ebay seller - probstein123

[jhs5120]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Huh? What are you talking about? You entire post makes no sense, especially the part I quoted. What tools does Rick provide to us (or anybody) that we need to protect ourselves?

Reread the posts above.

If you were to purchase an item from a Probstein123 auction you would have the following tools at your disposal:

- You would be able to see what collection the consignment came from, allowing you to avoid certain consignors (i.e. The GEM Collection).
- You can see how many unique bidders you are bidding against (a handy tool used to spot shill bidding).
- You can see how many bid retractions other bidders have (a handy tool to decide if you're up against shady characters)
- You can see how often someone is bidding and their bidding patterns (vital to spot shill bidding)

Name one auction house that provides these tools.

[earlywynnfan]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

Reread the posts above.

If you were to purchase an item from a Probstein123 auction you would have the following tools at your disposal:

- You would be able to see what collection the consignment came from, allowing you to avoid certain consignors (i.e. The GEM Collection).
- You can see how many unique bidders you are bidding against (a handy tool used to spot shill bidding).
- You can see how many bid retractions other bidders have (a handy tool to decide if you're up against shady characters)
- You can see how often someone is bidding and their bidding patterns (vital to spot shill bidding)

Name one auction house that provides these tools.

Are you saying the onus is on the buyer to root out shill bidding??
And if it is happening, the best way to handle it is to not bid?

[jhs5120]

Originally Posted by earlywynnfan

Are you saying the onus is on the buyer to root out shill bidding??
And if it is happening, the best way to handle it is to not bid?

No, I am saying Rick Probstein provides more tools for the bidder to detect and defend themselves against shill bidding than any other auction house.

Panky aside, Rick has banned shill bidders and he is usually pretty good about it if it's obvious. When was the last time REA or HA or Mile High banned one of their bidders?

[jhs5120]

I am still challenging anyone here to name one auction house that has more safe-guards in place to prevent shilling.

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

I am still challenging anyone here to name one auction house that has more safe-guards in place to prevent shilling.

You can't completely prevent shill bidding...the auctioneer will never know 100% if an item is being shilled or not. What you can do when you are made aware of a shiller is ban them from your auctions. One very obvious shiller seems to be immune from banishment.

[RichardSimon]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

I am still challenging anyone here to name one auction house that has more safe-guards in place to prevent shilling.

jhs - one more time, what do you think Mr Probstein would do if ebay did not provide all the protections you have mentioned, would he go through the time and trouble to list all those things himself if he ran his auctions on an independent platform?

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by RichardSimon

jhs - one more time, what do you think Mr Probstein would do if ebay did not provide all the protections you have mentioned, would he go through the time and trouble to list all those things himself if he ran his auctions on an independent platform?

Of course he wouldn't...the fact that his chosen platform shows bidder activity is a thorn in his side.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

I am still challenging anyone here to name one auction house that has more safe-guards in place to prevent shilling.

This is simply deflection. You're trying to make one person's faults seem OK by finding fault with others, others who were not even the subject of this particular thread. Ever hear of two wrongs don't make a right?

My opinion would be the same for any seller who followed these practices, I don't have an agenda for or against Probstein either way. But reading this thread, there seems to be more than enough proof that Probstein is aware of the issue and is choosing to simply ignore it. For you to say Probstein has no accountability only because eBay happens to provide a way to see that shilling is going on is ludicrous. He could stop it from happening altogether and make this a moot point, yet instead he chooses to allow it to go on. I'm positive many bidders do not go through the trouble of looking at bid history and the like. By Probstein allowing this Panky guy to continue shilling, my opinion is that he is banking on the fly-by-night buyers who are going to get shilled and never know it happened to them. That is completely shady. If you have a problem and it's made blatantly clear to you, you fix it, or you suffer the ramifications to your reputation. Sounds like he's made his choice.

Der.ek Oue.llette

[earlywynnfan]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

No, I am saying Rick Probstein provides more tools for the bidder to detect and defend themselves against shill bidding than any other auction house.

Panky aside, Rick has banned shill bidders and he is usually pretty good about it if it's obvious. When was the last time REA or HA or Mile High banned one of their bidders?

Could you please specify which of these tools Mr. Probstein provides? Because these are all eBay's tools, from what I can see.

Also, can you please give any examples of times Mr. Probstein has ended items with apparently blatant shill bidding or any other of the shenanigans that have been pointed out?

How do you know he's banned any shill bidders?

