Sad but true - collecting addiction

[raulus]

Just read this story, which I guess highlights some of the perils of getting a little too addicted when it comes to our chosen hobby:

Ex-federal investigator lost job after baseball-card addiction led him to moonlight as Amazon and Uber driver

Sean Nelson’s collecting led him to financial ruin and almost blew up his marriage; now he has been sentenced for using his government car for sideline gigs.

It’s a cautionary tale for anyone whose collecting habit has maybe gotten a bit out of hand.

A former federal agent blew up his career after getting caught using his government car to moonlight as an Amazon and Uber driver to help sustain his baseball-card addiction.

Sean M. Nelson, 44, of Mesa, Ariz., was sentenced this week to two years probation and ordered to pay back $134,000 the government argued he had misappropriated by working his sideline gigs while on the job.

Nelson had been a special agent for the Department of Homeland Security for more than a decade in Arizona when his finances and marriage began falling into ruin due to his out-of-control habit of buying baseball cards, court documents said.

Psychologists classify uncontrollable collecting as a type of behavioral addiction, similar to compulsive gambling, eating, video game playing, shopping or sex addiction. An addiction to collecting could manifest itself in the buying of anything from fine art to model trains.

Starting in 2019, Nelson began working on the side delivering packages for Amazon and driving passengers for services like Uber and Lyft to help pay off his spiraling credit card debts, the documents said.

The financial strain from his collecting habit put heavy pressure on his marriage and led him and his wife to attend couple’s counseling, the records showed.

Federal prosecutors say that over the next two years, Nelson, a father of four, regularly worked his other jobs while he was on the clock as an investigator, during which time he frequently used his government-issued car to deliver packages and ferry ride-share passengers. He also had the government pay for the gas.

He was charged in October and pleaded guilty right away to a charge of theft of government property, court records show. As part of his plea, Nelson agreed to resign from his post.

“As a result of the conviction, Mr. Nelson has forfeited much of his salary during the time period of his on-the-job criminal activity, and as a federal felon he’ll never lawfully possess or use a firearm ever again,” said Gary Restaino, the U.S. attorney for Arizona. “His dereliction of duty was a grave disservice to his hard-working law enforcement colleagues and the taxpayers alike.”

Before joining the Department of Homeland Security in 2010, Nelson had previously worked as a federal air marshal, a federal and Arizona prison guard and had served in the Air Force, during which he spent time in Iraq.

“No one knew the hobby of collecting would turn into an addiction,” his mother wrote in a letter to the judge. “He is willing to pay the fine and has the support of all of his family. He has already lost his job and his pension… . Please do not punish him any more.”

A message left with Nelson’s attorney wasn’t immediately returned.

[ullmandds]

it's only cardboard for crying out loud!!!

[Leon]

That takes it to a new level.
.

[ncinin]

There are some screwed up people in the world.

I have two different show customers literally tell me that if it wasn't for cards they would have nothing to live for. Another told a friend of mine if he couldn't go to shows he would rather die.

Some people have problems.

[Johnny630]

For as much as you may love the cards the cards don't know you own them.

[brian1961]

I understand. I've been a collector most of my life. For me, without God's help, it can turn into a compulsion. The mind can always seem to find a "logical" reason to pursue a collectible that has struck your fancy. If left unchecked, the mind will create an illusion that the said collectible must not be lost to another! You can get so worked up about it, and believe your collection would be so inferior without buying the object.

The insidious part is that ONCE YOU BUY IT, the feelings of elation almost immediately vaporize, and you're left with an unspeakable emptiness. The cure, so to speak?

Begin looking for something else.

As I said, I understand, but with that, as Leon Luckey aptly surmised, "That takes it to a new level." I'm sure it has hit him as a ton of bricks what he has lost. Hopefully, his family will forgive him and stand with him. Yes, he needs to get some counseling. However, right now he has to pay back a lot of money, and find a job unlike what he was doing. At 44, this will not be easy.

He'll probably need to sell some of the things he collected, but with what's happened to him, he may not want to look at them any more, or at least not for a long time.

This is a sad case, and one in which we should all look at closely, AS WELL AS LOOK AT OURSELVES. I know I sure am.

