You spotted a fake, had your seizure,and I learned nothing.

[thehoodedcoder]

Originally Posted by Stonepony

Ok, thanks all Attachment 110628

this image is hilarious. i have been laughing for the last 10 minutes.

kevin

[Stonepony]

No harm intended. I AM a bit of a wise ass I suppose , but this thread was intended to be helpful ( and somewhat tongue in cheek as I offered up front). I have been collecting ( not continuously ) since mid 70s, and while I have a pretty good knowledge base, I am by far no expert and love learning . This site is fantastic for that. Thanks for all the input, and I'm glad alot of you are thick skinned and recognize some attempt at humor. Thanks, Dave

[CaramelMan]

Ya but it's had to tell (when you are new) if you are being a wise guy, or funny...it's that I felt like I was being reprimanded in your OP...SORRY we weren't as helpful as you would have wanted us to be...remember sometimes you get what you pay for...this is a free site remember Stony.

[Tyler]

Dave,
I am with ya here. So many posts about "look at this ebay fake"!
Why not say..."look at this ebay fake...the registration is way off! or "hat is too close to the border"?
I agree...if you are going to post an auction that is not "on the level", why not take 5 seconds to say why it isn't?

[D.P.Johnson]

I've been on various types of message boards since the late 90's (or whenever it was that Al Gore invented the internet), and I've seen numerous of them "die" when the veteren members stopped helping the "newbies" and/or kept continuously telling them to use the "search" feature. I think that regardless of how many times the "same stupid question" has been asked and answered, the OP (or newbie) should never be "flamed" and/or simply told to use the "search" function. If an veteren member (or ANY member) doesn't feel like answering a question, then don't answer it. It's really as simple as that. However, the elderly members should always try and remember when they were "newbies" and how they would have liked to have been treated when they had questions. We all had to start somewhere...

Just my .02 (but probably worth a lot less).......

[Zach Wheat]

DP,

Completely agree with you. This was probably one of the most frustrating things I encountered when I started using the Forum a number of years ago. Re: fakes, some times it is a lot of little things that are just not consistent with an authentic card including intangibles like seller feedback & descriptions.

There is a lot to learn from people on this board. There is just so much accumulated knowledge, I would hate to be a fraud steer trying to pull one over on people.

Do a quick search on some of the April fools day posts. Early on someone would try to create fraudulent cards with a backstory....just for fun...to see if they could fool people. It always amazed me how fast people could figure things out. Makes for good reading if you can find the links.

Z Wheat

[EvilKing00]

I would also love to hear the reasons / differences bet fakes and the real deal in what ever card is in question. Love learning new things.

[D.P.Johnson]

Originally Posted by Zach Wheat

DP,

Completely agree with you. This was probably one of the most frustrating things I encountered when I started using the Forum a number of years ago. Re: fakes, some times it is a lot of little things that are just not consistent with an authentic card including intangibles like seller feedback & descriptions.

There is a lot to learn from people on this board. There is just so much accumulated knowledge, I would hate to be a fraud steer trying to pull one over on people.

Do a quick search on some of the April fools day posts. Early on someone would try to create fraudulent cards with a backstory....just for fun...to see if they could fool people. It always amazed me how fast people could figure things out. Makes for good reading if you can find the links.

Z Wheat

Thanks. One of the problems with the growth of message boards (and the internet in general) is the VAST storage of knowledge. Nowadays, people don't necessarily have to EVER ask any questions or start new threads if they simply search long and hard enough. That being said, if a message board wants to grow and accumulate new members, they need to encourage all members (and especially the veteren members) to ask questions and/or participate in the threads. If not, people will not feel welcome, they won't participate, and they'll find somewhere else to go. Eventually the board will stagnate and die...

[Leon]

Originally Posted by D.P.Johnson

Thanks. One of the problems with the growth of message boards (and the internet in general) is the VAST storage of knowledge. Nowadays, people don't necessarily have to EVER ask any questions or start new threads if they simply search long and hard enough. That being said, if a message board wants to grow and accumulate new members, they need to encourage all members (and especially the veteren members) to ask questions and/or participate in the threads. If not, people will not feel welcome, they won't participate, and they'll find somewhere else to go. Eventually the board will stagnate and die...

I have confidence we won't stagnate. We average 100+ new, registered members per month and have for several years running. I merely pointed to the alterations section because there is great info there. That being said, I agree with Barry in that no one should fear asking any hobby related question. That's what the board is here for, essentially.