[parker1b2]

Question.. I never dealt with probstein but just realized an item I have been watching is a BIN from him. I know he consigns for others, but is his stuff usually legit? Comes with a COA from Hollywood Collectibles in FL. After reading the posts not sure I want to deal with him, but I like the item.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by parker1b2

Question.. I never dealt with probstein but just realized an item I have been watching is a BIN from him. I know he consigns for others, but is his stuff usually legit? Comes with a COA from Hollywood Collectibles in FL. After reading the posts not sure I want to deal with him, but I like the item.

Hollywood Collectibles is Rich Altman's operation and I've always understood him to be very reputable.

[parker1b2]

Originally Posted by dgo71

Hollywood Collectibles is Rich Altman's operation and I've always understood him to be very reputable.

Thanks Derek.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

Reread the posts above.

If you were to purchase an item from a Probstein123 auction you would have the following tools at your disposal:

- You would be able to see what collection the consignment came from, allowing you to avoid certain consignors (i.e. The GEM Collection).
- You can see how many unique bidders you are bidding against (a handy tool used to spot shill bidding).
- You can see how many bid retractions other bidders have (a handy tool to decide if you're up against shady characters)
- You can see how often someone is bidding and their bidding patterns (vital to spot shill bidding)

Name one auction house that provides these tools.

Wow, I don't even know where to begin. Let me start by giving you a friendly suggestion. Stop typing. You sound ridiculous at this point. You really do.

Originally Posted by jhs5120

Personally I feel that Rick Probstein and PWCC have the greatest anti-shilling defenses of any sports memorabilia auction house in the known universe. You can see who you're bidding against, how many bids this person has placed and how frequently he has retracted his bid!

Rick and PWCC don't have anything. This is provided to anyone that wants to list an item on the eBay site...and I'm surprised eBay still allows people to see the bid history as they have gone out of their way to protect shill bidders by blocking eBay usernames, but that's a whole different conversation. To hear you tell it though it's some kind of exclusive service only offered by Rick and PWCC. Not!

But, ok, I'll bite. I'll play along with it. So now that Rick and PWCC offer these wonderful tools to protect us bidders (Praises to Rick), what happens when it's discovered there is shilling taking place and it can be pinpointed to a certain consignor? Huh, what then? What good is it to have these wonderful tools that Rick has provided to us (Praises to Rick), if nothing is done about the shilling when it's pointed out?

Originally Posted by jhs5120

You would be able to see what collection the consignment came from, allowing you to avoid certain consignors (i.e. The GEM Collection).

As far as I know this just simply isn't true? Show me were you see the name of the consignor or the collection it belongs to. Here is one of Panky's listings, show me where it says it is his (The GEM Collection). Edited to add: You can search for a certain consignor (e.g. The GEM Collection), but if you are just browsing eBay auctions and open up one of Rick's listings at random, there is no way to know which consignor it belongs to (as far as I know).

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2003-Fleer-U...item53fd3386b4

Again, just friendly advice. Stop typing and save some face. Your comments are ridiculous.

[RichardSimon]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

Reread the posts above.

If you were to purchase an item from a Probstein123 auction you would have the following tools at your disposal:

- You would be able to see what collection the consignment came from, allowing you to avoid certain consignors (i.e. The GEM Collection).
- You can see how many unique bidders you are bidding against (a handy tool used to spot shill bidding).
- You can see how many bid retractions other bidders have (a handy tool to decide if you're up against shady characters)
- You can see how often someone is bidding and their bidding patterns (vital to spot shill bidding)

Name one auction house that provides these tools.

Jason - I have no stake in this but it would seem to me that these protections that you refer to are provided by ebay, with the exception being able to see The Gem Collection.
I wonder if Mr Probstein would provide such protections if ebay did not.
I have been reading this thread with curiosity and interest but I don't know Mr Probstein nor have I ever bid in his auctions.
I would be curious to know if you think he would provide such protection and information if he was not using ebay and perhaps used simpleauctionsite.com

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

Reread the posts above.

If you were to purchase an item from a Probstein123 auction you would have the following tools at your disposal:

- You would be able to see what collection the consignment came from, allowing you to avoid certain consignors (i.e. The GEM Collection).
- You can see how many unique bidders you are bidding against (a handy tool used to spot shill bidding).
- You can see how many bid retractions other bidders have (a handy tool to decide if you're up against shady characters)
- You can see how often someone is bidding and their bidding patterns (vital to spot shill bidding)

Name one auction house that provides these tools.

This post is pretty awesome. Rick should probably pay you to post here.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

This post is pretty awesome. Rick should probably pay you to post here.

I'm thinking he already does.