I will qualify one thing. There are many things I've purchased / won at auction for which my elation lasted long after I got the item in the mail. If one of those things comes to mind, I get all excited again. THAT'S WHEN i KNOW I REALLY WANTED THE ITEM IN A POWERFUL WAY, AND HAVE NO REGRETS. You just gotta be sure before you buy or fight for an item in an auction. Nevertheless, again, this is a very sad case, and illustrates in a horrifying way what can happen if you allow your possessions, or "gotta have it desirables", possess you. --- Brian Powell

[Smarti5051]

I love that this guy's life is ruined because he used the "company car" to make some Amazon deliveries while "on the clock." Ostensibly, he was otherwise doing a satisfactory job during his tenure or he would have been fired. Meanwhile, there are guys blatantly stealing from cars and stores in California with ZERO risk of consequences, and online fraudsters that are stealing millions from citizens with ZERO consequences. We don't have the resources to deal with those wrongdoers. But prosecuting a moonlighter with a shopping addiction is a public necessity.

This guy's actions are probably no different than about a million other US employees. If any other employer had discovered their employee was engaging in the same conduct, he would just be let go or given a written warning. But this guy, because it is a federal job, has his life ruined. Seems like an overreach to me. Termination plus an agreement not to seek further government employment seems like a more appropriate punishment.

[Snapolit1]

I always used to read about women with shopping addictions who had closets full of 100s of pairs of expensive shoes and outfits they had to buy yet have never worn once. I think collecting cards can easily lapse for some people into that.

The dopamine rush of the chase and the "win" [such an odd term for agreeing to pay more for something than anyone else; a "win"; does anyone say I "won" this new house?]

We used to have people on the board, quite a few of them in fact, waxing poetic about the smell of a certain catalog arriving at their front door. And the feeling of hearing it hit the ground on their steps. Yes, there are signs of addiction/compulsive behavior all over this board, whether people want to acknowledge it or not.

Many of us have had the feeling of something arriving at the house and (a) having no recollection with it is and then (b) opening it and wondering why in the world. . . .

[bnorth]

I will say I have had a problem before. Back when those darn serial numbered and different shiny cards came out I HAD to have them all. Seriously I would spend hours everyday trying to track down ALL the Wade Boggs versions.

Luckily for me I realized how beyond crazy it was. I then sold all them and never looked back. Now if I see one super cheap I will buy it but no more having to have anything.

There are at least 2 members on here with a serious problem. I told both to never even consider buying from me again. I don't mind waiting for a payment once in a while but when it takes several days to weeks with every purchase there is a problem.

[BobbyStrawberry]

Addiction is a disease, whether it's heroin, gambling or baseball cards. Obviously this guy made some huge mistakes, but I'm not without compassion for him.

[brianp-beme]

You know you are in too deep when it gets to this level of bottom of the barrel collecting. I might just have to start moonlighting as a federal investigator.

Brian

[Northviewcats]

I think Brian really nailed it when he described the problem with all addictions when he wrote:

"The mind can always seem to find a "logical" reason to pursue a collectible [or any desire for that matter] that has struck your fancy. If left unchecked, the mind will create an illusion that the said collectible must not be lost to another! You can get so worked up about it,and believe your collection would be so inferior without buying the object. The insidious part is that ONCE YOU BUY IT, the feelings of elation almost immediately vaporize, and you're left with an unspeakable emptiness."

Brian's words remind me so much of a family member, who is addicted to gambling. The guilt, the lies, the loss, the frustration. It is so painful to see him struggle after he has fallen back into his addiction.

I agree that if you start to feel that deep feeling of regret after making purchases, that it is a good sign to question whether or not you are addicted to the hobby.

I hope that no one here is struggling with it.

Best regards,

Joe

[Johnny630]

Hopefully the New Card Raffle Set Break thing is just a fad and not commonplace.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Smarti5051

there are guys blatantly stealing from cars and stores in California with ZERO risk of consequences, and online fraudsters that are stealing millions from citizens with ZERO consequences.

Not true, at least in LA. The LAPD and LASD have been doing a great job running down these gangs of store busters. There have been a ton of arrests of the raiders and the fences buying the stolen merchandise.

Originally Posted by Johnny630

Hopefully the New Card Raffle Set Break thing is just a fad and not commonplace.

One of the things I find most concerning about modern card breaks and some of the forms of sale on platforms like whatnot is that they are indistinguishable from casino games. I've seen whatnot sellers use gambling devices to award prizes, and all of the random slot assignment programs that breakers use are indistinguishable from slot machines, which are just random number generators with bells and whistles.