[CaramelMan]

Originally Posted by D.P.Johnson

Thanks. One of the problems with the growth of message boards (and the internet in general) is the VAST storage of knowledge. Nowadays, people don't necessarily have to EVER ask any questions or start new threads if they simply search long and hard enough. That being said, if a message board wants to grow and accumulate new members, they need to encourage all members (and especially the veteren members) to ask questions and/or participate in the threads. If not, people will not feel welcome, they won't participate, and they'll find somewhere else to go. Eventually the board will stagnate and die...

But three is nice polite way, and a wise ass way to ask for something...

There is a difference and for me personally it matters in wanting to help someone or not..

When I first read your post, I thought you were a scammer trying to figure out how to do a better job next time...that's how you came across newbie.

[barrysloate]

For people who have been in the hobby for a long time, fakes are often easy to detect, and will usually have something obviously wrong with them. For a beginner, it is of course more difficult.

Most of the discussions on this board concerning fakes, as well as virtually every aspect of card collecting, are about T206's. And most of the bad cards we see come from that set. Typically, a fake T206 will have the wrong font, the wrong color lettering (black instead of brown), wrong back color (such as red Piedmonts or Sovereigns), have borders that are too wide, or have a front/back combination that cannot possibly exist. Learning all of this takes time, and nothing is better than to handle as many actual cards as possible. It is always easier to spot a fake or altered card by holding it, not by viewing a scan.

Sometimes the fakes are not as obvious, and much more difficult to detect online. In these cases, often the "tell" is the wording of the description. When you see a really funky looking card, and the seller states his grandfather left it to him when he died, you should always be really suspicious.

And of course you should feel free to ask questions on this board without fear of reprisal.

[ReefBlue]

Originally Posted by D.P.Johnson

I've been on various types of message boards since the late 90's (or whenever it was that Al Gore invented the internet), and I've seen numerous of them "die" when the veteren members stopped helping the "newbies" and/or kept continuously telling them to use the "search" feature. I think that regardless of how many times the "same stupid question" has been asked and answered, the OP (or newbie) should never be "flamed" and/or simply told to use the "search" function. If an veteren member (or ANY member) doesn't feel like answering a question, then don't answer it. It's really as simple as that. However, the elderly members should always try and remember when they were "newbies" and how they would have liked to have been treated when they had questions. We all had to start somewhere...

Just my .02 (but probably worth a lot less).......

Best part about someone going on a rant about using the search feature, is that it takes longer to go into that diatribe than it does to say why the thing isn't real.

If everyone used the search function for everything, that would stop new information from coming in and you'd end up with a wiki site filled up with outdated information.

A very good example happened a week or two ago--the cut sigs of Ruth, Wagner, Young, etc. that were posted--someone said 'i know that forger, but up to now didn't know he started doing these other sigs'.

Also, over time, if people do nothing but use search functions, the original threads lose their meaning--pictures are no longer hosted and provide no information--'go to this link and check out this site' doesn't work either, since that website has long been abandoned.

[drcy]

...

[T206Collector]

One of the reasons that I keep a blog on my website is for me to archive my own long-winded responses to questions or issues that pop up repeatedly. So, when the issue or question comes up again, and I see it, I just copy it from my blog and paste it back into Net54. I have probably re-posted my "Grading Pyramid" comments on here a half dozen times -- usually when someone is perplexed that not all PSA 3s look alike.

For what it's worth, I went through the old Net54 and cataloged as many of the T206 threads as I could find by topic. I put those on my website for people who want to read all of the T206 thoughts of this board circa 2008. For instance, there is a post about the "F" stamp going around this morning. One of the first discussion points for that renewed dialogue is there.

But, I don't think most of the new people who come here are really looking to do any research. For most, you come here and you ask your question hoping to get a quick response. It's easier than Google, because you get a response from a live person, as opposed to a machine-generated list of potentially accurate answers.

I think there are certain explanations that are worth giving over and over again ad nauseum. However, the "is this Wagner real?" question is not one of them. The question explains itself -- if you have to ask, then it is fake. Period. You didn't just win the lottery. You didn't just stumble on to an ebay auction that nobody else saw.

[auggiedoggy]

Originally Posted by thehoodedcoder

this image is hilarious. i have been laughing for the last 10 minutes.

kevin

I come here also for the humour.