T206 Buyers Beware

[Abravefan11]

Several years ago several rebacked (or refronted) T206's hit the mark. The alterations were done well enough to pass the graders and some ended up in numbered holders. What tipped off the collecting community that these cards were frauds was the front/back combinations were impossible. One example was a Mathewson portrait with a red Hindu back. The Mathewson portrait was printed with the first group of subjects in the set and the red Hindu advertisement wasn't used until the 460 series, long after the Matty portrait was discontinued.

It's happening again and interestingly the two examples that have recently come to market are both Mathewson portraits as well.

The first sold on eBay on February 17th. The seller did state in the listing that the card was rebacked. This card was raw and had a Tolstoi back advertisement. This is an impossible front/back combination for this card. The Mathewson portrait was printed with group 1 subjects and the Tolstoi back was not introduced until the printing of group 2 subjects.

eBay Listing



The second recent example sold in the SCP auction that ended on February 29. Again a Mathewson portrait, this time with a Sovereign 460 back advertisement. This is another impossible front/back combo. What makes this card even more troubling is that it is in a TPG authentic holder. The auction listing didn't mention anything about the card being rebacked and stated the following about the authentic grade. "Portions of the black border of the card have been redrawn, resulting in the PSA AUTHENTIC ALTERED rating."

SCP Listing

[CMIZ5290]

Tim, you are right, this is a situation that you can never let your guard down. Another situation is cards being swapped out of psa holders. While i do prefer psa graded t206s over sgc, psa holders are much easier to tamper with. I think a good rule of thumb is to try and buy the card and not the holder....

[teetwoohsix]

Thanks Tim- great info for the collecting community.

Anyone in doubt about front and back combo's can also check your website T206Resource.com
to verify legitimate front/back combo's.

Good lookin' out Tim !!!!

Sincerely, Clayton

[obcmac]

I am just curious if anyone else thinks the fronts might be fake. The coloring and text looks a bit off to me. The one other impossible reback that I've seen also gave me the same impression...but I haven't seen any of them in person.

Mac

[Abravefan11]

Originally Posted by obcmac

I am just curious if anyone else thinks the fronts might be fake. The coloring and text looks a bit off to me. The one other impossible reback that I've seen also gave me the same impression...but I haven't seen any of them in person.

Mac

Mac - We've been talking about this and have the same feelings as you but haven't seen the cards in person either.

[atx840]

Makes me also wonder how easy it would be to flip a back upside down as those now go for 2k+

[Anthony S.]

When I saw that Mathewson Sovereign 460 in the SCP auction it immediately reminded me of a fake T206 Young (bare hand) that I came across late last year. In both cases the black rectangular line just inside the white border seemed just a little bit too thick and almost wavy in parts.

Anyway, I bought the T206 Young in an Ebay auction back in November. The seller mentioned that PSA had returned it as altered (the seller also enclosed the PSA rejection flip) and offered a money back guarantee. I assumed (hoped) that the alteration was merely trimming, which doesn't really bother me. When I received the card I immediately realized that something was "off" about it. The aforementioned black line was the first tip off, but the most telling feature was that when I ran my finger over the surface of the card, the black line was actually raised from the surface. T206s shouldn't have varying altitudes within the same card. In three decades of collecting T206s I'd never encountered that, so I knew it was fake. The EPDG back, however, was real. Major Shenanigans. Here's the card:

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Anthony S.

When I saw that Mathewson Sovereign 460 in the SCP auction it immediately reminded me of a fake T206 Young (bare hand) that I came across late last year. In both cases the black rectangular line just inside the white border seemed just a little bit too thick and almost wavy in parts.

Anyway, I bought the T206 Young in an Ebay auction back in November. The seller mentioned that PSA had returned it as altered (the seller also enclosed the PSA rejection flip) and offered a money back guarantee. I assumed (hoped) that the alteration was merely trimming, which doesn't really bother me. When I received the card I immediately realized that something was "off" about it. The aforementioned black line was the first tip off, but the most telling feature was that when I ran my finger over the surface of the card, the black line was actually raised from the surface. T206s shouldn't have varying altitudes within the same card. In three decades of collecting T206s I'd never encountered that, so I knew it was fake. The EPDG back, however, was real. Major Shenanigans. Here's the card:

Is it possible that they removed only the front image (black box and inward, only) from a real EPDG-backed card, scraped the image off, then glued a real Cy Young image into the hole and 'cleaned up', as opposed to re-backing the card?

[Jaybird]

maybe, but what about the caption?

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Jaybird

maybe, but what about the caption?

Doh! nevermind.

[iggyman]

Perhaps a silly observation but on the Sovereign Mathewson (the PSA graded card), the alignment of the name on the bottom is a little bit off. If you focus on his bottom shirt button, you will see what I mean. Here is the Soverign followed by the Tolstoi card:

mathtest2.JPG

mathtest5.JPG

If you look at the Tolstoi Mathewson, the "W" and "S" more or less align with the bottom button (that is how it should be). But on the Sovereign Mathewson, the "S" aligns with the button. Not sure if it means anything...........all the Mathewson's that I see align just like the raw Tolstoi (consistently with the "W" and "S" under the button).

mathcombo2.jpg



Lovely Day...

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by Runscott

Is it possible that they removed only the front image (black box and inward, only) from a real EPDG-backed card, scraped the image off, then glued a real Cy Young image into the hole and 'cleaned up', as opposed to re-backing the card?

It is virtually impossible to "re-back" a T206 card which will get past a Grading Co. Conversely, you can "shave" the front off a T206 card, and laminate a reproduced front.
A professional paper restorer can accomplish this so that a Grading Co. will not discern that it is a FAKE. This is exactly what was done 12 years ago when we saw Cobb's,
Matty's, etc. with impossible F/B combos.

I posted a Net54 thread on this process 2 years ago titled...." Rebacked T206's....heck NO....perhaps, they are Re-Fronted DRUM, HINDU cards ? "
Here is the Link......
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...ght=re-fronted

I was criticized back then by quite a number of Net54er's, when I claimed that the red Cobb with the red HINDU back was a Re-Fronted fake. Since then, some of my critics
have come around to agreeing with me regarding this particular red Cobb/red HINDU card.

Regarding these two latest fakes, I guess the scammers cannot find anymore tougher backs to "gimmick up"....such as common T206 DRUM's, Red HINDU's, and UZIT cards.

Consider this......the bad news was the LOST commons of DRUM's, red HINDU's, and UZIT cards that were RUINED in the process of these scammers attempts to Re-Front
STAR cards.

The good news (so far) is that these scammers are unfamiliar with the F/B combos of these T206's; therefore, we caught most of these fakes.


T-Rex TED

[Jaybird]

Originally Posted by tedzan

I was criticized back then by quite a number of Net54er's, when I claimed that the red Cobb with the red HINDU back was a Re-Fronted fake. Since then, some of my critics
have come around to agreeing with me regarding this particular red Cobb/red HINDU card.

T-Rex TED

Ted, it's not always about us and them. If you could share your information without pointing out who is/was right and wrong, it might be easier to swallow.

"Critics, detractors, I was right, they've come around" etc. It doesn't make it easy to read and comes off like you have an agenda.

Just my .02 cents.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by tedzan

It is virtually impossible to "re-back" a T206 card which will get past a Grading Co. Conversely, you can "shave" the front off a T206 card, and laminate a reproduced front.
A professional paper restorer can accomplish this so that a Grading Co. will not discern that it is a FAKE. This is exactly what was done 12 years ago when we saw Cobb's,
Matty's, etc. with impossible F/B combos.

.................

T-Rex TED

Thanks Ted - very good information.