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  #1  
Old 05-17-2012, 11:32 PM
marcdelpercio marcdelpercio is offline
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Default E90-1 Dots Miller "sunset" variation

I just picked up a lot of E90-1's and noticed that the Miller card has an unusual variation that I haven't seen before. As you can see in the scan, the card on the right has a red "sunset" pattern that is completely missing from the card on the left. What is strange is that the red print extends well onto his uniform and glove so, if it is intentional, it is some pretty sloppy artwork. The colors throughout the rest of the card are identical on both.

I did a quick search and was able to find only one other "sunset" example. It is identical to my card which would suggest that mine is not just a print freak or anything like that. All the rest I found (25+ other examples) had no red whatsoever, so it would appear, from my brief search at least, that the "sunset" variation is much less common. This also seems strange as, if it was just the case of a missing color pass, I'd think that the correctly colored version would be much more common.

Just wondering if anybody else had noticed this or had other examples or thoughts to share.
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  #2  
Old 05-17-2012, 11:49 PM
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It looks to me like you've got a legit variation here. At first I just thought it was a smudge from a red marker or something but if you do a google search for "e90-1 Dots Miller" and then click on the "Images" link, you see a bunch of pictures of the card. I noted several pictured with this variation.

Also, you do that same search for the e92 or e102 Miller, oddly enough, I couldn't find ANY that DIDN'T have the red blotch.

Nice detective work!
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Old 05-17-2012, 11:51 PM
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Default correlation?

Not sure if there is any correlation but my Cocoa, Red Candy and blank back all have the sunset....



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Old 05-18-2012, 12:22 AM
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Interesting Marc. I hadn't noticed that before. Nice pickup!

Rob
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  #5  
Old 05-18-2012, 04:36 AM
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Interesting that all of Leon's have the blue shadow. Neither of Marc's do.
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  #6  
Old 05-18-2012, 06:29 AM
x2drich2000 x2drich2000 is online now
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Very cool observation. If you look closely at both of Leon's Crofts, it is slightly red extending above the glove as well. However, neither Leon's blank back or Marc's appears to have any red shading above the glove. Here's my Nadja that clearly has red shading above the glove arm. I know this card exists in a number of other sets. Does anyone have any of the other sets that they could show other than E92 or E90-1? By the way, does anyone have a list of all the sets this card appears in along with a comparison of the difficulty for each?



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  #7  
Old 05-18-2012, 08:26 AM
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Interesting observtion...I have never noticed! I collect this pose in as many sets as I can. E102 is definitely one of the toughest...if not...The toughest next to e92 red croft or maybe the mino...in my opinion. I was the underbidder on the red crofts in REA...Baaaahhhhh!!!!!

I have 2 of the e90-1's...both sans sunset!!!

For some reason my scans won't upload?

I have e90-1(2) both no sunset
e92 crofts candy(blk), cocoa
e101
e102
e106
t216 mino

I'm missing e92 red crofts, blue crofts, blank, nadja, t216 kotton, VE?

Last edited by ullmandds; 05-18-2012 at 08:32 AM.
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  #8  
Old 05-18-2012, 10:16 PM
marcdelpercio marcdelpercio is offline
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Thanks for all the responses and scans. So, at this point, it appears that only the sunset version appears on all non-e90-1 cards of this pose. Does anybody have a non-E90-1 that does NOT have the sunset?

Also, the sunset version appears to be much LESS common on the E90-1's.

Very interesting observation on the blue shadow also. I hadn't noticed that before.
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  #9  
Old 05-18-2012, 10:30 PM
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Hey Leon, With all the different sets using the same pose how did SGC know your blank back was an E92?

Lee
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  #10  
Old 05-18-2012, 10:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bowlingshoegiverouterguy View Post
Hey Leon, With all the different sets using the same pose how did SGC know your blank back was an E92?

Lee
Unless there is something I don't know they should have labeled it E90-1, imo.

I try to use the lowest common denominator on blank backs. Otherwise, I don't know what they were thinking.
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  #11  
Old 05-19-2012, 12:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon View Post
Unless there is something I don't know they should have labeled it E90-1, imo.

I try to use the lowest common denominator on blank backs. Otherwise, I don't know what they were thinking.
E90's don't have the blue shadow behind him, e92's do, as does Leon's blank back
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  #12  
Old 05-20-2012, 05:44 PM
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Default It's Miller time

Great spotting Marc...it is always neat when unnoticed variations like these pop up, and always surprising they haven't been noted before. My E90-1 Miller has no sunset/shadow, while my E101 has both.

