Who is the LEAST deserving player in the HOF in the T206 set

[bbcard1]

I thought the most deserving player from the T206 set was a lively and interesting debate. I don't think the T206 set has nearly as many undeserving players (percentage wise) in the HOF than say the Goudey set but there are a few.

My pick would be Chesboro. He did have a 40 win season, but that was more than 20% of his career total wins (less than 200). He did win more than 20 five times, but that was not an uncommon occurrence in those days. His career was relatively short and he had nearly as many losing seasons as winning one.

I know Marquard is a popular pick. but he's certainly not alone. Most of us are older and "deep" baseball fans. We have been influenced by the old "Legends of Baseball" books that presented Elmer Flick as if he were Tony Gwynn.

For you brain staters, here is a list of HOF players in the T206 set.

Home Run Baker
Jake Beckley
Chief Bender
Roger Bresnahan
Mordecai Brown
Frank Chance
Jack Chesbro
Fred Clarke
Ty Cobb
Eddie Collins
Jimmy Collins
Sam Crawford
George Davis
Hugh Duffy
Johnny Evers
Elmer Flick
Clark Griffith
Miller Huggins
Hughie Jennings
Walter Johnson
Addie Joss
Willie Keeler
Joe Kelley
Nap Lajoie
Rube Marquard
Christy Mathewson
Iron Man McGinnity
John McGraw (Portrait With Cap)
Eddie Plank
Tris Speaker
Joe Tinker
Rube Waddell
Honus Wagner
Bobby Wallace
Ed Walsh
Zack Wheat
Vic Willis
Cy Young

[btcarfagno]

Tinker and Evers and Chance would all be on my list of players to exclude.

Tom C

[rats60]

Bresnahan and Marquard, who had an ERA+ of 103. Chesbro at 111 is a poor candidate, but better than Marquard.

[bigtrain]

Marquard, Tinker, Evers.

[mechanicalman]

Based on traditional stats, it seems Bobby Wallace had fairly unremarkable numbers relative to others in the HoF.

[z28jd]

I would think the least deserving would be Addie Joss since he didn't play the minimum of ten seasons. Not that I don't think he was a great pitcher, but they seem to follow the rule for everyone else

[packs]

My vote goes to Tinker. At least Evers has a place in history without the poem. That 1914 season and MVP elevates him in my opinion.

[Topps206]

Marquard.

[GregMitch34]

Yet everyone loves the Tinker cards and they have premium value.

[clydepepper]

Hughie Jennings

[HOF Auto Rookies]

Originally Posted by GregMitch34

Yet everyone loves the Tinker cards and they have premium value.

Cubs fans

[JustinD]

Tinker for sure.

[Orioles1954]

Honus Wagner or Ty Cobb followed by Cy Young.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by bbcard1

I thought the most deserving player from the T206 set was a lively and interesting debate. I don't think the T206 set has nearly as many undeserving players (percentage wise) in the HOF than say the Goudey set but there are a few.

My pick would be Chesboro. He did have a 40 win season, but that was more than 20% of his career total wins (less than 200). He did win more than 20 five times, but that was not an uncommon occurrence in those days. His career was relatively short and he had nearly as many losing seasons as winning one.

I know Marquard is a popular pick. but he's certainly not alone. Most of us are older and "deep" baseball fans. We have been influenced by the old "Legends of Baseball" books that presented Elmer Flick as if he were Tony Gwynn.

For you brain staters, here is a list of HOF players in the T206 set.

Home Run Baker
Jake Beckley
Chief Bender
Roger Bresnahan
Mordecai Brown
Frank Chance
Jack Chesbro
Fred Clarke
Ty Cobb
Eddie Collins
Jimmy Collins
Sam Crawford
George Davis
Hugh Duffy
Johnny Evers
Elmer Flick
Clark Griffith
Miller Huggins
Hughie Jennings
Walter Johnson
Addie Joss
Willie Keeler
Joe Kelley
Nap Lajoie
Rube Marquard
Christy Mathewson
Iron Man McGinnity
John McGraw (Portrait With Cap)
Eddie Plank
Tris Speaker
Joe Tinker
Rube Waddell
Honus Wagner
Bobby Wallace
Ed Walsh
Zack Wheat
Vic Willis
Cy Young

Fair argument, but he also had a 28-6 season. I think any pitcher that wins 40 games in one season should be enshrined, just my thoughts...

[RCMcKenzie]

I'm okay with the whole list being in the HOF, but for the sake of argument, Miller Huggins

[Tao_Moko]

Originally Posted by btcarfagno

Tinker and Evers and Chance would all be on my list of players to exclude.

Tom C

Why I ought a............

I'm a 3rd Gen Cubs fan but can't argue that individual stats don't warrant induction. It's like Forest Griffind and Stephan Bonner in the UFC. Their one fight elevated the entire sport and they were thanked by induction into the UFC hof. I believe the same goes for the Chicago team of their era. They provided headlines that extended beyond the diehard fans and obtained popular media recognition. They were later rewarded in the only way left to do so.