[Huck]

Some might consider Net54 to be a gateway drug. When I am on the site there are cool cards I didn't even know existed (ex. Leon's E221 PCL Team cards). There are an array of collecting niches (ex. pennants) in the hobby that collectors here pursue, but could be an endless rabbithole for some.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by Johnny630

Hopefully the New Card Raffle Set Break thing is just a fad and not commonplace.

Gambling has never been a fad. If there's any kind of a pay off possible it will always be a thing.

Never fails, every time I go into a gas station and go inside to pay, to use up some of the cash in my pocket, I'm stuck for 5 to 10 minutes in line, waiting for somebody ahead of me to pick out a stack of scratch off tickets, having the clerk scan another stack of tickets, while also feverishly scratching off another stack of tickets.

[nolemmings]

Originally Posted by BobbyStrawberry

Addiction is a disease, whether it's heroin, gambling or baseball cards. Obviously this guy made some huge mistakes, but I'm not without compassion for him.

Well said.

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Gambling has never been a fad. If there's any kind of a pay off possible it will always be a thing.

Never fails, every time I go into a gas station and go inside to pay, to use up some of the cash in my pocket, I'm stuck for 5 to 10 minutes in line, waiting for somebody ahead of me to pick out a stack of scratch off tickets, having the clerk scan another stack of tickets, while also feverishly scratching off another stack of tickets.

It’s worrisome....

[jingram058]

Originally Posted by brianp-beme

You know you are in too deep when it gets to this level of bottom of the barrel collecting. I might just have to start moonlighting as a federal investigator.

Brian

I'm there, and happy to be!

[edhans]

The story may have had a happier ending if he was buying pre war material. But I suspect it was modern crap.

[Seven]

I find many people have addictive personalities. I think we all have our fair share of vices. I enjoy the occasional Cigar and Scotch, A nice glass of Red, and occasionally dabble with the horses. I think the key is knowing your limits.

I had noticed that around the holidays, I was partaking in the occasional scotch, much more frequently, as a result I stopped drinking all together in the New Year. I'm reserving it for special occasions. I do have to say, on that end, I feel notably better.

Concerning cardboard, I will admit, I enjoy the chase just as much as I enjoy getting the card in hand. I love what this hobby has to offer, the people that I met through it have definitely left an impression. That being said, I'm not driving myself into debt, trying to get the next card.

Moderation, is key, with everything in life. This person, clearly has a problem, and it's unfortunate that it spiraled out of control.

[Yoda]

Yes, he was wrong and he is paying the price, but the rabid collector, still raging inside me, can understand the logic: A few gallons of gov't gas and I can get that PSA9 Greg Maddox RC that I simply cannot live without. It's a bad place to be.

[byrone]

The sports collecting hobby, or any hobby really, can be an attraction to people with tendencies towards addiction.

I know many sports collectors who are alcoholics in recovery.

It seems the thrills of the hobby can be somewhat of a replacement or placeholder for the addiction stimulation

Sorry Baseball Cards is like Alcohol " One is not enough, but One is to many"

[G1911]

I mean, I’d rather my tax dollars pay for this dudes gas at his side hustle than most things they spend my tax dollars on. Federal felonies and termination of his constitutional liberties seems awfully harsh.

He should have not done the Uber and just emptied his 401K and taken some loans to afford more cards.

[Eric72]

I realize there would be no way to accurately calculate this.

There are a certainly a nonzero number of people within our hobby for whom sports cards have become an addiction. I wonder what percentage of these people are primarily addicted to the random chance element of breaking open wax. Whether one does this personally or uses a "breaker" to open the wrappers, the end result is the same.

Pay X dollars, get Y random cards. In this respect, breaking is really no different than gambling.

[rjackson44]

Never buy anything with money you dont have,always with money you have ,,my dad

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Huck

Some might consider Net54 to be a gateway drug. When I am on the site there are cool cards I didn't even know existed (ex. Leon's E221 PCL Team cards). There are an array of collecting niches (ex. pennants) in the hobby that collectors here pursue, but could be an endless rabbithole for some.

Me too. There's always something new. Recently for me, Sweet Caporal pins.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by rjackson44

Never buy anything with money you dont have,always with money you have ,,my dad

SNL to the rescue:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3ZJKN_5M44

[sreader3]

I would like to know more about the facts.

If the alleged “crime” is limited to an Uber driver’s use of a federally funded vehicle then this prosecution seems like a gross misallocation of federal resources i.e. waste of taxpayer money compared to the violence and theft that is excused these days. At least this guy was providing a service.