Brian
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  #13  
Old 05-22-2012, 08:13 AM
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Also, his feet are much bigger on the E90-1 as compared to the other cards.
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  #14  
Old 05-22-2012, 11:24 AM
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That is a nice catch, there are also mountains in the E90, so that eliminates them but the other issues are all possibilities.

Lee
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  #15  
Old 05-23-2012, 11:56 AM
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Also looks like the E 90-1 shoes are white/grey while the others are shaded brown.

Thanks to the OP for bringing attention to the variation(s) in this pose.
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  #16  
Old 05-30-2012, 09:09 AM
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Interesting...the huggins and scott auction has a lot of misc prewar that contains a rare red keeler portrait e90-1 as well as 3 Miller fielding e90-1 cards...all with sunsets. Perhaps the millers w/sunsets were a later run?
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  #17  
Old 05-31-2012, 10:47 AM
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This thread made me realize how nice looking this card is so I just picked one up.
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  #18  
Old 05-31-2012, 08:34 PM
marcdelpercio marcdelpercio is offline
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Peter,
That's an interesting point and would be a good explanation as to why it seems the sunset variation of the E90-1 is a lot less prevalent. I have been searching quite a bit and have only found scans of three of them with the sunset that I was able to confirm as E90-1's. On the other hand, I've noted 50+ of the non-sunset version.

That may also be a clue as to the timing of the printing of the other sets which contain this pose and apparently ALL feature only the sunset version.
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  #19  
Old 05-31-2012, 09:02 PM
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Default here are mine

my millers:
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  #20  
Old 05-31-2012, 09:32 PM
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My e105 miller has the sunset also.
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  #21  
Old 05-31-2012, 09:44 PM
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mmmn...I need an e105 miller...wanna deal?
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  #22  
Old 05-31-2012, 10:56 PM
marcdelpercio marcdelpercio is offline
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Peter,
Great collection of Millers! When they are laid out like that, it's hard not to conclude that the E90-1 is entirely different artwork altogether. There are so many variances, with the lack of sunset, blue shadow, mountains in the background, different colored cap, shoes, glove, etc. All other sets seem to be pretty much identical in these aspects.
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Old 05-23-2013, 10:18 AM
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I'll post a pic of the whole thing later, but this just came today, the pic used for all these cards. It's a page from the Newark Evening News, welcoming home Miller with a huge story...It's a full page, just can't get a pic now
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  #24  
Old 05-23-2013, 10:52 AM
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Nice!!!!
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  #25  
Old 05-23-2013, 10:53 AM
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Default Miller photo

Great find on the Miller photo. It has always looked like a 3-D card to me.
.....................
Peter, RE: E105 Miller

I used to have the e105 Miller fielding and sold it here.

http://www.legendaryauctions.com/Lot...entoryid=13852

I think Daniels may know where the card went at the time
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  #26  
Old 05-23-2013, 10:56 AM
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that darn e105 miller fielding will be a toughie!!!!!!! I'm unsure if an e92 nadja exists also...but I think it does!!!!
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  #27  
Old 05-23-2013, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by z28jd View Post
I'll post a pic of the whole thing later, but this just came today, the pic used for all these cards. It's a page from the Newark Evening News, welcoming home Miller with a huge story...It's a full page, just can't get a pic now
Great pic and surely where Dots' photo came from for his cards. But this begs the question, who the heck ended up drawing his massive glove on his cards? The one in the newspaper is rather small.
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Old 05-23-2013, 07:04 PM
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Peter, the e92 Nadja exists



Dj
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E92 Nadja - Bescher, Bridwell, Cobb, Donovan, Doolan, Doyle (with bat), , Kleinow, Lobert, Mathewson, Miller (fielding), Tinker, Wagner (throwing), Zimmerman
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  #29  
Old 05-23-2013, 07:15 PM
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I thought the cool thing is that the shadow is in the pic, just like on almost all the cards

Couldn't get a good pic, digital camera needs to be charged. I did take this crappy pic though just so you could get an idea of the size of the whole thing. Great article to go along with it too
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  #30  
Old 05-23-2013, 07:15 PM
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Dj...nice...if you ever want to part with him...im your man!
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  #31  
Old 05-23-2013, 10:46 PM
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Here is my E90-1. Sunset poorly registered bleeding onto uniform. No shadow.
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