[Topps206]

I'm a diehard Cubs fan myself, and the only one I'd put in would be Chance. Tinker and Evers, especially Tinker, are mistakes.

[Joshchisox08]

Originally Posted by mechanicalman

Based on traditional stats, it seems Bobby Wallace had fairly unremarkable numbers relative to others in the HoF.

Yet he still has better numbers than the Cub trio.

[bravos4evr]

Originally Posted by RCMcKenzie

I'm okay with the whole list being in the HOF, but for the sake of argument, Miller Huggins

Huggins is in more for managing than playing.


I think it's Rube Marquard by a fair margin. He was an avg pitcher,

[bbcard1]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Fair argument, but he also had a 28-6 season. I think any pitcher that wins 40 games in one season should be enshrined, just my thoughts...

I am not saying that is an invalid argument, but if you make that one, you would certainly have to say that any hitter who hit 61 home runs one season and won an MVP another should certainly be a hall of famer....

[bravos4evr]

Originally Posted by bbcard1

I am not saying that is an invalid argument, but if you make that one, you would certainly have to say that any hitter who hit 61 home runs one season and won an MVP another should certainly be a hall of famer....

indeed, one great year doth not a HOF career make, nor two or three. It takes a body of work that puts one in the upper echelon of all players in the history of the game.

[glynparson]

I am a former history major so I do not mind using the hall of fame to tell the games history. Therefore inducting players for a variety of reasons. I have no problem with any that are in and not to speak for Kevin but (to answer the previous post) I for one don't think the hall would be diminished one iota if Maris were left in.

[Beatles Guy]

Tinker and Marquard.

[bravos4evr]

Originally Posted by glynparson

I am a former history major so I do not mind using the hall of fame to tell the games history. Therefore inducting players for a variety of reasons. I have no problem with any that are in and not to speak for Kevin but (to answer the previous post) I for one don't think the hall would be diminished one iota if Maris were left in.

not tryin to start an argument, but guys like Maris who had a big impact on the history of the game (even though they didn't have HOF careers) ARE at the Hall. Their accomplishments are listed, game used stuff is there, so their contributions are noted. There's a lot of people who's impact in the game are credited at the HOF even tho they weren't career HOF players.

[Topps206]

Roger Maris

Won two MVP awards.

Hit 61 home runs in one season.

That's all. Literally nothing else qualifies him for Cooperstown.

[bbcard1]

Originally Posted by Topps206

Roger Maris

Won two MVP awards.

Hit 61 home runs in one season.

That's all. Literally nothing else qualifies him for Cooperstown.

7 X All Star

3 x world champion

Was good enough the last year of his career to start on a world championship team.

It's not an injustice he's not in, but it's not equitable in comparison with some people who are.

[packs]

He should be in for his contributions to baseball, same as Curt Flood. The career statistics are secondary.

[bbcard1]

Originally Posted by packs

He should be in for his contributions to baseball, same as Curt Flood. The career statistics are secondary.

My dark horse candidate under the "contributions to baseball: banner is Bill White, though his rather forgettable name will hurt him.

[packs]

Barney Dreyfuss is in for his contributions to baseball, but even though his contributions were major in terms of parks and the World Series, no one knows his name. I would say Maris and Flood's contributions to the modern game will always be remembered, along with their names.

[MVSNYC]

I'm taking a slightly different approach. I pulled out the names and created tiers. I did not rank within a tier, the names are random in each tier...I guess I was left with a lot of names towards the bottom, but it's hard to say from there who shouldn't be a HOFer...This isn't anything super scientific, and I did not refer to any websites or their statistics as I did these lists...just pure gut of 25 years of collecting T206, and learning about the players during that time.


Ty Cobb
Honus Wagner
Christy Mathewson
Walter Johnson
Cy Young


Tris Speaker
Nap Lajoie
Eddie Plank
John McGraw (Managerial)
Willie Keeler
Eddie Collins


Hugh Duffy
Rube Waddell
Zack Wheat
Mordecai Brown
Addie Joss
Sam Crawford


Rube Marquard
Iron Man McGinnity
Home Run Baker
Ed Walsh
Vic Willis
Frank Chance
Jack Chesbro
Chief Bender


Jake Beckley
Roger Bresnahan
Fred Clarke
Jimmy Collins
George Davis
Johnny Evers
Elmer Flick
Clark Griffith
Miller Huggins
Hughie Jennings
Joe Kelley
Joe Tinker
Bobby Wallace

[Joshchisox08]

Originally Posted by Topps206

Roger Maris

Won two MVP awards.

Hit 61 home runs in one season.

That's all. Literally nothing else qualifies him for Cooperstown.

Ahh you forgot to add that he played for one of the "Golden" teams:

Yankees
Red Sox

[PolarBear]

Originally Posted by btcarfagno

Tinker and Evers and Chance would all be on my list of players to exclude.

Tom C