[5-Tool Player]

Originally Posted by Leon

That takes it to a new level.
.

+1

[raulus]

Originally Posted by sreader3

I would like to know more about the facts.

If the alleged “crime” is limited to an Uber driver’s use of a federally funded vehicle then this prosecution seems like a gross misallocation of federal resources i.e. waste of taxpayer money compared to the violence and theft that is excused these days. At least this guy was providing a service.

If any of the lawyers know how to look up a case, there is some detail here that identifies the case number:

https://www.justice.gov/usao-az/pr/f...d-theft-agency

I'm guessing there must be a list of allegations identifying a lot more detail about his misdeeds.

[sreader3]

Originally Posted by raulus

If any of the lawyers know how to look up a case, there is some detail here that identifies the case number:

https://www.justice.gov/usao-az/pr/f...d-theft-agency

I'm guessing there must be a list of allegations identifying a lot more detail about his misdeeds.

Yeah, I read it. He worked a side gig for Amazon, Uber and Lyft with his government car. Certainly not admirable but a minor offense compared to what is not prosecuted these days in major cities. At least he was providing a service. Not a typical hobby fraudster.

[Casey2296]

Originally Posted by sreader3

Yeah, I read it. He worked a side gig for Amazon, Uber and Lyft with his government car. Certainly not admirable but a minor offense compared to what is not prosecuted these days in major cities. At least he was providing a service. Not a typical hobby fraudster.

As someone who served our country he gets slack from me.

Can we go after the unproductive, under qualified, redundant, government employees that hide in their cubicles and collect a paycheck with full retirement instead?

Or let's look at Congressional shysters from both sides of the aisle that get rich on insider legislation information in the stock market. Can we toss a few of those in jail?

Don't get me started...

[bbcard1]

I had it happen to a friend of mine. He was a banker, good guy. I sold him cards at my shop and when I started my ad agency my partner needed the cash to fund his half of the seed money. It was like $5000 and all the banks wouldn't do it because my partner's credit really was in the toilet. My friend said, it's not that much, I know you, I can make the loan. He got addicted to busting wax. Lost his job and family and ended up in jail. Last time I saw him he was working at Lowes...nothing wrong with working at Lowes, but he was on track to a good career before wax busting got its hooks in him.

[Huck]

According to the article, he started small using the government car for side gigs; as time went on, working the side gigs became a full-time job while collecting a government paycheck. Small potatoes perhaps, but he was not doing his job. He only hurt himself and the taxpayers.

"Federal prosecutors say that over the next two years, Nelson, a father of four, regularly worked his other jobs while he was on the clock as an investigator, during which time he frequently used his government-issued car to deliver packages and ferry ride-share passengers. He also had the government pay for the gas."

[Gorditadogg]

Originally Posted by Casey2296

As someone who served our country he gets slack from me.



Can we go after the unproductive, under qualified, redundant, government employees that hide in their cubicles and collect a paycheck with full retirement instead?



Or let's look at Congressional shysters from both sides of the aisle that get rich on insider legislation information in the stock market. Can we toss a few of those in jail?



Don't get me started...

I heard an interesting factoid the other day. The summary is that for any company, the number of people actually doing the work is the square root of the total number of employees. So if you've got 10 people in the office, 3 do all the work. If you have 1000, then 30 do all the work. The rest just collect their paychecks.

Based on the companies I worked for, I would say that's about right.

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[Casey2296]

Originally Posted by Gorditadogg

I heard an interesting factoid the other day. The summary is that for any company, the number of people actually doing the work is the square root of the total number of employees. So if you've got 10 people in the office, 3 do all the work. If you have 1000, then 30 do all the work. The rest just collect their paychecks.

Based on the companies I worked for, I would say that's about right.

Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk

Also known as the Pareto Principle.

[rjackson44]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Me too. There's always something new. Recently for me, Sweet Caporal pins.

Pretty adam

[nolemmings]

Originally Posted by sreader3

I would like to know more about the facts.

If the alleged “crime” is limited to an Uber driver’s use of a federally funded vehicle then this prosecution seems like a gross misallocation of federal resources i.e. waste of taxpayer money compared to the violence and theft that is excused these days. At least this guy was providing a service.

