the other hand, at least shows us exemplars. It's very helpful (to me, anyway), because I can at least tell what styles of each player's autograph they are willing to consider. I don't see any horrid Koufax signatures on PSA's site, but I do see the ugly 'old Wagner' examples. Makes me think that PSA isn't comfortable with the ugly Koufax signatures. I have more confidence in PSA than JSA, so that fact gives me no confidence in Spence's opinion on this one.