Net54 Exemplar File

[Mr. Zipper]

Originally Posted by JimStinson

I think its a Great idea too , In fact a sensational idea ...in theory, But in practice ? Don't know.

+1

To untrained eyes, decent fakes "look the same" as real exemplars. A gallery of verified exemplars might help someone get their start, but will not be a shortcut to expertise.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Mr. Zipper

+1

To untrained eyes, decent fakes "look the same" as real exemplars. A gallery of verified exemplars might help someone get their start, but will not be a shortcut to expertise.

Interesting thought - I hadn't thought of this as a shortcut to expertise, or even to help someone get their start. I was merely thinking of a way to gather the forum's expertise in such a way that people would have things (either discussion threads or exemplars) to look at before they started new "hey, is this real?" threads.

But it looks like very few (if any) of the forum's experts are interested in such an idea. Let me ask it a different way: we've proposed grouping 'exemplar' discussion threads under player 'area' instead of actually posting exemplars. Is this a workable solution? Or is that also too much like sharing expertise?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Runscott

Interesting thought - I hadn't thought of this as a shortcut to expertise, or even to help someone get their start. I was merely thinking of a way to gather the forum's expertise in such a way that people would have things (either discussion threads or exemplars) to look at before they started new "hey, is this real?" threads.

But it looks like very few (if any) of the forum's experts are interested in such an idea. Let me ask it a different way: we've proposed grouping 'exemplar' discussion threads under player 'area' instead of actually posting exemplars. Is this a workable solution? Or is that also too much like sharing expertise?

Scott- I think there is a lot of interest and even more apathy.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Leon

Scott- I think there is a lot of interest and even more apathy.

Apathy is absolutely fine - I just don't want to ruffle feathers.

Personally, I think 'gathering worthy threads' is the best option.

Not sure how that would work logistically, but choosing the threads doesn't have to be done all at once. I'll start bookmarking the ones that I think are good.

[chaddurbin]

i don't think your suggestion ruffles any feathers with the experts around. you can group hundreds of exemplars around here and it won't affect the business of the stinson & simon firm . as they've said many times comparing examplars is the first and LAST step they do. good forgers are trained to copy good signatures. it doesn't make you an expert or know how to authenticate by comparing known good examplars, autographing is not cut and dry like a reprinted t206 or fake cracker jack.

imo there's a danger when you put up the examplars w/o context or reference and someone looking through say well this T lines up to that authentic T perfectly and the ending stroke is spot on in that Speaker so mine must be real...the good forgers prey on that kind of holiday inn express authentication.

[travrosty]

or as i call it, psa or jsa authentication. holiday inn express authentication is preferable.

[JimStinson]

Originally Posted by chaddurbin

i don't think your suggestion ruffles any feathers with the experts around. you can group hundreds of exemplars around here and it won't affect the business of the stinson & simon firm . as they've said many times comparing examplars is the first and LAST step they do. good forgers are trained to copy good signatures. it doesn't make you an expert or know how to authenticate by comparing known good examplars, autographing is not cut and dry like a reprinted t206 or fake cracker jack.

imo there's a danger when you put up the examplars w/o context or reference and someone looking through say well this T lines up to that authentic T perfectly and the ending stroke is spot on in that Speaker so mine must be real...the good forgers prey on that kind of holiday inn express authentication.

+1 , perfectly stated !!! Context & reference VERY, VERY important and let me briefly add that from "This side" when I tell someone I don't believe an autograph is good, Often the rebuttal is "Well it LOOKS just like the other ones"........IT IS SUPPOSED TO LOOK LIKE THE "OTHER" ONES !!! A forger is not intent on "blazing a new trail" and making his "different" from the other ones..
______________________
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I buy & sell Vintage Baseball autographs
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[ATP]

One of the things I would find most useful (and this is one of the things I love most about everyone here), is the huge depth of knowledge in some very small details, combined. Let me explain it in another way. As many have stated, finding exemplars is not too hard, what is really hard sometimes is finding enough exemplars for something very specific (meaning, some known exemplars of Mantles signature in 1954 vs what it looked like in 1955-1957, as it changed a little bit each year until he settled in). It takes quite a bit more digging for me to find multiple examples of a specific year that I can rely on. And contracts and checks, etc don't always cut it if it's on a ball for example. That is why I love when people post a signature that they have definitely dated to a certain day or even year.

The thing is, I am just not so sure that a forum environment is the best avenue for this, logistically. I personally have thousands upon thousands of signatures saved I have either owned or reviewed, but that is more like having an archive type of site to put them on.

[Runscott]

Thanks for the helpful comment, Travis. Do you have anything to add that would pertain to the actual topic?