According to the link, the guy was doing his side-gigs on the government clock. That's about as obvious a no-no as it gets. Not really moonlighting as suggested in the OP--at least as I understand the term. Doesn't help that he was supposed to be working a job protecting our homeland security--not a good optic.

Between November 2019 and October 2021, Nelson, then a Special Agent with HSI, worked without permission or authorization for several private companies while on duty for HSI, and used his government owned vehicle (GOV) for such unauthorized outside work. Nelson drove the GOV, that he agreed to use only for HSI duty purposes, while working for Amazon, Uber, and Lyft during time periods he was supposed to be working for HSI. Nelson’s actions in working for these companies while on duty for HSI resulted in tens of thousands of dollars in losses to the government.

Seems almost certain he was caught up in the modern card frenzy and pack/box busting. Just buying specific cards shouldn't be the financial end of you, as I assume you could sell off when you need money and at least recoup the bulk of your purchase, unless you're a horrible speculator who always grossly overpays. More likely he bought his "spots" for those Brady, Luca and other rookie shiny 1 of 1s or whatever passes for scarce gotta haves these days, and always came up empty. Or he bought pallets of unopened material in search for these same chase cards and ended up with tens of thousands of worthless cards akin to the 1988 Donruss junk wax.

[Gorditadogg]

Originally Posted by Casey2296

Also known as the Pareto Principle.

An offshoot, I guess. The Pareto Principle is basically the 80/20 rule, which is also true I think. For every company I worked for (except maybe Burger King, I didn't keep track back then) 80% of our revenues came from 20% of our clients.

The Pareto Rule applies outside of work too. Probably your top 20% of cards make up 80% of the value of your collection.

By the way, to be more precise on the square-root rule, the top few do HALF the work, not all. So in my example of a 1000 person company, the top 30 would do half the total work, the 970 would do the other half. So not freeloaders, just not as valuable.

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[SyrNy1960]

I had no issues with getting out of control with collecting until the start of the insert era. I remember as they started making and inserting different versions of cards (gold, silver, bronze), then serial numbered cards, then autographed cards, and then those shiny refractor cards, etc., I found myself wanting to get each of everything. Before that, cards were basic and cheaper. It was easy to get caught up into it, as the products were getting so much nicer and rarer. The worst thing I did was to start using my credit card more than I should have. It never got way out of control, but I realized it was just too much. At that point, I stopped collecting cards and moved to game used memorabilia. It really isn't that difficult to get sucked in (I was 33 at the time). Not everyone has the right mindset and control to recognize when to say enough is enough. I'm just glad I did.

[Gorditadogg]

Yes, addiction can have serious consequences, and we shouldn't make light of it. People on this thread have spoken eloquently about the effects of card-buying addiction.

It's a shame it happened to that guy, but it is not that surprising it did.

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[jingram058]

Originally Posted by Casey2296

As someone who served our country he gets slack from me.

Can we go after the unproductive, under qualified, redundant, government employees that hide in their cubicles and collect a paycheck with full retirement instead?

Or let's look at Congressional shysters from both sides of the aisle that get rich on insider legislation information in the stock market. Can we toss a few of those in jail?

Don't get me started...

+1 on everything you say.

[Topnotchsy]

Originally Posted by gorditadogg

yes, addiction can have serious consequences, and we shouldn't make light of it. People on this thread have spoken eloquently about the effects of card-buying addiction.

It's a shame it happened to that guy, but it is not that surprising it did.

Sent from my sm-s906u using tapatalk

100%

[RichMcGillicuddy]

"and as a federal felon he’ll never lawfully possess or use a firearm ever again" should have read
"and as a federal felon, he’ll never lawfully possess a baseball card ever again"

[BobbyStrawberry]

Originally Posted by RichMcGillicuddy

"and as a federal felon he’ll never lawfully possess or use a firearm ever again" should have read
"and as a federal felon, he’ll never lawfully possess a baseball card ever again"

That part struck me as an odd flex. Plenty of people shouldn't own guns, but I don't think is guy is the type that people are concerned about.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by BobbyStrawberry

That part struck me as an odd flex. Plenty of people shouldn't own guns, but I don't think is guy is the type that people are concerned about.

Just some added LOOK AT ME they threw in there as all felons have their gun rights taken away. Some can later get them back.

[Eric72]

From Homeland Security to federal felon. Quite the fall from grace.

[mq711]

He misused $134,000 in taxpayer money and some people want to justify or excuse that behavior, I just don’t get it.